[donunus]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dallan /img/forum/go_quote.gif Senn 650s sound horrible w/o a dedicated headphone amp in fact basically unusable. I wouldn't even listen to mine if i didn't have a headphone amp available. With no headphone amp you would at least want a lower ohm pair of headphones like Grados or iems.

My hd600s are actually very decent on my ipod

surely better than any computer speaker ive heard IMHO. Not as good as $2000 monitor speakers from say...hmm harbeth though

 

[Peter Pinna]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DemonicLemming /img/forum/go_quote.gif Do the 750s employ the same S-Logic as the 780s? If so, that might be one of the reasons you think that about the sound stage. My 780s, while never nearly coming close to the depth of a 5.1 system properly imaged, do sometimes have a good bit of depth and spatial variation in them. I've pulled my Z-5500s apart, and I have some issues with it. None of the satellite speakers have any sort of poly filling in the enclosures, and the subwoofer has a strange port (haven't run any computer sim tests on it, but it seems like the length of the port is designed for a weird tuning frequency) and doesn't have nearly enough poly filling it in. I'm going to pick up a pound or two of poly filling sometime this week to play around with, but to me, the 5500s just don't really have good highs (they seem to hit a steep roll-off, although I couldn't say at what frequency) and the sub just isn't precise enough for me. I've seen it said the satellite speakers are Tangband, which have a pretty decent reputation out there; however, I find I really have to EQ the setup hard to get it to sound like I want it for metal. I'd really like to work out the tuning and enclosure space and try matching a different sub (Adire, Velodyne, something like that in there) and seeing how that works as far as tightening the bass up and making it more accurate. Per the OP's concern about frequency response in the range of vocals, I find the Z-5500s to be rather lacking there. They're adequate, but there's just no sparkle or emotion to vocals compared to headphones.

I have never heard the HFI 780's so I don't know how their S-Logic sound stage compares to the Pro 750's (which I have heard). I assume the sound stage is similar but, again, that is only an assumption on my part.
In my signature area there is a link called "The Sound of the Pro (Proline) 750 Headphones". On the first post of that thread, I describe in detail how I hear the sound stage of the Proline 750 which is met with some disbelief and disagreement later in the thread as well as some agreement.
The situation I was describing in this thread, where the orchestra was playing music by Mozart, the separation of the different instruments as you hear them seemed to be stronger and more definitively separated than usual causing the effect of a surround sound speaker system at very close range. As described in the other thread I mentioned earlier, I heard sounds outside of my head with the Pro 750's before, but the surround effect was more subtle as compared to hearing the surround effect with the Mozart orchestra music. The point is the effect came through very strong with this music, in particular.
Let us know what effect on the sound the poly filling has.

 

[Meliboeus]

Quote:

Originally Posted by wilashort /img/forum/go_quote.gif Agree, for that reason i sold my speakers, and find an alternative to replace them here; and in much aspects, i found it. The privacy to listen music/movies at the volume that you like without bother your family, as before did occur...; And the accoustics were bad (and get worse...), in my small room for speakers. Now i haven't to worry about that.

I think that is the point : better price/performance ratio of phones is important, but i think privacy and isolation from external noises is why headphones had been invented, their main purpose...even if i set up a speaker setup i don't think i could use it...i do not live alone...well my father may enjoy Rush or Yes...perhaps some Sabbath...some oldschool thrash may at least not be annoying..but i don't think he is much into Death or Nile, definitely not...

 

[Gao]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kernmac /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hi Gao, There are more comfortable headphones out there (A900 probably amongst them) however unless you have a large head and ears and a particularly weak neck these will be fine. (Not meaning to be rude) I wear them for 3- 4 hours at a time without any issues, and musical bliss straight from a DAP and portable amp. Cheers Kernmac

Aww I have a big head ... I have some old headphones and they keep slipping off because my head is too big. Do you think this will be a problem with the ultrasone pro 550s? Could you take a picture of yourself wearing them please

"As with the other Ultrasone models, the 550 feels lightweight, and the headband is adjustable to ensure a secure fit; the earpieces fold up for easy transport. The headphone was quite comfortable and sealed out much of the external noise I purposely piped into the studio." - lol a website says they feel lightweight

 

