[jpr703]

I listen to a lot of Rock and when I owned the 325i, they seemed harsh to me too. I sold them and went with the RS-1 which are now paired up with my Gimore Lite. I really love this combination for rock music and find that the RS-1s manage to remain detailed without being fatiguing.

 

[go_vtec]

Perhaps you are listening too loud using fairly bright phones. How about taking a break for few days or reduce your listening volume considerably? If the cause of the problem is a prolong exposure to very loud music, HD650 will not eliminate the problem (it may reduce the amount of hours before you started to feel uncomfortable again).

 

[kane]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cerebral_Mamba Lastly, do you think the HD650 is worth it for a Metal/Rock fan? (I know this is purely subjective, but your opinion will help me decide)

I recently sold my sr-225s since I found them a bit harsh.

However, I listen to a lot of metal and own both the hd595s and hd650s and prefer the 595s for metal and rock. However, for jazz, modern classical and movies the hd650s are my favorite.

 

[Blitzula]

I listen primarily to hard rock/metal, and the HD-650 with the Zu cable wasn't a good choice for that type of music. I owned the SR80, SR225, SR325, MS-2, RS-1, and PS-1. I prefer the PS-1 out of those phones for your tastes.

Even with low volume listening (not moderate-low), I had ear issues with hours and hours of daily use though. So maybe Grados aren't your best best, or you should reduce the amount of time you listen.

 

[BRBJackson]

In my experience, the 650's are NOT rock phones. High energy music like that seems to overwhelm them, and it all starts to sound congested and murky. That's one of the main reasons I keep my 225's.

 

[iDesign]

I found the SR325i to be quite bright and think that Grado Labs headphones are well suited to your music interests. I recommend the Alessandro Music Series II (I cannot suggest the i model because I have not tested them) or the Grado Labs RS1 as I found them to be the most fluid in the entire Grado range. Rarely would I suggest flat type pads with the current Grado Labs product line but you may notice a slight decrease in the highs. As mentioned in the thread your amplifier and source may already be bright and working with bright recordings the problem can be greatly worsened with Grado Labs headphones. After logging additional hours with the SR225 and Gilmore Lite I now feel the pairing is too bright. I also caution against high listening volumes.

 

[congqin]

For my head, I like the SennHD580, it is the can that you won't get enough. Or HD600 is very good too. Some people say HD650 has too much bass, but that is what I'm looking for while I listen the rock.

 

[Cerebral_Mamba]

Gosh... the replies have been so contradictory here and now I am all the more confused. My plan of action is to go for an HD580 or HD600 (if some great deal comes by) and look out for a good deal on RS1. I'm going for the RS1 trial today and hopefully I'll get some doubts clarified.

Quote:

iDesign After logging additional hours with the SR225 and Gilmore Lite I now feel the pairing is too bright.

Quote:

Kane I recently sold my sr-225s since I found them a bit harsh.

OOhh boy, I have not heard the 225s but from what I read they are much more mellow than the 325i, so I guess you folks are getting an idea of my state.

I had a gut feeling from all I have read that the SR225 would be the ideal can for me. I just fell for the SR325i because i believed the Grado's top of the line Prestige Series can't be that bad and also it looks awesome. Needless to say, I am not happy with my judgement.

Since at office, I am addicted to listening to music and working, I plan to keep the Sennheiser in office and the Grado at home. I hope that would work out good

 

[fogia.4]

Personally I think the 325i is the best grado bang for the buck, and the way it comes close to the RS-1 with a huge difference in price makes it even more interesting, but I guess if it hurts your ears its a problem, however if so I'd suggest going for anything but Grados...

 

[Icy006]

It needs to be asked: have you tried your Grados with flat pads??

Also, I find HD-580 sterile, while the HD-600 is engaging and smooth, albeit less edge-of-your-seat than SR-325s. The bass on the HD-600 pales next to SR-325/flats.

 

[J-Pak]

SR-225 is definetly a lot more more mellow than the 325i, I got that impression after just a few minutes with the 225. I can't speak for the HD650, but the HD580 was very boring when listening to rock, I had a tendency to turn the volume up louder than normal to try and compensate; which is not a good thing.

