HD650 vs. HD600
Oct 30, 2003 at 5:18 PM Thread Starter Post #1 of 27

slidescanner

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I know I'm not the first... but still I hope that my comparison review of these two products is helpful to those interested.

System: NAD 502 CD player with dead display (I KNOW! I need to get a new machine - I'm thinking about one of those combo players ) hooked up direct to a Headroom Max. The cool thing here is that the Max has two headphone outputs, so I could compare the different headphones one after the other very quickly. I left the filter and processing off...

I've been a long-time fan of the HD600, and I've used these headphones with the stock cable and with a Cardas cable for many years. Overall, I really enjoy the speed, sonic accuracy, transparency and good ambience details that these 'phones offer. The few complaints I've had include:

1. Stock cable sucks.
2. Low bass extension seems lacking, or perhaps there's extension but not "support".
3. There's a tiny bit of excessive detail in the upper mids, yielding a somewhat "plasticky" or "grainy" feel on certain source music.

For instance, with string orchestra, there seems to be just a *touch* of harshness on certain passages.

First Impressions of the 650

Immediately upon putting these headphones on, I noticed that they are more efficient than the 600s. As I listened more, I came to think that the greater efficiency might be predominantly in the bass, and that the upper mids might be right at the same level as with the 600s. So to me, at least, it sounds as if the whole sonic balance is tipped up in the bass when compared to the 600.

Strings sound sweeter, no doubt. The edge is gone. There seems to be more overall "support" to the sound, with a richness and involvement not quite present in the 600s. Meatier low strings and the upright bass is clearly more noticeable.

Different styles...

So then I put on some solo piano music (Rachmanninoff Preludes) and noticed very similar things. The attack with the 600s seems slightly over-emphasized, and is more laid-back with the 650s. More bass support, particularly with the really low notes and bass attacks on the piano. Fuller sounding. More involving. More "there". Whereas the 600s give a "in front of your face" perspective, and the ambience sounds clear but somewhat "analytical", the 650s involved me more, and made it seem more like "being there" in the room with the piano. The ambience was very realistic, and sounded "warm" instead of clinical.

I then switched to KD Lang "All You Can Eat" to get a female pop voice and some good, clear production. The track "Acquiesce" has some nice clean bass, clear vocal, and interesting ambient stuff going on. Here, I again noticed the greater support in the lows, slightly more laid back feeling, less sibilance on the vocals. One thing that really stuck out to me, though, was the hi-hat and cymbals. With the 600s, the hi-hat had a "tsst tsst tsst" sound, with more sizzle on top than body. With the 650, there was body to the sound, and more realistic "metal" tones. Smoother. Same with cymbal hits. Very nice!

Onto Symphonic

For the "finale" I listened to a fairly long segment of Mahler's 5th Symphony on Telarc. One of my favorite symphonic recordings, with plenty of weight and clarity, without sounding analytical at all.

The same things were observed here: more support, sweeter strings, more relaxed in the heavy hits (where the 600 could tend to sound just a touch "pinched") but without sounding compressed at all.

Conclusions

First, let me say that I liked the 650 a lot. Overall, I found it to be a more easlily listenable headphone. Once I gleaned enough info as to the differences between these two models, I ended up just relaxing and listening to the rest of Mahler's 5th. This is not common for me! Usually, I listen to a few songs, or a movement of a symphony, etc. But instead, I got lost in the music and just enjoyed it!

The 650 is not perfect, however, For my taste, I would like there to be just a *tad* more extension on the top. But I'm willing to admit that my NAD CD player may be the limiting factor. And I'd also ask for there to be just a *scant* less at 120Hz or so. It just seems that these headphones are slightly to the "sweet" side of things, and I miss a bit of the "speed" of the 600s. However, if I had to pick one or the other, I would choose the 650 in a second. It's just more musical!

PS

A few months ago I listened to the Grado RS1. Overall, I'm not a huge fan of the Grado 'phones because they aren't nearly as comfortable as the Sennheisers. But I liked the sound, and felt that there was a sweetness and involvement that in some ways, the HD600 lacked. Well, I've got news for you. The 650 is the answer... More real than the RS1, and more comfortable.
 
Oct 30, 2003 at 5:26 PM Post #3 of 27
Thanks, slidescanner, very nice! I simply can't wait to hear them! Where did you get your pair by the way?
 
