[BassicScience]

I only own the lowly SGL Jr., but am hoping to hear the Senior at some point in the not-too-distant future. Really the only shortcoming of the SGL Jr. in comparison to the Susvara is in the bass region (surprise!). I imagine that the bigger driver of the Senior closes that gap, although I have some doubts that it gets all the way there, just based on physics. The subjective quality of the SGL Junior's bass is rather variable depending on source material. The quality and resolution of its bass is very high, but it falls down a bit on dynamics, impact, and frequency extension. Classical and acoustic music seems to be its sweet spot. Electronica is variable, again depending on how much bass energy is present. Surprisingly, I prefer a lot of older rock recordings on the SGL Jr. (vs. on Susvara), because of the extra resolution in the midrange. Music where the rhythmic drive and dynamics are primarily in the midrange tend to sound awesome on the SGL Jr.

I've only had very short exposure to the the CRBN, but my initial impressions are consistent with most reports on HeadFi. Strong in the bass by eStat standards, but lacking in soundstage dimensions. For my preferences, the SGL (Jr.) was a clear choice. In general voicing, it is quite similar to the Susvara.

 

[number1sixerfan]

I’ve owned the SGL Sr for a few months now and I’m still in an honeymoon with it.

This is an amazing headphone with no flaws to my ears. While I was used to alternate before between my 1266TC and my SR1a, I do no longer feel the need to do so.

Can relate. I haven't used the Sr1a or TC much at all since having it. I was picking up the TC here and there, but just haven't as late. The SGL's completeness can make it hard to go back to both.

The tonality is close to the Susvara but the SGL is a step above in resolution and overall coherence. If you like the Susvara, you cannot be disappointed by the SGL Sr.

Have said this last point myself, 100% agree. If you like the Susvara, I don't see how you could not be that much more enamored with the SGL. It takes what the Susvara does and gives it a boost in detail/resolution and soundstaging.

 

[Sajid Amit]

Yea the CRBN is still impressive and enjoyable in that regard even though it isn't at the head of the pack. I am dying to get the x9000 just for the sake of this comparison. I do have a hunch that the Stax will come a bit closer to the SGL's performance without as steep of a price, although with a different style. SGL definitely is not laid back or relaxed, as the x9000 has been described.

And yea, that's kind of a good way to think about it. The SGL has the same technical prowess of the Sr1a (minus the soundstage/openness), but with much more weight to the music and considerably better bass. That said, it's still stat bass lol. I would like just a bit more impact in the SGL, but overall the bass is really, really good. I haven't used the Raal much at all since having the SGL, as the latter feels like a step up in refinement and cohesiveness.



I did some additional back and forth yesterday, and it's really close. But the CRBN has a bit stronger mid-bass impact which I do really like. It seems like the SGL has a bit better low extension, but the slightly better impact on the CRBN for me is favorable. But it's tough, it's really close. I think my expectations of the CRBN's bass were too high because of the original thread, but I think it's really excellent for a stat.



I hate how cheap the SGL looks for the price. I really do. In it of itself, it does not feel cheap and feels reliable, but for the price there's just no excuse--should be more high fidelity. For reference, it feels and looks a bit nicer than the Susvara, but not by much.

The quality of the bass is excellent. It really is. It's similar to the Susvara and a touch lighter in terms of impact and slam. That's the only thing I'd say I wish there was just a bit more of. I do wonder if the DIY T2 will boost that a bit. As far as the Susvara v. SGL overall, they have a lot of similarities. The biggest thing they share is that they are both really complete headphones. There are no real flaws in either. But the SGL significantly improves on openness and separation. This makes imaging and detail stand out a bit more, and there's also a bit more weight/density to the music. So there's more realism to the music. Lastly, the biggest difference between the two is tonality. The SGL has more energy and is just a bit brighter (but in a good way, not actually bright, more so neutral), whereas the Susvara is a bit polite and more laid back/smooth. After a few weeks, the first thing I mentioned was that the SGL seems like a mashup of the 009/Susvara and on steroids.. and I still think that's really accurate.

I'll definitely do more comparisons once I have all of the amps on hand.

Damn. Persuasive depiction, I have to say.

Lol.

 

[number1sixerfan]

Damn. Persuasive depiction, I have to say.

Lol.

Lol, I can't wait to hear your impressions when you finally try them.

