[newToAudio100]

Around -10 to 0 it should already be hearing loss territory. You shouldn't have to reach 0 imo.

As in hearing loss over years of exposure, or so loud you want to throw the headphones off?

Right now for me -30db is much quieter than normal speaking volume, -22db to -20db is speaking volume in a small room, and -10db is louder than I would normally listen but it's not scary loud at all. It's about 65% as loud as a movie theater gets.

Is this normal?

 

[Aquileolus]

I just got the bliss in. I have it set to low impedence. Pc -> yggdrasil og a2 -> xlr -> holo bliss -> xlr out to Susvara. I've read people saying at -30db it's very loud. However for me it is extremely quiet like whispering.

I checked my pc settings and I have nothing limiting the volume. I tried another amp connected to the yggdrasil and it's good to go. Can someone help me figure out what I'm doing wrong with the bliss?

I'm using HMS -> TT2 (Dac mode) -> Bliss Lo-z, and I find myself always using -10 ~ -8 when driving Susvara, -22 when driving Atrium with Hi-z though

 

[newToAudio100]

I'm using HMS -> TT2 (Dac mode) -> Bliss Lo-z, and I find myself always using -10 ~ -8 when driving Susvara, -22 when driving Atrium with Hi-z though

Ok this seems more inline with what I'm experiencing. I just thought I read or heard of a lot of people listening <-30db but I might be incorrect.

 

[genefruit]

As in hearing loss over years of exposure, or so loud you want to throw the headphones off?

Right now for me -30db is much quieter than normal speaking volume, -22db to -20db is speaking volume in a small room, and -10db is louder than I would normally listen but it's not scary loud at all. It's about 65% as loud as a movie theater gets.

Is this normal?

based on some quick looking around, with a 4v input and no EQ or other manipulations of the signal, you should be around 93db peaks (0dbfs) at 0 with the Susvara. So -10 = 83 peak.

 

[krude]

As in hearing loss over years of exposure, or so loud you want to throw the headphones off?

Right now for me -30db is much quieter than normal speaking volume, -22db to -20db is speaking volume in a small room, and -10db is louder than I would normally listen but it's not scary loud at all. It's about 65% as loud as a movie theater gets.

Is this normal?

Hearing loss I mean hearing damage from listening too loud. I was usually hanging around -10 for louder sessions with the Sus.

We all hear differently mind you, but I think the consesnsus is -10 is roughly where most people sit with the Sus and -15 with the TC.

 

[orrman]

I'm on low Z at -35 with Utopia (comfortable levels, could go a little higher and a little lower depending on what I feel like) so I'd be very surprised if Susvara is close to that considering how sensitive Utopia is compared to Sus

 

[gammi]

I might be wrong about -30db. It is a lot quieter than I expected though.

Whoever told you -30 was loud enough either had a really hot DAC or very sensitive hearing. I just was listening to Susvara on my R26 + Bliss and found -8 was a nice level for critical listening. Would probably turn down to -10 for normal/relaxing listening.

 

[kumar402]

many are using it with May DAC which has more then standard 4v out of balanced I guess. Schiit DAC is 4v
Also someone might be using with some active preamp in between with some gain.

 

[newToAudio100]

based on some quick looking around, with a 4v input and no EQ or other manipulations of the signal, you should be around 93db peaks (0dbfs) at 0 with the Susvara. So -10 = 83 peak.

Great info. Thank you.

 

[whitefang]

20dB difference is A LOT. Most likely the -30 is just some misinformation if most people are on -10.
20dB over 4V is like 35V? I am not aware of any source has output level this high.
It would make sense for a more sensitive headphone like the Utopia but not Susvara.

This is an interesting topic, as I always wanted to compare my listening level to others, I have my KTE arriving next week so I could try as well.

 

[newToAudio100]

I will write my initial impressions of the Bliss KTE but first provide background on my audio experience to paint a picture of my experience.

My audio experience started 20 years ago with car audio systems before moving into entry level paradigm monitors and then polk audio towers for home audio. I only started headphones about 6-7 years ago with the hd6xx. I used the modi magni combo for a while with the 6xx. I moved on from that to the HD 800s, and used it with the modi/magni for a month before purchasing an HDVA600 amp, and shortly after that a yggdrasil OG dac.