Oct 30, 2003 at 5:37 PM Post #4 of 27
Hey slidescanner -> great review, and comparo. The 650's seem to do what the 600's do, but only a little bit better, which can't be a bad thing. BTW, were in the hell did you get your 650's, I didn't think they were availible in the U.S yet?
 
Oct 30, 2003 at 7:33 PM Post #7 of 27
Slidescanner,


If you dont mind me asking, how long did you break in the hd650s' and did you use the cardas with them?

What did you use to amplify them>? cd jack?

Thanks a bunch!

Oh, I agree the yba Integrated rules! I had an Audio Refinement hooked up to some ACI saphire IIIs and it was a sweet set up.

k.s.
 
Oct 30, 2003 at 7:42 PM Post #8 of 27
Hi KShaft. I broke these in for about 1 day by looping a pop CD (I think it was Floyd The Wall), at a little higher volume than I would normally listen. They could probably use more burn-in, but it was enough (IMO) to get them at least 90% there. That final 10% of burn in I find takes another week, but the differences are more subtle.

My hookup was CD>Max via line inputs. Since the Integra DT doesn't have a headphone out or line out, it's not the most convenient setup... If I want to do serious HD listening, I unhook the CD from the integrated amp and plug it into the Max.
 
Oct 30, 2003 at 7:56 PM Post #9 of 27
Geat comparison. Thanks alot.
 
Oct 30, 2003 at 8:38 PM Post #10 of 27
Quote:

Originally posted by slidescanner
So to me, at least, it sounds as if the whole sonic balance is tipped up in the bass when compared to the 600...............

The attack with the 600s seems slightly over-emphasized, and is more laid-back with the 650s...................

For my taste, I would like there to be just a *tad* more extension on the top.............

It just seems that these headphones are slightly to the "sweet" side of things, and I miss a bit of the "speed" of the 600s


Sounds like I'm better off sticking with my HD600. This HD650 description would appear to indicate a very mellow and bland headphone.
 
Oct 30, 2003 at 8:44 PM Post #11 of 27
Quote:

Originally posted by Beagle
Sounds like I'm better off sticking with my HD600. This HD650 description would appear to indicate a very mellow and bland headphone.


I got just the opposite impression from JaZZ's review. Perhaps best to wait for more reviews (including some professional ones), and not to take first impressions (and with very little break-in) like they were long-term impressions.
 
Oct 30, 2003 at 9:11 PM Post #12 of 27
Wow, I get to *agree* with fewtch for once.
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I think it's going to be a while before we get enough impressions from enough different people with different systems to get anything like a "consensus" on how the 650s sound. (OTOH, people *still* argue about the HD600s dance of the seven veils.
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Quote:

This HD650 description would appear to indicate a very mellow and bland headphone.


As opposed to the "exciting" HD600s?
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I wonder if the HD650s aren't actually just a lot cleaner and less grainy than the HD600s and that's what people are reacting to?
 
Oct 30, 2003 at 9:11 PM Post #13 of 27
Nice review. Thanks!

--Chris
 
Oct 30, 2003 at 10:06 PM Post #14 of 27
Quote:

Originally posted by Beagle
This HD650 description would appear to indicate a very mellow and bland headphone.


It is a mellow headphone, but certainly not bland. It has just too much detail and fascination to offer. But I agree with slidescanner: it's not perfect.

After 24 hours of break in with extremely loud, bass heavy music, bass control fully turned up, there was still a bit too much bass around 100 or 120 Hz, but the next 6 hours changed the balance; now the mids seemed to somewhat outshine the bass.

I guess that's the problem with the HD 650 in the present state (120 hours of operation) and the cause for its mediocre suitability for rock: there's a slight lower-midrange emphasis. Combined with the ultra-smooth treble this can produce the impression of lacking liveliness and even extension.


Mark...
...yes, it's much cleaner and absolutely free of grain. But I'm sure it can't compete with the CD 3000 when it comes to treble intensity.


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Oct 30, 2003 at 10:16 PM Post #15 of 27
Thanks for the reply!

I didnt see a headphone amp in your profile. Guess a max aint half bad!

k.s.

This bass and treble thing has me concerned. I may stick with the hd 600s as well. They were really amazing with the cary, so of course I had to sell it
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stupid,stupid,stupid!
k.s.
 

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