Havi b3 pro 1 thread 2.0
Jun 5, 2015 at 9:07 PM Post #961 of 2,486
  Congratulations! I just received both of those for my birthday and I'm actually knee deep in a head-to-head comparison of both models to the Zero Audio ZH-DWX10 Duoza, which has been my go-to IEM for months. My primary source is also a DX90, although I amp it with a JDS Labs Objective 2.
 
Give those things each about 200 hours to burn in before really making any decisions about them. I know it made a tremendous difference for me. But most of all, enjoy.


I did try both for a few hours and right out of the box im enjoying the titan 1 more than the havi b3 pro1 .  the titan 1 gave me the wow factor , the sound is lively , energetic , large soundstage , it is very detailed and its bass  I like a lot , the attack is also very much there . .
the havi b3 pro 1 sounds thin , I observed it is so nice with acoustic music  but not so much with rock . it is also nice with cello / instrumental .  the mid range I thought was quite nice , the soundstage is also good , the bass is thin
 
its like the havi b3 pro1 is a sennheiser hd800  being powered by a  mid fi amp and the titan 1 is like an HE6 hifiman being powered by a speaker amp
 
ill let both burn in some more and ill post more impressions
 
Jun 5, 2015 at 11:25 PM Post #962 of 2,486
I've been one of the most ardent supporters of the Zero Audio ZH-DWX10 Duozas here on Head-Fi since I received my pair from Amazon JP several months ago. Their soundstage, separation, bass impact, build quality, and comfort factor all impressed me from day one and I fell deeply in love with them almost overnight. They were nearly all I've listened to for several months, while my secret late-night rendezvous with my RE-400s became progressively less frequent.
 
My birthday was May 27th and now I own both the Titan 1s and Havi B3 Pro 1s. What follows are my attempts to carefully compare each of these IEMs' total performance to the Duozas', which are first described in detail and then used as a baseline for comparison. I hope this is of value to someone on the fence between two or all of these 'phones. It is my first attempt at such a thorough comparison.
 
[Most of this content was cross-posted to the official threads for the Zero Audio ZH-DWX10 Duoza thread and DUNU Titan 1s.]
 
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Disclaimer: I'm not what you could call a "true" audiophile. I'm more like Brooko, who considers himself to be a deeply passionate music fan. I don't have the most exquisitely trained ears, nor am I capable of volume matching, measuring SPLs, etc. My impressions are as honest as I can make them, but that's all they are in the end: my own subjective impressions. My observations are generalized, without track-by-track analysis, except where specifically noted.
 
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Source: FiiO X1 (FW 1.3) > Topping NX1 (high gain)
 
Tracks used (all songs ripped in 44.1kHz/16bit ALAC):
 
  1. Nightbringer - "Rite of the Slaying Tongue," from Hierophany of the Open Grave (Bandcamp)
  2. Vials of Wrath - "In Sackcloth and Ashes," from Seeking Refuge (Bandcamp)
  3. Massive Attack - "Black Milk," from Mezzanine (Youtube)
  4. Glitch Mob - "Becoming Harmonious," from Love, Death, Tragedy (Youtube)
  5. Keb' Mo' - "Soon as I Get Paid," from Slow Down (Youtube)
  6. Eric Clapton - "Third Degree," from From the Cradle (Youtube)
 
Relevant:
 
  1. All three IEMs are currently sporting medium JVC Spiral Dot tips.
  2. The Duozas are my baseline for comparison, as I have owned them several months longer than the Titans and Havis.
  3. Volume levels remained consistent between the Duozas and Titans, and were raised for the Havis to approximate volume matching, since they basically drink electricity.
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Zero Audio ZH-DWX10 Duoza (baseline for comparison)
 
Soundstage and presentation
An expansive soundstage with excellent width and above average depth is complemented by fairly fantastic instrumental placement and "3-D" presentation. Vocals sound extremely natural and are featured prominently in the mix, neither too forward nor recessed at all. Track-induced sibilance is virtually nonexistent. Detail retrieval is impressive but at times densely layered samples and instruments blend and become a touch muddied. The Duozas are generally fast enough for rock and metal, but tremelo riffing, rapid picking, and double-bass drumwork whose recording feels soft or muted can occasionally blend together and lose distinction between notes.
 