The 6xx was a great introduction to the headphone world. Moving onto the yggdrasil/hdva600/hd800s was a big jump up in resolution, detail, and imaging. The hd800s has a larger soundstage and more air to the sound compared to the 6xx. Hd800s has much deeper sub bass with less distortion in sub bass, and a lift of treble and treble detail over the 6xx as well as more micro detail throughout (6xx has more warm bass but far less sub bass).

I then purchased a Mjolnir 2 amp and it paired great with the hd800s. It added a slightly liquid flavor to the sound with an incredible tonality that paired perfectly with the hd800s. The hdva600 had more refinement and detail separation than the mjolnir 2 without being fatiguing but the hdva600 is not liquid in nature as the mjolnir 2 sounds.

I then got to try the DNA Audio Stratus and Starlett and also purchased an LCD-X 2021. The hd800s goes wonderfully with both the DNA starlett and DNA stratus.

The DNA starlett sounds much more realistic and has a tangible presence compared to the hdva600. The hdva600 has more detail overall. Strings blossom and voices sound realistic on the starlett. The bass from the starlett is not as fast or impactful as the hdva600 or mjolnir 2 but is wider and still delivers great detail. The imaging, mid range realism, and tangible presence go great with the hd800s. The Starlett also manages to tame the treble on the hd800s as does the mjolnir 2.

The lcdx compared to the hd800s is warmer, slightly faster, and more musical. The hd800s is brighter, more air, better imaging, better soundstage, and dynamics (especially with a sub bass bump eq) and I didn't find the treble to be fatiguing at all after I adjusted to it from the 6xx.

DNA Stratus is a step above the Starlett. It has more detail and slightly tighter bass. Both of them are exceptional tube amps. The lcd x paired well with both the stratus and starlett but shined on the stratus. Lcd x also paired great with mjolnir 2 and hdva 600. The hd800s paired great with the stratus and starlett as well but for some reason it was closer between the two with the hd800s than the lcd x. I often used the hd800s with the starlett.

Susvara impression --- ---

More recently I purchased the Susvara new. I tried it on the mjolnir 2 and the hdva600. Within seconds it was clear the hdva600 has far more detail than the mjolnor 2 (at least with the susvara). I was surprised because I thought the mjolnir 2 would win as the better pair given it's power output. However the hdva 600 won. Bass on the hdva600 is still impactfull deep and strong with the susvara and details are very good. I tried the starlett as well and it also had the same issue as the mjolnir 2 with the susvara. Not as much detail, and it had less dynamics than the mjolnir 2. The starlett did have more detail than the mjolnir 2 however. I barely listened off the starlett or mjolnir 2 on the susvara after that.

Susvara beats the lcdx and hd800s hands down in reslution, detail, and imaging. It is shocking how much detail merges together even on those headphones. The susvara is fast and yet realistic, detailed, and provides incredible separation. I can pay attention to 10 different layers happening at once in a song and hear all the detail from every layer.

Bliss KTE initial impression --- ---

I now have the Holo Bliss KTE. It just arrived today. Initial impressions were a bit thrown off by my incorrect expectation of volume output at -30db. Initially A/B testing the bliss to the hdva 600 the hdva 600 sounded cleaner and seemed to have more treble detail. However after a few hours behind the bliss I'm shocked at how good it is.

After listening more and A/B testing on the susvara I am hearing incredible detail to the point of hearing the texture of hands clapping in a song that does not stand out on the hdva600. The hdva600 sounds more clear, while the bliss sounds more textured and more liquid at the same time which seems to contradict itself. It manages to show more texture but with a liquid nature similiar to the mjolnor 2 but with a major step up in detail. I can hear more richness to the sound than on the hdva600.

Bliss sounds more muscular while the hdva600 sounds more lean. However both amps can provide some good bass on the susvara. Tonality is great on the bliss. Hdva 600 still does sound more clear to me in upper mid range and treble at least for the moment but it sounds more thin as well. The bliss has more visceral texture to the bass. If I really sit back and focus clearly I can hear more detail with the bliss in most instances but it might initially appear the hdva 600 does for upper mid/treble.