[DemonicLemming]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Pinna /img/forum/go_quote.gif I have never heard the HFI 780's so I don't know how their S-Logic sound stage compares to the Pro 750's (which I have heard). I assume the sound stage is similar but, again, that is only an assumption on my part. In my signature area there is a link called "The Sound of the Pro (Proline) 750 Headphones". On the first post of that thread, I describe in detail how I hear the sound stage of the Proline 750 which is met with some disbelief and disagreement later in the thread as well as some agreement. The situation I was describing in this thread, where the orchestra was playing music by Mozart, the separation of the different instruments as you hear them seemed to be stronger and more definitively separated than usual causing the effect of a surround sound speaker system at very close range. As described in the other thread I mentioned earlier, I heard sounds outside of my head with the Pro 750's before, but the surround effect was more subtle as compared to hearing the surround effect with the Mozart orchestra music. The point is the effect came through very strong with this music, in particular. Let us know what effect on the sound the poly filling has.

I think the S-Logic would work in the same general sense across all headphones models that have it....just wasn't sure if the 750s had it or not.

I do agree on the instrument separation with my Ultrasones...I've listened to some songs that really made me feel as if I was sitting in a chair in the middle of a room, and the music was taking place all around me. Drums coming from behind me and to my left, brass from the front right, vocals directly ahead, etc. I haven't tried any orchestral music as of yet, but I've noticed Nik Bartsch's Ronin consistently causes effects like that.

Will do on the polyfill...hoping it allows the sub to go a bit deeper and with a bit more authority, and takes some of the "hollowness" away from the satellite speakers. We'll see. I'm used to MDF when it comes to driver enclosures, but it seems like plastic would cause a lot more resonance and backwave issues, especially without any fill, so it's a bit surprising to me that there's nothing in there. Ah well, least it leaves the door open for some experimentation.

 

[Kernmac]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gao /img/forum/go_quote.gif Aww I have a big head ... I have some old headphones and they keep slipping off because my head is too big. Do you think this will be a problem with the ultrasone pro 550s? Could you take a picture of yourself wearing them please "As with the other Ultrasone models, the 550 feels lightweight, and the headband is adjustable to ensure a secure fit; the earpieces fold up for easy transport. The headphone was quite comfortable and sealed out much of the external noise I purposely piped into the studio." - lol a website says they feel lightweight

Hi again Gao,
The reason I say that comfort may be different if someone has a bigger head or ears is that these features will affect how any closed circumaural headphone fits. Bigger ears mean that they may rub on the earcups and bigger head means the clamping of a fon may be greater. I don't have any issues with my Proline 550 in either regard, however others may. Taking a photo of my head wearing them, isn't going to tell you much. Stop beating yourself up over what problems you may have, wait till you get them and experience their wonderful versatile and powerful bass sound (although not going to be able to compete with the slightly boomy bass of the 10 inch sub of your Z5500). As for weight, the Pro 550 aren't heavy fons (actual weight) but design wise they feel heavier than they should, weight distribution isn't fantastic and the headband pad is relatively small. They are fine on me, however others have stated that they are heavy and not overly comfortable for long headtime. Opinions are funny, and some reviews on the net are just plain BS. So chill Gao, you will love the Pro 550 probably more suited to a person who loves their Logitech Z5500 sound more than most other headphones. The Z5500's are probably equivalent to the Senn HD212 pro sound (in headphone terms) and the Ultrasones blow them out of the water. If they are uncomfortable to you, then you will need to look at ways of making them more comfortable (change ear pads, stretch the band over a wide box (carefully) or get a more padded headband etc) or sell them and move on.

That's it from me. Cheers

 

[Wilashort]

Yeah, the reason why i sell my speakers, is that those 50 Watts of RMS, bother to my father (...he hit my door, asking me to lower the volume (and making that, kills the emotion to listen my music, and killing my desire to listen to music with speakers....)) and that bother me too. But i did liked a lot that my neighbours listen the music that i like a lot,

.
But, not all the headphones make that you listen to music privately (most open headphones leak a lot of sound to the exterior), but are much better than speakers in that aspect, because the sound is not heared in all the house.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Meliboeus /img/forum/go_quote.gif I think that is the point : better price/performance ratio of phones is important, but i think privacy and isolation from external noises is why headphones had been invented, their main purpose...even if i set up a speaker setup i don't think i could use it...i do not live alone...well my father may enjoy Rush or Yes...perhaps some Sabbath...some oldschool thrash may at least not be annoying..but i don't think he is much into Death or Nile, definitely not...