Bass
The sub-bass has a rich presence that complements electronica beautifully; however, the Duozas may not be fast enough to satisfy hardcore genre fans. These things rumble deeply, providing enough slam that the pulsating bassline in "Black Milk" kissed the backs of my eyeballs—although this smothered a lot of the gentle static pops that lend the song a "vinyl" texture. While the sub-bass cannot help but occasionally encroach on the mids, it is generally well-behaved and unobtrustive. "In Sackcloth and Ashes" concludes with an extraordinarily natural sounding rainstorm amidst a forest, complete with bird songs and massive thunderclaps. Of the three pairs of IEMs I am comparing, the Duozas crack and snarl with an unrivaled intensity here; and the substantial weight added by the sub-bass makes the thunder feel like the finger of God in your ears at high volume.
 
Mids
The Duozas' mids sound gorgeous, with everything from digital samples to guitar tones—both acoustic and overdriven electric—feeling full-bodied and appropriately natural. As mentioned earlier, both male and female vocals are both well-placed and realistic in timbre. Elizabeth Fraser's ethereal harmonies in "Black Milk" are perfectly seductive and breathy, while Eric Clapton's chain-smoking blues rasp is gritty and conveys a wealth of raw emotion. The downsides here are that, particularly in "iffy" recordings, loose sub-bass can infringe on the lower mids and a the Duozas could use a touch more speed.
 
Treble
If the Duozas have a particular weakness in their signature it is that the treble is perhaps too relaxed and smooth, with obvious roll-off, although I cannot determine where exactly this occurs. On one hand, they have never once caused fatigue; however, this comes at the cost of both energy and open-ness. (This was especially evident throughout Nightbringer's suffocatingly dense nightmare fuel, where the enthusiastic lows and rolled-off highs led to congestion and loss of detail that neither the Titans nor the Havis suffered from.) During quieter passages across every genre I've sampled, though, even the airiest of brushwork on cymbals and subtle keyboards present themselves adequately. The Duozas' upper end isn't fundamentally broken; it is just readily surpassed by other options in and around its price range.
 
Comfort
Of the three pairs listed here, the Duozas are by far the most comfortable and the ones I am able to wear for the longest without physical fatigue. I have slept (on my back) with these things in my ears through more nights than I can remember, and despite their large shells they have rarely, if ever, fallen out. I can chew gum or eat with them in without them shaking loose, and if my fat ass would get up and run once in a while I think they would actually remain secure through jogging. (Of course, as with all things, this is tip-dependent and "YMMV.") I couldn't rightfully ask for anything more than the Duozas offer in a universal IEM.
 
Build Quality
In a word, amazing. The unorthodox shape and considerable length of these IEMs are betrayed by their remarkable lightness: I could not feel the difference between the two while holding one Duoza shell in my left hand and another from my HiFiMan RE-400s in the right. They feel extremely solid and feature great strain reliefs; however, the angled plug could be better reinforced and the cable cinch is on the loose side. I do adore the cable itself, which is soft to the touch and supple. It never tangles or kinks and almost immediately lost its memory despite having been tied up very tightly in the package. Seriously, if I could recable all of my IEMs with what Zero Audio has going on here I would pet them for pleasure.
One problem I've experienced with the Duozas that others have also reported (although I cannot call it universal) is driver flex. Straight out of the box, my right channel has had the worst driver flex I've ever heard in my life—but only during insertion and vigorous readjustment. This seems to have improved slightly over the past few months.
 
Packaging & Accessories
The Duozas ship in a very plain plastic-and-cardboard box, secured with twist ties. While I forget the exact count, the only included accessories are three or four pairs of silicone tips (which I immediately replaced) and a soft cloth bag with a drawstring. This offers little to no protection to the IEMs, but is considerably less bulky in your pocket than other brands' hard cases. Make of that whatever you will, according to your own preferences and needs.
 
