Help me pick: SR60's w/Bowls or SR80's w/Bowls
Mar 25, 2007 at 1:22 PM Thread Starter Post #1 of 29

Joshatdot

Headphoneus Supremus
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I went down to Seattle again, and visited Hawthorne Stereo again. I spent some quality time with their headphone selection:

SR60's (comfies), SR80's, SR125's, SR225's, HD 25-SP, HD 265 Linear, HD 465, HD 595, HD 25-1 70ohm.

I listened to the Ultrasone S-Logic Demo CD as a reference. Here is how I rated them:

SR60 (comfies) C+/B- : The sound was not that crisp, clean, detailed. They were somewhat lightly muffled/blanketed, and the bass was not clean sounding either.

SR60 (bowls) A- : With the bowls they were much much more clean, crisp and detailed, but less bass. The bass that was there, was cleaner. They gave a much better detailed soundstage with the bowls.

SR80 (bowls) A/A+ : These were more detailed sounding than the SR60's with bowls. I could hear alot more little small quiet sounds on the Demo CD with these. Like on track 5, I could hear the pianist's bench/seat creak and crack as if they were sitting right in front of me. On track 10 in the beginning there is a person coughing in the background and with the SR80's I heard that cough very clear, and could almost point out where they were sitting. There was alot of little stuff I heard in the SR80's that I didn't notice before. IMHO, with all bowls, there is little low end bass.

The SR125 & 225 were identical to my ears, but didn't give me the same detailed feeling as the 80's.

HD 25 SP, HD 265 Linear, HD 465 ... all three of them sounded very blanketed, and muddy. I gave them all D's (maybe even F's)

HD 595 B+ : These felt very comfortable on my head, sounded ALOT cleaner than the others and reproduced nice amounts of bass. But compared to the Grados, they were not as bright or detailed sounding, I liked these quite abit. Decent bass and pretty darn good mids & highs (but nothing like the Grados).

HD 25-1 70ohm B+ : These also sounded very good, lots of bass (even more than the 595's), decent amount of mids and highs. And again compared to the Grados, they were not as detailed. Also they were sensitive to microphonics? I could hear every little thing bumping on the headphone cord, even tapping the 1/4" adapter onto the plug.

I can see why some many people here talk about the brightness of Grados, and the Sennheiser veil. I really liked the SR80's the best out of all of them, and the SR60's a very very close 2nd. If I had to pick Senns, I think I would go with the HD 25-1 70ohm. They produced much better low end bass but not too boomy or muddy, plus they are very portable. But with the HD 595's I didn't notice any microphonics at all, and they were a very comfortable closed can.

I would love to have the SR80 sound, but with the HD 25-1's bass (or even the HD 595's bass)
 
Mar 25, 2007 at 1:31 PM Post #2 of 29
Oh yeah, would the Alessandro MS1 give me better bass then the Grado SR60 or SR80?
 
Mar 25, 2007 at 1:39 PM Post #3 of 29
Quote:

Originally Posted by Joshatdot /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Oh yeah, would the Alessandro MS1 give me better bass then the Grado SR60 or SR80?


I might be wrong, but I think the sound characteristic on MS1 might be quite different as well. Not as upfront and in your face.
 
Mar 25, 2007 at 2:07 PM Post #4 of 29
All things being equal between all the Grados/Alessandros, I would tend to go with the SR-80s over the SR-60s simply because of the four conductor cable. Nothing more than that.
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Mar 25, 2007 at 2:10 PM Post #5 of 29
Quote:

Originally Posted by corsair /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I might be wrong, but I think the sound characteristic on MS1 might be quite different as well. Not as upfront and in your face.


I can only compare the SR-60 and the MS2i (so besides different sound-profile there is a big quality difference as well) but to my ears, the in your face-ness of the Alessandro's should not be underestimated. Sure they are a bit more mid-high-modest than the pure-bread grado line-up, but they are nowhere near as laid-back as the Senns or anything like that.

