[Licz]

My last post here was 9 years ago. Damn it time flies. The Grados I bought on your advice have served me well and I'm counting on you again!
 

1. For listening to opera and classical.
2. Opera is more important than classical. For classical, time spent is concerts > chamber music > symphonic.
3. The headphones need to be tolerant to bad quality 60s/70s recordings.
4. Will be buying an amp after I choose the headphone.
5. Budget is $500-$700 for lightly used cans.

 
After some reading I have my eyes on these (top contenders bolded):
 

1. HiFiman HE-500, HE-560
2. Sennheiser HD 600, 650, 700, 800. HD800 is straining my budget but let's hear them opinions.
3. Grado GS1000

 
I'm leaning towards HE-560. I haven't heard any of those cans myself though. What would you advise? Thanks for all and any of your opinions!

 

[Montecristo]

First off, I am by no means the right person to give advice, but I can help you start.

The HD 800 are completely unforgiving of bad recordings, which is ironic because they are arguably the best, out of your selection, for your music preferences (at least for classical) I may be wrong but I'm fairly certain most of the higher end sennheiser models are unforgiving of bad recordings.

 

[PurpleAngel]

  My last post here was 9 years ago. Damn it time flies. The Grados I bought on your advice have served me well and I'm counting on you again!
 

1. For listening to opera and classical.
2. Opera is more important than classical. For classical, time spent is concerts > chamber music > symphonic.
3. The headphones need to be tolerant to bad quality 60s/70s recordings.
4. Will be buying an amp after I choose the headphone.
5. Budget is $500-$700 for lightly used cans.

 
After some reading I have my eyes on these:
 

1. HiFiman HE-500, HE-560
2. Sennheiser HD 600, 650, 700, 800. HD800 is straining my budget but let's hear them opinions.
3. Grado GS1000

 
I'm leaning towards HE-560. I haven't heard any of those cans myself though. What would you advise? Thanks for all and any of your opinions!

 
I would assume if you want headphones that work well with poor quality recordings, your going to want to buy cheap (garbage) headphones.
i would think any higher end headphone would really bring out the imperfections, in poorer quality recordings.

 

[Me x3]

  My last post here was 9 years ago. Damn it time flies. The Grados I bought on your advice have served me well and I'm counting on you again!
 

1. For listening to opera and classical.
2. Opera is more important than classical. For classical, time spent is concerts > chamber music > symphonic.
3. The headphones need to be tolerant to bad quality 60s/70s recordings.
4. Will be buying an amp after I choose the headphone.
5. Budget is $500-$700 for lightly used cans.

 
After some reading I have my eyes on these:
 

1. HiFiman HE-500, HE-560
2. Sennheiser HD 600, 650, 700, 800. HD800 is straining my budget but let's hear them opinions.
3. Grado GS1000

 
I'm leaning towards HE-560. I haven't heard any of those cans myself though. What would you advise? Thanks for all and any of your opinions!

Maybe you can share one or two links of those 60s/70s recordiings.
I could try them with my headphones and write a comment.
 
Most of the times, those headphones on the bright side are unforgiving of poorly recorded material.
Darker headphones like HD600 and HD650 are usually more forgiving.

 

[Licz]

  Maybe you can share one or two links of those 60s/70s recordiings.
I could try them with my headphones and write a comment.

I'd really appreciate that. Thank you. Two recordings from the late 60's. This one is a studio recording and on the good side of bad. This one is live. Alternative Spotify links: one and two.
 

  I would assume if you want headphones that work well with poor quality recordings, your going to want to buy cheap (garbage) headphones.
i would think any higher end headphone would really bring out the imperfections, in poorer quality recordings.

True that, depends how poor they are exactly though. See above for two examples.
 
Comparisons between the hp models that do not take into account the recording quality issue are highly welcome too. So far it's Montecristo for HD800.

 

[Youth]

I haven't tried any Grado headphones myself, but don't they have alot of treble? If so, and you like that, then I would suggest HD800.
 
Woops, didn't read it was for poor recording. You probably need a headphone that is forgiving for such recordings. HD650 might do the trick. 

 

[12many]

I am not an expert but I would think you want to match the headphone sound style or signature to what you prefer. Do you like a softer sound or a precise faster transition? More bass or a bit more treble.

Are you a using an amp? That may matter.

 

[Me x3]

  I'd really appreciate that. Thank you. Two recordings from the late 60's. This one is a studio recording and on the good side of bad. This one is live. Alternative Spotify links: one and two.

 
Listening! Started with K702.
 
Do you normally listen to music at loud (concert levels) or moderate volume?

 

[Licz]

   
Listening! Started with K702.
 
Do you normally listen to music at loud (concert levels) or moderate volume?

I'd say moderately loudly - as if I was sitting in the back of the concert hall. I once sat in the first row and got a full tenor's blast from about 1.5 meters. Yeah, I don't want that kind of volume ever again!

 

[Me x3]

Please take this for what it is. Sighted, biased and pretty fast listening impressions. I haven't listened to the songs more than 2 times with each headphone.
Hopefully not, but my impressions can change a bit with time. You know how this works.
 