Overall 
Prior to having written this comparison I would have implored everyone reading this to mail $100 USD to anyone, anywhere in Japan as quickly as possible, hoping to get a pair of these in return. I still love their signature, which combines vibrant mids and rich, deep bass with smoothed-out, fatigue-free treble; however, as the remainder of this write-up should convey, while the Duozas are a solid standalone package their best qualities are individually eclipsed by other alternatives. If you enjoy polite treble and exuberant bass and want an enormous sound stage with lovely separation, then these just might be your best sub-$100 option. If you need something bright, with shark-like attack, the speed of a hornet, and "audiophile-grade" clarity then these are not your IEMs.
 
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DUNU Titan 1 (as compared directly to the Zero Audio ZH-DWX10 Duoza)
 
Soundstage and Presentation
The Titan 1s' soundstage is comparable to the Duoza's, although it feels like it differs dimensionally: I think it's slightly deeper and more open vertically, albeit perhaps slightly narrower than Zero Audio's. Instrumental separation likewise feels quite similar, with the brighter Titan 1s feeling more spacious and less prone to congestion. The overall sound signature is much more forward, or aggressive, than the Duozas'; somehow these things explode with energy and convey a greater sense of intimacy without sacrificing their spaciousness. By way of awkward comparison, if the Duozas feel like sitting in the first few rows at a metal concert then the Titans place you directly on the floor below the band—but with enough personal space to not to feel groped by moshers. While this presentation is bold and exciting it is also inherently more prone to causing listening fatigue.
The music is expressed with a full body and with excellent detail retrieval: subtle background effects like the aforementioned static in "Black Milk" are never buried by the robust low end and the dizzying synth lines in "Becoming Harmonious" are well articulated as they pan in and out, flirting with your ears like friendly hornets. In no uncertain terms, these are the faster of the two IEMs outlined so far; and they offer greater clarity of fine details, as well.
 
Bass
Tight, deep, and with a better balance between mid- and sub-bass, the Titan 1s' low end also has a authoritative punch that you can feel in your eyes. It is even more restrained from obscuring the mids, however, making it the better behaved and more well-rounded option in this department. (While the Titans are known for having a V- or U-shaped signature, I perceive the emphases at both ends of the spectrum to be respectful of the mids.) Simply put, these things thump and hum beautifully. The Titans fall slightly behind the Duozas in capturing the ferocity of the storm at the end of "In Sackcloth and Ashes," but both the walking bass line throughout Keb' Mo's "Soon as I Get Paid" and the deep groove driving "Becoming Harmonious" are conveyed magically.
 
Mids
Powerful, clean, but slightly recessed, as one might expect from this signature. While the vocals do not feel artificial or veiled they are somewhat embedded deeper in the mix, which might be problematic if what you're listening to already shares this quality. In tearing through "Rite of the Slaying Tongue," the Duozas presented the snarling vocals more clearly (although the Rosetta Stone couldn't make them intelligible!) but the guitar "harmonies" (and here I use that word very loosely) were veiled and difficult to identify. Through the Titans I could immediately place the individual guitars more easily and discern their respective melodies (read: venom); however, the vocals weren't as front-and-center. This doesn't mean that they were buried, though—just dialed back a smidge in prominence. The clarity did not appear to suffer in the process. I felt as though Keb' Mo's voice was slightly more realistic through the Duozas, but if asked to I would be hard-pressed to explain the difference.
 
Treble
Far, far brighter than the Duozas, and with improved extension. The energy in the upper end of the spectrum not only opens the Titans up a great deal (without washing out darker music), but also adds to their impactful presentation. The decay on crash cymbals is particularly lovely, and is strictly superior to their competitors' output. There are balancing factors to these changes, though: poorly-recorded cymbals and vocals are more prone to sibilance and distortion than through the Duozas, and I think that at my normal listening volumes the Titans are actually trying to hospitalize me. I get listening fatigue within an hour every time I use them. (It's going to be a damn good hour, though.)
 
Comfort
Unequivocally less comfortable than the Duozas, even with the exact same tips inserted to a very similar depth, the Titans have the distinct advantage of keeping a zero or near-zero profile. This allows you to sleep on your sides with them inserted, which would be impossible with the other pair. (Warning: spouses, pets, significant others, and home invaders who share your bed might not appreciate your music as much as you do. Due to their ported design these things bleed sound almost as badly as open-backed cans.) Due to the physical and listening fatigue I experience while using them, I'd call the Titan 1s "tolerable" in this category. Using them for too long can even heighten my sensitivity to whichever pair I insert next. Meh.
 