This will require further listening and possibly brain burn in/amp burn in to get the most out of the bliss.

Today with the bliss I've been listening to these albums: gladiator sound track, interstellar sound track, matrix reloaded soundtrack, david Garrett rock revolution, m83 hurry up we're dreaming, A plot in you swan song, lord of the rings fellowship of the ring soundtrack, the elder scrolls online morrowind soundtrack, lindsey sterling snow waltz, Einaudi david glass nyman - spheres, The M Machine - Metropolis Remixed.

Specific songs that stood out for testing today:
Moments (CamelPhat Extended Remix) Kidnap Leo Stannard. The level of layering in this song really sounds amazing off the susvara/bliss.
Shadow in the Rose Garden (Matt Lamge Remix) The M Machine. This song has incredible mastering and spooky detail. It really shows off the liquid nature of the bliss and provides sophisticated texture.

 

[Timbuk2]

@newToAudio100 Welcome to the forum! If you like Bliss now, just wait until it goes through burn-in, somewhere around 200 hours... For me, it was not a subtle change. It went from, like this is very good, to like WOW.

I'd like to suggest you try something... Try using your MJ2 as a preamp (high gain, about 3/4 volume), with a pair of dynamic, high gain, high sensitivity tubes, like Gold Lion E88CC, then connect a dynamic driver to Bliss. I didn't notice as much a difference with planars that I've had (including Sus), but man, it makes a pair of HD650's come ALIVE, like I've never heard before. I'm finding that I'm treble sensitive, so I'm sticking with the HD650's, but see how it sounds with your HD800's... Since they are bright, you might need a less bright tube though...

Thanks again to @Rayon for the inspiration to try a tube preamp with Bliss. You can read more about that adventure in previous pages...

So I've settled (for now) with May KTE>MJ2 with Gold Lion tubes>Bliss KTE>HD650... Have fun exploring with Bliss!

 

[krude]

@newToAudio100 Welcome to the forum! If you like Bliss now, just wait until it goes through burn-in, somewhere around 200 hours... For me, it was not a subtle change. It went from, like this is very good, to like WOW.

I'd like to suggest you try something... Try using your MJ2 as a preamp (high gain, about 3/4 volume), with a pair of dynamic, high gain, high sensitivity tubes, like Gold Lion E88CC, then connect a dynamic driver to Bliss. I didn't notice as much a difference with planars that I've had (including Sus), but man, it makes a pair of HD650's come ALIVE, like I've never heard before. I'm finding that I'm treble sensitive, so I'm sticking with the HD650's, but see how it sounds with your HD800's... Since they are bright, you might need a less bright tube though...

Thanks again to @Rayon for the inspiration to try a tube preamp with Bliss. You can read more about that adventure in previous pages...

So I've settled (for now) with May KTE>MJ2 with Gold Lion tubes>Bliss KTE>HD650... Have fun exploring with Bliss!

Wait until you rock a full blown tube amp with dynamics but tubes as a pre into great SS is also an amazing sound no doubt.

 

[Rayon]

Wait until you rock a full blown tube amp with dynamics but tubes as a pre into great SS is also an amazing sound no doubt.

To me the great thing with tube-pre (for someone that already has Bliss) is that a full blown tube amp that can drive Susvara properly costs an arm and leg. With tube-pre in the chain one can experiment and get amazing results at fraction of the cost.

As a side note: I've been listening May->Bliss directly whole day, removing Freya+ from the chain completely. It's so nice to have the possibility to switch back into this absolute reference sound. Tubes and distorted transistor sound are nice adventures I want to experience occasionally, but this clean reference sound feels like home.

 

[SLC1966]

As in hearing loss over years of exposure, or so loud you want to throw the headphones off?

Right now for me -30db is much quieter than normal speaking volume, -22db to -20db is speaking volume in a small room, and -10db is louder than I would normally listen but it's not scary loud at all. It's about 65% as loud as a movie theater gets.

Is this normal?

I got the same numbers with Yggy and Bliss with Susvara. I have May with Serene with Bliss now so -25 is what -20 used to be when no pre was used (Yggy is now with Ferrum stack. The main reason being for aesthetics and ergonomic purposes. . And being able to have May do dual duty with Bliss and 2CH system )