[wadec22]

Yes you can get volume with HE6. I did that too with my Burson and other amps in the past. A lot of amps can give the HE6 volume. But it wont be properly driven.

Not the amp's fault. The HE6 is a speaker, not a headphone.

is this due to the often lower damping factor of a power amp vs modern ss headphone amps?

 

[sennfan83261]

What is the source of this information? Did you measure the current? Did someone else do this and you are quoting them? The 789 is able to output 6W into a 32 ohm load, probably a little less into the 50 ohm HE6-SE. Seems quite enough. On my 789 into HE6-SE I can't go above 60-70% volume on gain 3, it becomes way too loud.

I hope you implied balanced output here. Single-ended is definitely not powerful enough.

ASR measured the 789 as having an output (balanced) of 3.5W at 50ohm load (before clipping). HFM recommends above 2W into 50ohms in their HE-6 user manual. Still, the bass response of my HE-6 from my 789 (gain of 3, 9:30 volume position) is noticeably weaker than being driven out of a stereo power amp (mine being a Crown D-75A, 40W into 8ohms, with an estimated 13W at 50ohms load).

 

[omniweltall]

Can you define the technical difference besides the physical shape?

I mean, it is so insensitive. It is not normal actually for a headphone. So I dont blame the amps. There are more expensive, powerful, and capable amps than the 789 that still can't drive the HE6.

 

[alpovs]

ASR measured the 789 as having an output (balanced) of 3.5W at 50ohm load (before clipping). HFM recommends above 2W into 50ohms in their HE-6 user manual. Still, the bass response of my HE-6 from my 789 (gain of 3, 9:30 volume position) is noticeably weaker than being driven out of a stereo power amp (mine being a Crown D-75A, 40W into 8ohms, with an estimated 13W at 50ohms load).

How are those measurements done? Is it max gain and max volume and increasing input signal or fixed input signal and gradually increasing volume on max gain? I quickly tried to find the test setup and couldn't. Amps clip when the input signal goes higher than spec. They don't clip when the signal is in spec at max volume.

Here is a quote from that site: "For consistency with my last couple of headphone amplifier reviews, I set the output at about 5.7 volts." Is it a fixed input signal level into the 789? If yes, then there is a problem with those measurements. See the link provided by @Dana Reed (big thanks!):

I think the only time you can’t use high volume on gain 3 is if the input voltage is >2V. So if you are feeding it with a 4V balanced DAC, it’s easy to clip. There was confirmation of this on the drop forum by THX.

edit: link
https://drop.com/buy/drop-thx-aaa-789-linear-amplifier/talk/2170291

This amp shouldn't' be fed more than 2.1V when used on gain 3 or it will clip. It can output more power before clipping if the input stays below 2.1V.

 

[nahpungnome]

Unless my ears are crap (which I wouldn't doubt), I don't hear much difference between my Jot and my BasX A100. Aside from a little bit better control down low with the Emotiva. Hell, one could say it just sounds a little warmer.

I doubt I'd hear any difference between the 789 and a speaker amp also, but of course I haven't ventured into trying different ones. Even my Jot on high gain mode gets more than loud enough without distortion and doesn't seem starved for power.

Of course, I have no idea how loud people are listening to...my A weighted db meter will go to 90db max most of the time for me.

 

[Happy Camper]

It is the power supply of the amp that makes the difference, not loudness. Lots of amps get loud. It’s the better amps with money in the power supply that you start noticing the refinement in sound. I’ve heard 100 watt receivers sound terrible and 10 watt amps shine. From a value POV, old high quality iron still has the edge with the planars. It’s been some 6 years ago but good audio stores having Naim, Moon, MAC, Krell, Levinson, etc. really brought the HE to life better than your middle of the heap Japanese receivers. Amps that can handle Maggie and stats like ML had the power reserves and damping to make them sing.

 

[nahpungnome]

It is the power supply of the amp that makes the difference, not loudness. Lots of amps get loud. It’s the better amps with money in the power supply that you start noticing the refinement in sound. I’ve heard 100 watt receivers sound terrible and 10 watt amps shine. From a value POV, old high quality iron still has the edge with the planars. It’s been some 6 years ago but good audio stores having Naim, Moon, MAC, Krell, Levinson, etc. really brought the HE to life better than your middle of the heap Japanese receivers. Amps that can handle Maggie and stats like ML had the power reserves and damping to make them sing.

I agree that it's not just about volume and that a better amp will sound better, but people on here and other forums seem to make it sound like the 789, Jot, or whatever doesn't drive these properly. Some people also seem to make it sound like you need 250 WPC to get some sort of magic, which I won't agree or disagree with as I haven't gotten to that level, but to my ears, my Jot and my BasX A100 sound great with very little difference...maybe they both suck <shrug>.