Build Quality
Possibly bulletproof throughout the entire housing? Seriously, these things are solid. Slightly heavier than my other IEMs, feature short but sturdy strain reliefs, a functional cable cinch, and both the splitter and angled plug are constructed of metal. The cable feels slightly harder and more "plasticky" than the Duozas' down to the splitter, from where it is wrapped tightly in protective fibers until it terminates at the plug. It is a great deal like my RE-400s' cable. I like the added protection a great deal but mine came with a tiny snag that is quite obvious when I run my fingers along its length. The Titans also come with a soft rubber cable tie that slides freely up and down the insulated portion. It is easy to use and has never snagged on anything while I was wearing them.
 
Packaging and Accessories
Better than the Duozas, but falls quite short of other < $150 IEMs like the RHA MA-750(i). The Titans arrived in a snazzy box that actually reminded me of the $500 NuForce Primo 8s: it's made of sturdy cardboard and decorated all over with images and descriptions of its components and measurements. Included are a 3.5mm-to-6.3mm adaptor and shirt clip, as well as three sizes of silicone ear tips not unlike those supplied by the aforementioned MA750s. These I also replaced quickly with JVC Spiral Dots.
 
Finally, DUNU includes the most practical IEM carrying case I have ever seen. It is a black, slender rectangular box constructed of hard plastic on the outside and lined with a textured rubber molding. It snaps tightly closed, affording the earphones little movement at all. While it isn't large enough to hold much more than the IEMs themselves, it will keep them extremely safe from impacts. I don't know if it is water resistant; if anyone else would like to chuck their Titans in the toilet and report back to me, feel free to do so in the name of science.
 
Overall
These things are beastly all-rounders and they took me completely by surprise. Just a few days ago I posted in the Douza thread that I wasn't sure where all the Titan hype had come from, and now I get it. Something just clicked during a listening session and I couldn't escape the conclusion that these are badass IEMs. They can be a bit too aggressive and/or sibilant at times, and they aren't ruler flat, but they are well-built, lively, spacious, and bursting with clarity. I just wouldn't suggest listening to raw black metal or other horribly under-produced, tinny genres with them. That would probably just flat-out suck.
 
In many ways the Titan 1s are strictly superior to the Duozas; however, their tendency to cause fatigue and aggressive signature may be turnoffs for some. But if you want a pair of phones that will probably last for years and pair well with a huge variety of genres, these are going to be hard to beat.
 
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Havi B3 Pro 1 (as compared directly to the Zero Audio ZH-DWX10 Duoza)
 
Soundstage and Presentation
I won't beat around the bush, and neither will I exaggerate: the Havis' sound stage is colossal. Enormous. So wide and deep that virtually every time I wear them I physically reach up to check that they're still sealed in my ears—not because the bass has rolled off, but because IEMs should not sound this flipping huge! All of the space creates an out-of-head experience and there are songs I enjoy in which I absolutely swear the vocals come in from above and behind my entire head. These things extend to well behind my ears.
 
Instrumental separation is second to nothing I have ever heard in my life. I don't think my HD600s do it quite this well. The rapidly panned exchanges between guitars in "Soon as I Get Paid" are crystal clear and extremely fast. Clapton belts out lonely notes that decay faster than I can blink, but they present themselves assertively and with well-articulated twang. In "Black Milk" the gentle distortion that the Duozas obscured so often is present even during the loudest and most densely-layered stretches. I cannot bring myself to complain about the Havis' speed or detail. Rather, I would say that both exceed the Titans'.
 
Bass
A lot of people will find the Havis to be bass-light; however, I feel about these the same way I do about the RE-400s: it's exactly what it needs to be. Bass guitars have a natural and gutteral reverb to them, standing basses thump proudly, fleshing the music out without weighing it down; and even during "Black Milk"—where I expected the Havis to sound anemic—they pounded hard enough for me to clearly feel the pressure expand outward what felt like inside of my skull. The bass feels tight and accurate, without any hint of bloating whatsoever. The mid-bass is more prominent than the sub variety, for sure, but I have zero complaints about quantity or control.
 