The MS2i (and according to the praising threads on the MS1, the MS1 as well) does not 'lack' anything the grado's offer in fun or impact, they simply offer a slightly different and to most a bit more balanced funpack. They still offer very lively higher frequencies but as they are slightly less pronounced, lower mids and bass do get a fairer shot at your attention. They do not offer a net gain in bass over the grado's as far as I can tell, but as they offer a more balanced pack of frequencies, there relatively (as measured against the highs) is more bass when played at roughly the same perceived volume level.

I love the sound of my MS2i over my SR-60's, but then again - as I said before - there are a lot of things that make this comparison uneven.

There are still a few other great tricks to get more bass from grado and/or alessandro phones.
- wrap electrical tape round the bowls (could result in a tubed sound)
- pair with a warm/bassy amplifier (the Head-Five is a great grado-companion)
- do a bit of smart eq'ing (when using a DAP or a PC as source)
- use an Ohm-adapter (120 or even 200 Ohm) and an amp... this does increase detail AND also bass

I will try and do a more thorough write-up of my phones (MS2i, SR-60, KSC75 and ATH-A900) with and without the adapter (between them and my H5) but it will be a while before I have auditioned them enough to make precise statements.
 
Mar 25, 2007 at 2:25 PM Post #6 of 29
Quote:

Originally Posted by F107plus5 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
All things being equal between all the Grados/Alessandros, I would tend to go with the SR-80s over the SR-60s simply because of the four conductor cable. Nothing more than that.
plainface.gif



Is that the only difference between the 60 & 80?
 
Mar 25, 2007 at 2:50 PM Post #7 of 29
Quote:

Originally Posted by Joshatdot /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Is that the only difference between the 60 & 80?


Other than the pads, of course. But there is a rumor circulating that there are other change(s) to the drivers as well. I dunno about that.
plainface.gif
 
Mar 25, 2007 at 3:17 PM Post #8 of 29
As always I can't recommend the SR60/80 (or SR125 - a different sound than SR225, HF1, RS1, etc.) over the MS1. The brightness you hear over the HD595 (another phone I place above the SR60/80/125) is my primary complaint, and influences the rest of the spectrum presentation, including the bass. Everyones mileage will vary, but over time that brightness (not detail) may get on your nerves further. For balanced presentation, and properly amped, I'd place your choices: HD595, MS1, SR125, SR80, SR60, HD25-1. That's of course if balanced presentation is a target.

EDIT: I see you have the 7506. Okay, what I typed may not apply, because I have similar complaints, only multiplied there. If the Sonys don't bother you, any Grado model should be fine in the highs department.
 
Mar 25, 2007 at 3:52 PM Post #9 of 29
I am focus listening to the Ultrasone S-Logic Demo CD again with my MDR-7506's w/dt250 pads, via Foobar, FLAC, AV710, TOSLINK, Toshiba receiver, volume at 48~56 of 80 max.

It's been a while since I really listened to this CD with my 7506's. They have almost the same detailed sound I listened to with the 80's. And they give me good amount of bass. There are some things I heard with the 7506 I didn't really hear with the grados. On track 4 I can hear alot of the quiet sounds in the background in detail. The shuffling of the music/lyric papers when they switch, or is it feet shuffling, a kid coughing way in the back, the breaths the singers do before they start to sing. On track 5 I really could hear the pianist bench/seat creak and crack very very clearly. I could even hear the recording person breath or someone very very lightly, around 1:40-1:47.

I kinda forgot how well these 7506's sound. There are many times I could hear very low audible low frequencies, like very low rumblings of something. I thought some dump truck was rumbling down the street, but it was the CD. Again on track 5 ~2:20 I can hear some kind of very low rumble. Also on track 6 ~0:24 & 0:33 there is some low rumbling, and at ~0:50 I hear a car in the distance accelerate away.
 