 

[Jomungur]

I would echo the comparisons above to the Shangrila vs. Susvara and wrote some impressions of this a few pages ago in this thread. I was in the same boat as you; I had the Susvara with a great amp and loved it. But the doubt was always niggling in the back of my mind "If the Susvara is this good, why did Hifiman bother with making a Shangrila? Just to fleece the uberwealthy?"

I saw some interviews with Fang and was convinced he is not that kind of guy. Engineer's mindset for sure, which is partly why Hifiman products do not exude luxury and design excellence like the Focal Utopia or Stellia. I found, though, that I really liked the Hifiman sound. I even preferred the Hifiman Ananda to the Focal Utopia that I had for a couple of years, which is several times as expensive. I couldn't listen to the Utopia after that; it sounded metallic and tinny.

So I figured why not take a shot and Hifiman's attempt to be the best so I got the whole system. No looking back for me. I still have my Susvara but don't listen to it much. This is not to say the Susvara isn't still excellent; it is. But I can't think of a reason why I'd listen to it over the Shangrila.

The Shangrila does have the Hifiman sound signature, which to my mind is perhaps not the best in any one dimension but excellent at all of them, with a bit of airiness and space to the sound. So if you like the Susvara, you'll definitely like it. It's more immersive than the Susvara. When listening to the Shangrila, I often feel like I'm in the recording studio.

But it is pricey and you do need a really quality energizer to go with it. Based on what I hear when running the VOCE side by side, the Shangrila is slightly harder to drive than that which I think is already considered a difficult to drive for an electrostatic (because of the relatively large driver). Marries well with tubes as well in the chain if you use them.

I've had it for a few months now and no durability issues so far. I wouldn't say the wire is cheap looking, but it does feel delicate. People lament its quality and I can understand that. Yet I find it hard to believe that Hifiman would engineer such a marvelous headphone and then skimp out on the wire. Maybe they wanted it really light for some engineering reason, I don't know.

 

[Jomungur]

If you ever get a CRBN, please share your thoughts as well

Actually, I have a CRBN now. There was one in stock at a store in NYC so I grabbed one, looks like this one was manufactured on Nov 16 based on the cert of authenticity. (You can still find these on Amazon, I guess some dealers stockpiled a few.)

I will share comparisons with the Shangrila Sr. and VOCE after some listening. Again, running on the Shangrila amp. The exterior craftsmanship is beautiful and superior to the Shangrila, I can say that. Comfort seems better too (though to be clear the Shangrila is very comfortable) although I want to reserve judgment after having them on for awhile.

(And I see why number1sixfan has multiple estat headphones, it's almost kind of like art collection or something, because they all do sound different in their own way).

 

[Sajid Amit]

Actually, I have a CRBN now. There was one in stock at a store in NYC so I grabbed one, looks like this one was manufactured on Nov 16 based on the cert of authenticity. (You can still find these on Amazon, I guess some dealers stockpiled a few.)

I will share comparisons with the Shangrila Sr. and VOCE after some listening. Again, running on the Shangrila amp. The exterior craftsmanship is beautiful and superior to the Shangrila, I can say that. Comfort seems better too (though to be clear the Shangrila is very comfortable) although I want to reserve judgment after having them on for awhile.

(And I see why number1sixfan has multiple estat headphones, it's almost kind of like art collection or something, because they all do sound different in their own way).

Analogy with an art collection is rather appropriate

 

[Jomungur]

Actually, I have a CRBN now. There was one in stock at a store in NYC so I grabbed one, looks like this one was manufactured on Nov 16 based on the cert of authenticity. (You can still find these on Amazon, I guess some dealers stockpiled a few.)

I will share comparisons with the Shangrila Sr. and VOCE after some listening. Again, running on the Shangrila amp. The exterior craftsmanship is beautiful and superior to the Shangrila, I can say that. Comfort seems better too (though to be clear the Shangrila is very comfortable) although I want to reserve judgment after having them on for awhile.

(And I see why number1sixfan has multiple estat headphones, it's almost kind of like art collection or something, because they all do sound different in their own way).

I have been listening to the CRBN and Shangrila Sr. side by side for 2 weeks now on the Shangrila amp. The CRBN is very nice, and a beautiful pair of headphones, but the Shangrila is superior in every musical dimension. I've my wife and a couple of friends listen side by side (they don't know anything about the relative prices) and they came to the same conclusion.