Mids
Everything from down-tuned guitars to sorrowful female vocals exude detail and is conveyed beautifully by the combination of spectacular instrumental placement and spaciousness that allows for clarity across the board. Aside from the sound stage and separation of elements (which I cannot possibly praise enough), this is clearly the B3 Pro 1's strongest suit.
 
Treble
While I wouldn't call the B3 Pro 1's treble an Achilles' heel, exactly, it is less refined than the Titans'; and while it extends further than the Duozas' it is sometimes prone to graininess, depending on the recording. In a track not "officially" used for my A/B/C testing here—Finsterforst's "Mann Gegen Mensch"—the cymbals sounded a bit artificial, and the hardest hits had a mildly piercing quality to them. As I am sensitive to harsh treble, these are both a touch thinner and tinnier than I was hoping for.
 
Comfort
I'd place the Havis on par with the Titans in that both irritate my outer ear within an hour, despite using the same tips at a nearly identical depth. This is one of those things where one person's treasure is the next person's trash, I suppose, but I've had many other sets of IEMs that were far gentler on me. Nevertheless, I have little difficulty falling asleep with the Havis in, whether on my back or my side—as long as I nod off shortly after inserting them.
 
Build Quality
Solid but generally unremarkable. The Gorilla glass plating on the back of the housing catches fingerprints like crazy and is frankly indistinguishable from plastic even at close range. If Havi had hoped for the glass to really set them apart from their competitors aesthetically they should have used clear glass to expose the internal components. The strain reliefs seem adequate but unremarkable and the slider has just enough grip to be functional.
 
One thing I detest about the B3 Pro 1s is the cable. I've read that it's reinforced with kevlar and should therefore be quite strong, but I hate how flat and wide is it. This thing twists, folds over itself, and is impossible to keep completely relaxed. It also has a long memory for kinks and bends, so if you put it away all scrunched up it's going to fight your every effort to iron it back out. Bleh. Yuck.
 
Packaging and Accessories
The B3 Pro 1s came in a cardboard package quite typical of "budget-fi" IEMs. Inside of that was a sturdier, textured box with a magnetic flap that opened to the monitors nestled into a foam layer alongside two extra pairs of silicone tips of different sizes (one set was pre-mounted). Besides that there was a tiny micro-fiber cleaning cloth for the Gorilla glass, a pair of slip-on rubber ear guides, and two carrying cases: one hard, one soft. The soft one is virtually identical to the Duozas' pouch, while the hard case has a nice texture but retains quite a bit of flex. It's nearly twice the size of the Titans' hard case and probably offers half as much protection, but it does have a small net tie-back for holding the cord, extra tips, or a condom. Whatever, really.
 
The ear guides pale in comparison to the ones RHA built into the MA-750(i)s; however, they are surprisingly comfortable given their acutely angled form. They slide on quite easily, hold decently (although the cable will occasionally peek out at you in places), and come off easily enough not to raise concerns about cable damage. I could take 'em or leave 'em; they don't irritate the backs of my ears either way.
 
Overall
Even without factoring the price in these are phenomenal IEMs. I'm sure "true" audiophiles would complain about the treble quality or bring up the much-discussed channel imbalance measurements from InnerFidelity—but these are not marketed to the folks who line up to buy JH Audio's latest Siren Series. These are true budget-fi IEMs that produce a remarkably clean but imperfect sound that washes around and over you like deep water. They are absolutely worth the money if you go into the purchase knowing they are not bass monsters and do not have a crystalline upper end. Hell, they're worth much more than Havi's asking price.
 
Other users have remarked that the B3 Pro 1s are ideal for more relaxed listening (e.g., acoustic guitar, classical, and instrumental music). I would not disagree with this at all, but I would add that they're a wonderful way to give heavier music a completely different aesthetic without overtly coloring the sound. The expansive sound stage and division of instruments makes for a radically different experience than the Titans' in-your-face jubilation, and I find that both serve rock and metal quite well as long as you don't automatically equate unenhanced bass with underwhelming bass.
 