Mar 25, 2007 at 4:02 PM Post #10 of 29
Quote:

Originally Posted by Joshatdot /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Is that the only difference between the 60 & 80?


Well, you tried both with bowls, but they sounded different, didn't they?

Contrary to popular belief, the SR80's use different drivers than the SR60's. The SR80's often lose in comparison because it takes a good amp to bring the bass out. I've listened to both with bowls, and with a good amp the SR80's may be capable of an octave lower than the SR60's.

I own the SR80's, but personally, I still don't like either one, but that's a different story.
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Out of those you listed, I would definitely go for the HD595's if you can afford them. Then pick up a pair of KSC75's for $20 and they will give you the detail of the Grado's when you want it. There is a subtle difference - the Grado's are still better at guitar plucks, but the KSC75's are excellent at rendering metal cymbals and crashes, but at the price and convenience of the KSC75, no contest IMHO. The HD595 will then provide you with the overall quality and comfort that a good pair of high-fidelity audiophile cans should provide.

EDIT: Oops - not to worry, you already have the Koss's in your sig.
 
Mar 25, 2007 at 5:37 PM Post #11 of 29
Quote:

Originally Posted by F107plus5 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
All things being equal between all the Grados/Alessandros, I would tend to go with the SR-80s over the SR-60s simply because of the four conductor cable. Nothing more than that.
plainface.gif



X2. Yup Yup. I agree with ya!
 
Mar 25, 2007 at 9:04 PM Post #13 of 29
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tele /img/forum/go_quote.gif
If you must be limited to these two, go 60. Otherwise, splurge and get the MS-1. They are far superior.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Tele /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Congrats on getting an awesome pair of headphones.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Tele /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Go directly to the MS-Pro. You'll get there eventually anyway.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Tele /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Welcome to the club.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Tele /img/forum/go_quote.gif
It seems a little bulky. Are they comfortable?


Quote:

Originally Posted by Tele /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Much more so. My wife has a hard time sleeping with me wearing then in bed.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Tele /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Nice find. Thanks for sharing.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Tele /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Congrats.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Tele /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Those are very cool.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Tele /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I listened to these at a shop recently. They sound fantastic.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Tele /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Wow!


[rant]hi tele... (sorry mods if this is out of place), but have you actually ever read any thread you posted in or are you just posting one-line replies to the title-question in every grado-related thread you can find to up your coolness/post-count? If you really want to sell something in the FS-forums there is always the music section to raise your post-count without bumping all these threads for absolutely no reason whatsoever

please do read the complete thread (or in the case of long threads at least the last pages) before posting[/rant]

PS: sorry for the long redundant quote-full post, but I didn't want to seem thread-crapping without reason

PPS: a quick glance at your other posts shows you actually didn't need my sarcastic 'pointer' towards the music section

conclusion:... sad part is I was actually right for once
tele.jpg


... mods, please do remove my post if deemed necessary, but perhaps this is saying something about the FS-system (50 posts + 1 month registered... perhaps not enough? or other indicators needed?)
 
Mar 26, 2007 at 6:33 AM Post #14 of 29
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tele /img/forum/go_quote.gif
If you must be limited to these two, go 60. Otherwise, splurge and get the MS-1. They are far superior.


I wish there was a Alessandro seller on the Seattle area ... or maybe there should be a mini-Head-Fi meet in Seattle?
eggosmile.gif
so I can test drive alot of cans
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I got re-impressed with my MDR-7506's again, but I really liked the SR80 sound. I would love to try the MS-1's
 
Mar 26, 2007 at 11:45 AM Post #15 of 29
Oh no; the thing with Teles' bunch of posts may well be all MY fault!!
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Before I realized that the ruling was 50 posts AND one month as a member prior to using the FS forum, I mentioned to another member that getting just 50 posts would be the key. Even pointed out that the "member lounge" would be a good place to visit to raise the count quickly.

So I may have contributed in a great way to having a bunch of posts added in one big chunk. My apologies to all concerned.
frown.gif
 

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