How much better is the Shangrila? It's impossible to quantify, but the CRBN for me doesn't have that absorbing quality that keeps me listening for hours that the Shangrila has.

 

[ThanatosVI]

I have been listening to the CRBN and Shangrila Sr. side by side for 2 weeks now on the Shangrila amp. The CRBN is very nice, and a beautiful pair of headphones, but the Shangrila is superior in every musical dimension. I've my wife and a couple of friends listen side by side (they don't know anything about the relative prices) and they came to the same conclusion.

How much better is the Shangrila? It's impossible to quantify, but the CRBN for me doesn't have that absorbing quality that keeps me listening for hours that the Shangrila has.

CRBN probably looked gorgeous with that amp

 

[ufospls2]

Borrowing a Shangri-La Sr for a little bit (headphones only,) which should be here tomorrow. Will report back with some initial thoughts once I get a bit listening in. Also my replacement CRBNs should be here in a week or so, so I'll be able to do some comparisons between the Shangrila Sr, SR007mk2, SR009S, CRBN, and then the TC's and Solitaire P on the non electrostatic side of things.

 

[ThanatosVI]

Borrowing a Shangri-La Sr for a little bit (headphones only,) which should be here tomorrow. Will report back with some initial thoughts once I get a bit listening in. Also my replacement CRBNs should be here in a week or so, so I'll be able to do some comparisons between the Shangrila Sr, SR007mk2, SR009S, CRBN, and then the TC's and Solitaire P on the non electrostatic side of things.

Amazing lineup for comparisons!

 

[ufospls2]

Well, both my replacement CRBN and the Shang-Sr (borrowing for a little bit) arrived today. I'll report back a bit later with some very initial impressions.

 

[MAISONOBE AALAIN]

Hello I changed my 300B on my viva stx for Elrog 300 B Mo: very clear improvement on my senior shangri. These tubes are expensive but if you have the means you will not be disappointed.

I have been waiting for my stax Sr-x9000 for 5 months!
Has anyone been able to compare this stax to the shangri senior?

 

[ThanatosVI]

Hello I changed my 300B on my viva stx for Elrog 300 B Mo: very clear improvement on my senior shangri. These tubes are expensive but if you have the means you will not be disappointed.

I have been waiting for my stax Sr-x9000 for 5 months!
Has anyone been able to compare this stax to the shangri senior?

You see those rarely, good ol german quality!

 

[ufospls2]

Ok, so these are obviously very very early impressions, and I want to be clear I may change my mind as I get used to the Sr's over the next little bit.

The first impression is that they very much sound like a pair of Hifimans, and are perhaps the most well done expression of that sound, that I have heard. I thought they might actually be harder to drive from what I have read here but the BHSE seems to be doing just fine with them.

I have wanted to hear these headphones since 2016 when they were released, so this has been a really neat opportunity.

I sold my Susvara and shipped them out a couple days ago (covered purchasing the CRBNs,) but I can make a comparison from memory.

I do think they are more detailed and technically proficient than the Susvara, but not like.. Leaps and bounds that the vast gulf in MSRP may suggest. The tonal balance is a bit different, a tiny bit less warm and a bit brighter, which may lend itself towards sounding more detailed also. Not so bright that I'm wincing or experiencing sibilance and sheen with cymbals either. The Susvara do sound a bit "sweeter" from memory. The bass seems to be fairly similar in terms of level. On the Susvara I always ran a bit of a low shelve via EQ as there just wasn't enough bass for my preferences, and I was worried the Sr may not cope well with a similar low shelve. Surprisingly it takes it like a champ and I would thoroughly recommend trying that out if you prefer a more robust bass response than strictly neutral or less than neutral. Soundstage seems taller than the Susvara and similar to the HE1000 series in height, due to the shape I think. Imaging and superb layering might be where these excel the most so far imo, everything is very well presented and placed throughout the soundstage. Soundstage width is similar to the Susvara, but the depth is better.

Also, all of this is relative. I don't want to make it sound like the Susvara is massively lagging behind, because it isn't, but there is a difference. Of course, this is very early impressions and as I listen more those impressions may change.

Would I buy a pair of my own Sr's? I'm not sure man. If I had an unlimited budget, yes, so far, I absolutely would. If they were the same MSRP as the Susvara? Yes I absolutely would. My current plan, enjoy them for the little while I have them, and hey, maybe try out the JR's at some point : )