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Final Thoughts
 
At approximately $75, $100, and $140 USD, respectively, the Havi B3 Pro 1s, Zero Audio ZH-DWX10 Duozas, and DUNU Titan 1s are astounding IEMs for their price ranges. I would have gladly paid more for any of them, given their individual characteristics. Each of them has definitive strengths and weaknesses—although the perceptions thereof will, of course, vary from user to user.
 
  1. If you want a bassy IEM with a large sound stage, smooth treble, and don't mind a touch of bass bloat or sloth, go with the Duozas. You won't be disappointed.
 
  1. If your ideal IEM is exuberant to the point of occasional insensitivity, with mildly recessed mids, vibrant treble, and killer bass, buy the Titan 1s and send DUNU a "Thank you" card.
 
  1. If swimming through laid-back and balanced tones and honing in on specific instruments or samples is your ideal vacation, the Havis are calling your name.
 
Of course, as long as you can afford it there is little harm in owning them all . . . right? Sorry about your wallet.
 
Jun 6, 2015 at 1:01 AM Post #963 of 2,486
  At approximately $75, $100, and $140 USD, respectively, the Havi B3 Pro 1s, Zero Audio ZH-DWX10 Duozas, and DUNU Titan 1s are astounding IEMs for their price ranges.

These three are my top three favorites as well. Unfortunately my Havi came with some defect. The left and right are reversed. My Havi also doesn't sound as "expansive" as most people say so I wonder if this could also be a defect.
 

 
Jun 6, 2015 at 1:09 AM Post #964 of 2,486
Oh hey, cool picture!  You have great taste in IEMs. (And that's a fantastic quote in your signature, too.)
 
It's hard to convey the size of a soundstage in words alone, so I can't really help you there; however, if you already have one oddball defect like that, I'd opt for a replacement just to make sure. I'm sorry to hear you got a bum pair. It's always soul crushing to have a new set of headphones crap out on you. :frowning2:
 
Jun 6, 2015 at 2:00 AM Post #965 of 2,486
  These three are my top three favorites as well. Unfortunately my Havi came with some defect. The left and right are reversed. My Havi also doesn't sound as "expansive" as most people say so I wonder if this could also be a defect.
 

try different tips
i tried spinfit. it will  make havi's soundstage grander / expansive than stocktips. but it will make more laidback presentation
 
Jun 6, 2015 at 2:04 AM Post #966 of 2,486
I have my first pair of Spinfits shipping in from Japan as I type this. I didn't find a US vendor until after I'd arranged for a long-distance purchase. If I like what I hear, I'll pick up three more pairs domestically and see how they fit on my other IEMs. I've wanted to try Spinfits for a long time now but they're extremely hard to find and very expensive whenever I've seen them for sale.
 
EDIT: Whoops, you weren't even talking to me. /shame
 
Jun 6, 2015 at 2:39 AM Post #967 of 2,486
  These three are my top three favorites as well. Unfortunately my Havi came with some defect. The left and right are reversed. My Havi also doesn't sound as "expansive" as most people say so I wonder if this could also be a defect.

 
@rontant - soundstage perception can be dependent on a lot of different things - and I think individual preference and experience plays a role.
 
FWIW  - here's what i wrote about the Havi
 
It’s usually difficult to get a reasonable stage size from an inner ear monitor.  The stage is often quite small / close – with an average impression of space.  The Havi B3 however has an open and reasonably expansive stage for an IEM, and it is quite a surprise – especially for an IEM at this price point. The imaging is also extremely good with positioning appearing very precise. Sense of both depth and width is quite good – and if anything the stage feels perfectly natural rather than being overly done.  I had read a few reviews talking about a massive sound stage – and thankfully this is not what I’m experiencing.  There is enough space to go slightly “out of head” but not enough to make it seem unreal.   

 
I agree with you.  I've never experienced the massive sound stage so many reviews have mentioned.
 
Jun 6, 2015 at 2:46 AM Post #968 of 2,486
On the other hand, Brooko, I've never found my HD600s' sound stage (Note to self: that's two words, not one!) to be all that impressive despite many other people praising them for just that. I won't go so far as to say the Havis are comparable to full-sized cans; however, their sound stage is considerably more open than any other IEM I have ever used. I used to have a pair of NuForce Primo 8s which were $500 quad-driver balanced armature IEMs. Unfortunately, they never got along with my ear canals and I could never tame the hellish resonance that caused steep treble spikes and sibilance for me.
 