 

[pbirkett]

I'm one of those people who generally always prefers speakers. In fact I might have started one or two threads on here on the subject. In fact, until recently I had not found anything I liked listening to as much as my speakers, a pair of Rega Ela powered from an HK6550 amp.

However, I now have the HD600, and they have changed all that. This comment might make you think they are the first decent headphones i've had, but in fact i've had the HD650, Proline 2500, DT880, DT990, CD3000 among others, and the HD600 just seem to slot perfectly in my rig.

I still think that if my circumstances were better I would still choose speakers, but I now no longer feel like wearing the headphones are a compromise now that I found a pair I really like.

Ultimately though, headphones ARE a compromise since they are strapped right to your ears, and therefore are somewhat unnatural in their presentation. They are at an immediate disadvantage. However, a good pair of headphones in a synergistic setup can still be very enjoyable, and I'd bet that you would get a far better sound than any consumer level computer speaker set, and in reality, I think audiophile speakers will only ever be significantly better in a properly treated room. Mine aren't, and I would probably still choose speakers in preference, but only just. It is a close run thing, and to be honest, the headphones have a lot going for them that the speakers dont, that is, in my case, the ability to play them at a decent volume for more of the time without pissing everyone off!

 

[dallan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donunus /img/forum/go_quote.gif My hd600s are actually very decent on my ipod surely better than any computer speaker ive heard IMHO. Not as good as $2000 monitor speakers from say...hmm harbeth though

Okay but i consider my senn 650s worthless with out an amp, i would just switch to a lower ohm pair and trash them. Some of my other headphones are at least tolerable unamped though the amp even helps them.

 

[geniebomb]

I just recently bought a set of Swans M10 2.1 speakers, and I am really enjoying them. The amount of bass coming from these is overwhelming though, compared to the HD580's that I normally listen to. I've turned the bass almost all the way down on the M10's, and these are even supposed to be bass-lite. These speakers also give me a much different sense of where the sound is coming from. I was somewhat surprised from this, seeing as how HD580's are supposed to have large sound stages.

I've never compared my HD580's to a decent(meaning not crap) pair of speakers, but I wasn't expecting that I'd want to listen to these $100 speakers more than my headphones.

To the OP, it's best to try both speakers and headphones, and just see which one you prefer. If you worry too much about what is supposed to sound better, you'll end up listening to other people's opinions instead of your own. In the end, if you enjoy a so called "lower quality" piece of hardware better, then what's wrong with that?

 

[fmplautus]

I don't want to retrace old discussions, but I have only heard one headphone that betters some of the best high end systems as far as balance, soundstage and imaging -- the AKG K-1000. There are some very specific technical and design reasons why these headphones are so amazing, and there is an AKG white paper on the subject.

I've own and have owned Sennheiser 600s, Grado 225s, Akg K501s, Etymotics etc. None of these compare with good to great high end speakers as far as stereo imaging. They simply can't because they don't take into account our listening anatomy. The Akg k-1000s do -- that's why they look so weird and sound so great.

 

[troymadison]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fmplautus /img/forum/go_quote.gif I don't want to retrace old discussions, but I have only heard one headphone that betters some of the best high end systems as far as balance, soundstage and imaging -- the AKG K-1000. There are some very specific technical and design reasons why these headphones are so amazing, and there is an AKG white paper on the subject. I've own and have owned Sennheiser 600s, Grado 225s, Akg K501s, Etymotics etc. None of these compare with good to great high end speakers as far as stereo imaging. They simply can't because they don't take into account our listening anatomy. The Akg k-1000s do -- that's why they look so weird and sound so great.

 

[Wmcmanus]

The answers are both and yes. Yes, I like both headphones and speakers.

 

[krmathis]

fmplautus. Yeah, there sure are something special with the K1000.

 

[MeanWillieGreen]

I believe the two experiences are so completely different that I can't compare them.

I have some AWESOME front speakers - great for rock and pop, acoustic, orchestral, movies; some decent surrounds for movies, so when I want to listen to music and have other stuff giong, the speakers take me there - very fast and often - to that place of enjoyment.

I just received a pair of AKG K701s, so after they are broken in, that will be a trip into another universe. I have owned ok headphones in the past, but used them only when everyone was asleep. I have borrowed some great AKGs and have been able to do some meditation and travel into another plane of existence - the music gets in your head with phones in a way that I cannot duplicate with speakers. I can seal out the outside world and go exactly wher I want to go with phones.

My experiences are so completely different, it is just a differenttype of listening and experience, for me.