I've used Schiit Modi 2 Uber and Schiit Asgard 2 too drive the headphones.
 
Ok, here we go:
 
Pavarotti's Legendary High C 's: 
 
K702 (bumpless): 
First thing that stands out is the wide and deep soundstage, plenty of separation and space. 
Overall tonality is clearly on the light side of things. It's forward and demanding, but not harsh unless you crank the volume really high.
 
DT880 Pro 250 Ohm version:
Shinny strings and less upper midrange presence than K702, more relaxed.
Intimate and fuller soundstage. More Headphone-like than K702.
Overall tonality is balanced, slightly u shaped.
 
HD650 (the new one - black box):
More cohesive than DT880 and much more cohesive than K702. Lush vocals.
Overall tonality is full and detailed although not as airy as K702 or DT880.
Soundstage size is close to DT880.
All in all, a more laid back presentation.
 
HD800:
Smart cross-breed between K702 and DT880
Soundstage is K702-like but more focused and transparent. Not headphone-like.
Flaws are more evident with HD800, slight clips here and there.
Overall coldish, bright/shinny and light presentation. Superbly resolving but clinical.
Takes time to get used to, and even then it might not be as fun as you expect.
Personal preferences play a key role here.
 
T1 (Gen 1. Late s/n 16xxx):
Smooth vocals and detailed violins
The best headphone-like soundstage here.
Not the most expansive of the bunch, but still expansive and really focused.
Full but not laid back, smooth but not rolled off.
The top end is normally on the bright side but it's not that evident with this particular recording.
Vocals could have a bit more body, still not AKG-light.
 
Giacomo Aragall & Luciano Pavarotti Scene Romeo/Tebaldo I Capuleti e I Montecchi (Bellini)
 
Although I've taken separate notes for each headphone with this recording, I think I can put everything in a single text due to similarities.
Hiss is always there and there's noise and clipping all over the place. 
HD650 is the more forgiving of the bunch at the expense of some boominess.
Soundstage is really narrow and deep, especially with K702, T1 and to a lesser extent the HD800.
HD800 is clearly the most unforgiving by a good margin. Hiss is not as loud as expected but noises and clipping will make you jump out of your chair. Surely the worst pick for flawed recordings. 
While HD650 gets the job done, do not expect magic, it's still a very detailed headphone so most flaws will be there anyway, just a bit softer.

 

Hope you find this useful!

 

[Licz]

Thanks man. That's really helpful.
 
Quote:

HD800:
Overall coldish, bright/shinny and light presentation. Superbly resolving but clinical.
Takes time to get used to, and even then it might not be as fun as you expect.
Personal preferences play a key role here.

 

That doesn't sound like my kind of thing, especially for opera. I gather from your comments that the hp which produces the most lush/opulent/meaty (I mean the same by all three) vocal timbre is HD650?
 
You describe your HD650 as (the new one - black box). From what I've read there are only two versions of HD650s, the silver driver and dark driver ones, and the box does not determine the version (there are silver driver ones sold in the grey box). Is this right?
 
I now think it'd be better to disregard completely how the hp performs with a recording as bad as the second one you listened to. This is too stringent a requirement. If it turns out unlistenable, I always have my KSC 75.
 
I'd be grateful if someone with experience with HE-560 would chime in. I've searched the hp's mega-thread for 'opera', but there are only a few posts and none of them substantial.

 

[Lorspeaker]

http://www.zmfheadphones.com/order-the-zmf/fostex-t50rp-mk-iii-with-zmf-pads

 

[Me x3]

  That doesn't sound like my kind of thing, especially for opera. I gather from your comments that the hp which produces the most lush/opulent/meaty (I mean the same by all three) vocal timbre is HD650?
 
Me x3: Yes, the HD650 is the more opulent sounding and the less picky of the bunch.
 
You describe your HD650 as (the new one - black box). From what I've read there are only two versions of HD650s, the silver driver and dark driver ones, and the box does not determine the version (there are silver driver ones sold in the grey box). Is this right?
 
Me x3: Yes, pick one with the black box if you have the chance in order to be sure of getting a new stock headphone. 
Silent changes happens. Not necessarily the case, but you know...
 
I now think it'd be better to disregard completely how the hp performs with a recording as bad as the second one you listened to. This is too stringent a requirement. If it turns out unlistenable, I always have my KSC 75.
 
I'd be grateful if someone with experience with HE-560 would chime in. I've searched the hp's mega-thread for 'opera', but there are only a few posts and none of them substantial.
 
Me x3: From what I've read, and some measurments the HE-560 should be a tad brighter than HD650, especially around 4kHz.
While a bit more capable here and there it's surely more picky.

 

[Invocation]

Hmmm, I never call a recording from 60s or 70s as "bad quality"... It seems a dilemma that for a really poor recording you need both as much as "non-noise" details and as little as "noise", which seems a mission impossible.
Just curious anyone here particularly like accoustic or early electric recordings (1900-1930)? I am wondering what is a good headphone for recordings of that period.

 

[Kozic]

Beyerdynamic T-1 1st gen or T-90 are great for classical and female vocals. The T-1 2sd gen maybe fine too but I have not heard them.