Anyway, I digress . . .
 
My ultimate point is that to my recollection the B3 Pro 1s absolutely rival the Primo 8s' sound stage and imaging, which were spectacular. To get that out of a < $80 USD IEM is completely ludicrous. 
 
Jun 6, 2015 at 3:45 AM Post #969 of 2,486
I personally never felt like the sound stage was incredibly impressive on the HD600. Better than many, but plenty of room to improve. I actually think the Fidelio X1s have a better sound stage than my HD600s. The Havi rates at least better than most in sound stage and for some people are among the very best. Just depends on the ears. For $60, you'll get no complaints from me
biggrin.gif

 
Jun 6, 2015 at 4:18 AM Post #971 of 2,486
   
@rontant - soundstage perception can be dependent on a lot of different things - and I think individual preference and experience plays a role.
 
FWIW  - here's what i wrote about the Havi
 
 
I agree with you.  I've never experienced the massive sound stage so many reviews have mentioned.

Phew.... what a great relief!  I guess I don't have to see an audiologist after all.  Thanks Brooko. 
o2smile.gif

 
Jun 6, 2015 at 4:50 AM Post #972 of 2,486
  On the other hand, Brooko, I've never found my HD600s' sound stage (Note to self: that's two words, not one!) to be all that impressive despite many other people praising them for just that. I won't go so far as to say the Havis are comparable to full-sized cans; however, their sound stage is considerably more open than any other IEM I have ever used. I used to have a pair of NuForce Primo 8s which were $500 quad-driver balanced armature IEMs. Unfortunately, they never got along with my ear canals and I could never tame the hellish resonance that caused steep treble spikes and sibilance for me.
 
Anyway, I digress . . .
 
My ultimate point is that to my recollection the B3 Pro 1s absolutely rival the Primo 8s' sound stage and imaging, which were spectacular. To get that out of a < $80 USD IEM is completely ludicrous. 

 
Oh I agree.  The HD600 has a nice open stage - but it isn't expansive like the AKGs (6/7 series) of HD700 / HD800 or even T1.  I've always thought of it as intimate jazz club sort of size.  And IMO that is just perfect for me :)
 
I think people rave about the expansiveness of the Havi because they're not used to a wider staging on an IEM.  Like I said before - it depends on your reference point. 
 
Jun 6, 2015 at 4:53 AM Post #973 of 2,486
In this hobby absolutely everything depends on your reference point.
 
Jun 6, 2015 at 11:21 AM Post #974 of 2,486
  I guess people with a huge soundstage may have a too shallow insertation with the B3 Pro I.


I think you are right.
 
  On the other hand, Brooko, I've never found my HD600s' sound stage (Note to self: that's two words, not one!) to be all that impressive despite many other people praising them for just that. I won't go so far as to say the Havis are comparable to full-sized cans; however, their sound stage is considerably more open than any other IEM I have ever used. I used to have a pair of NuForce Primo 8s which were $500 quad-driver balanced armature IEMs. Unfortunately, they never got along with my ear canals and I could never tame the hellish resonance that caused steep treble spikes and sibilance for me.
 
Anyway, I digress . . .
 
My ultimate point is that to my recollection the B3 Pro 1s absolutely rival the Primo 8s' sound stage and imaging, which were spectacular. To get that out of a < $80 USD IEM is completely ludicrous. 

 
If you have opportunities to listen to IE8, 80, or 800, even KEF M200, you can compare their soundstage to see.
 
Jun 6, 2015 at 11:27 AM Post #975 of 2,486
I have the IE8 and KEF M200. In my opinion, the IE8 or the KEF have more spacious sound. The Havi are nice and spacious, but too flat and lean and in my opinion kind of takes from the dimensions and space a bit. All are good earphones however, but when it comes to sheer "wow" I've had better moments with the KEF and IE8. That's just my opinion. I think cause the B3P are my daily drivers their sound really has adjusted and I'm so completely used to the way they sound that the flatness and overall lean tone sounds just normal and less special. 
 
That's just my take. I haven't A-B them so this is just off impressions I remember
 

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