I may have to take my set to my dad's house and try these on his Carver Silver 9ts or the Onkyo Integra setup (although I think I saw the Onkyo setup unplugged)...Only hassle is that my taps don't split wide enough for the 9ts. Maybe an excuse to make a longer one that can split farther at the speaker tap side Ugh having to go behind his setup to do all this seems like a hassle.

 

[GU1DO]

I just received LQI copper cable and XLR to Speaker Taps cable to try speaker amps later
https://lqicables.com/collections/a...-pin-female-to-speaker-taps-banana-plugs-pins
https://lqicables.com/products/voda-up-occ-copper-headphone-cable

 

[Slim1970]

I just received LQI copper cable and XLR to Speaker Taps cable to try speaker amps later
https://lqicables.com/collections/a...-pin-female-to-speaker-taps-banana-plugs-pins
https://lqicables.com/products/voda-up-occ-copper-headphone-cable

Nice, let us know if you can hear any sound improvements going direct from speaker taps.

 

[nahpungnome]

I just received LQI copper cable and XLR to Speaker Taps cable to try speaker amps later
https://lqicables.com/collections/a...-pin-female-to-speaker-taps-banana-plugs-pins
https://lqicables.com/products/voda-up-occ-copper-headphone-cable

Beautiful cables.

 

[alpovs]

my Jot and my BasX A100 sound great with very little difference...maybe they both suck <shrug>.

If your BasX A100 without the resistors can't drive these properly, nothing else can.

 

[wadec22]

Unless my ears are crap (which I wouldn't doubt), I don't hear much difference between my Jot and my BasX A100. Aside from a little bit better control down low with the Emotiva. Hell, one could say it just sounds a little warmer.

I doubt I'd hear any difference between the 789 and a speaker amp also, but of course I haven't ventured into trying different ones. Even my Jot on high gain mode gets more than loud enough without distortion and doesn't seem starved for power.

Of course, I have no idea how loud people are listening to...my A weighted db meter will go to 90db max most of the time for me.

The Jot will output almost 3W via XLR into 50ohms. To listen to the 6se with 110db peak, you need about 1.3W. If you listen with peaks of 115db, you need about 4W. Only with the most extreme cases would anyone notice a difference between the two amps. It's not the emotiva disappointing, it's the Jot being a pretty damn powerful headphone amp.

 

[Happy Camper]

I agree that it's not just about volume and that a better amp will sound better, but people on here and other forums seem to make it sound like the 789, Jot, or whatever doesn't drive these properly. Some people also seem to make it sound like you need 250 WPC to get some sort of magic, which I won't agree or disagree with as I haven't gotten to that level, but to my ears, my Jot and my BasX A100 sound great with very little difference...maybe they both suck <shrug>.

I may have to take my set to my dad's house and try these on his Carver Silver 9ts or the Onkyo Integra setup (although I think I saw the Onkyo setup unplugged)...Only hassle is that my taps don't split wide enough for the 9ts. Maybe an excuse to make a longer one that can split farther at the speaker tap side Ugh having to go behind his setup to do all this seems like a hassle.

The reason many that have gone to the high wattage solutions is because those amps have the reserves necessary to the demands planars present. No, they are not using anywhere near the wattage, but it's how fast those reserves can be delivered, how long it can be sustained without affecting the soundscape, how well the amp controls dampening.

 

[ostewart]

The reason many that have gone to the high wattage solutions is because those amps have the reserves necessary to the demands planars present. No, they are not using anywhere near the wattage, but it's how fast those reserves can be delivered, how long it can be sustained without affecting the soundscape, how well the amp controls dampening.

Big caps for current delivery when the bass drops that's what speaker amps have over smaller headphone amps.

It's the same when you use them for speakers, you rarely use half the wattage specified but it's the power delivery when the drivers ask for current that makes most of the difference.

 

[bagwell359]

The Jot will output almost 3W via XLR into 50ohms. To listen to the 6se with 110db peak, you need about 1.3W. If you listen with peaks of 115db, you need about 4W. Only with the most extreme cases would anyone notice a difference between the two amps. It's not the emotiva disappointing, it's the Jot being a pretty damn powerful headphone amp.

Excuse me, but I'm not sure how you are deriving your numbers. HFM states that it's 83.5 db/1mW @ 50 ohms. I read someplace else that it was measured at 79.5 - but let's set that aside for now. I'm not saying you are wrong, but I don't get how you get from 83.5 db/1mW to 110 db/1.3W. That's 26.5 more db.

On my Rag 1 XLR the HE6SE has to be turned up higher to get to the same volume as an HE-6 6 screw, and independent of that other measurement I mentioned, it was about a 3 db difference. In none of my listening did I ever get over about 102 db, but several times with the HE6SE I was in Gain 3 at 3:45 PM (almost max - somewhere above 12 watts I'd estimate).

Obviously db does not scale with watts, I just forget the formula. It is interesting how people claim they need 100/150/200 wpc amps to drive the HE-6 when a 60 wpc separate is probably enough to melt them.