 

[Serge44]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cerebral_Mamba Gosh... the replies have been so contradictory here and now I am all the more confused. My plan of action is to go for an HD580 or HD600 (if some great deal comes by) and look out for a good deal on RS1. I'm going for the RS1 trial today and hopefully I'll get some doubts clarified. Since at office, I am addicted to listening to music and working, I plan to keep the Sennheiser in office and the Grado at home. I hope that would work out good

1. Sennheiser 650 - open cans. It means thin sound and big sound leakage in and out. All people in your office will hear your music. For home office search closed cans.
2. I strongly not recommend Sennheiser 600 for rock, metal, electronica or rap music - not enough bass for modern music.
3. Sennheiser 650 - slow cans. I have about 1500 heavy metal-hard rock albums in my house, all styles of heavy music of 1970-2005 years. For slow heavy metal - gothic, doom, old hard rock - Sennheiser 650 sound quite good. But if you listen to death metal or nu metal - Sennheiser 650 sound not so involving, very slow. So for Tiamat or Black Sabbath it's Ok, but System Of A Down sounds boring. I think, you've got the point.
4. Cable upgrading will improve 650 but not too much. Try it only if you want to stay with these cans.

 

[grawk]

Listening to your 325is on the tube amp, I'm now of the opinion that even amping can't tame the shrill high end of the 325s. If you like the 60s, I'd sell the 325s, get a pair of 60s and the sennheisers. Then when you decide the senns aren't for you, sell your car and get the PS1s...

 

[kartik]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cerebral_Mamba Ok.. I was convinced that I was a die-hard Grado fan until a few days ago when my ear drums started paining from my 325i's unacceptable shreraking extensions of the highs & I ONLY LISTEN AT MODERATE VOLUME. http://www6.head-fi.org/forums/showt...9&page=1&pp=20 Grawk has been very kind to invite me to his office to listen to his RS1, which I will be doing today. But I am also seriously contemplating the possibility to move on to the Sennheiser HD650 + Cable upgrade since in the end, protecting my ears is most important (Some of you may not agree, but what can I do? I guess I just have sensitive ears that can't withstand the impossible 325i highs). I have a few questions regarding the HD650 though-- 1. How is the 650 + Cable upgrade for Metal & Rock? 2. I currently have the Total Bithead as my amp. It does a fine job with grados but I really don't know if it can withstand the HD650. I will call HeadRoom today and ask them, but please give me your opinions. 3. Will the cable upgrade increase the Cans requirement for a better amp? (Might be a real stupid question, but I really don't know) 4. Lastly, do you think the HD650 is worth it for a Metal/Rock fan? (I know this is purely subjective, but your opinion will help me decide)

I had the same trouble as you with my SR-325s. I changed to the Koss ESP/950. Still as forward and in your face, none of the pain.
Usually available for $500, this is really a good buy. ($500 includes an elctrostatic amp with the cans.)

 

[bryman79]

Cerebral_Mamba,

Have you let the SR-325is break in? I found that the phones were EXTREMELY unlistenable for the first 50 hours or so (so much so that I had to put them down and let them play on my desk at times), and at about 100 they stabilized. We had a meet the other day here in San Jose, and I commented to someone that it is really unfortunate that the 325i have such a steep break-in period... they really should come with a warning of some sort. I wouldn't be suprised if most everyone returned them, only to get rid of one of Grado's best headphones. And yes, I have a pair of SR-325 with around 400 hours on them to compare to the SR-325i to serve as a reference point. If interested, the 325i is a league above the 325, which I can discuss in greater detail if anyone is interested.

At that meet, I was able to compare my broken-in 325i to both the RS-1 (I think this pair was broken in) and PS-1 (only about 5 hours on them). The 325i sounded better than both. However, as I was listening to the PS-1s, I was guessing that they were not broken in, and the owner confirmed this after I gave him my honest impression. They were way too bassy and way too "in your face." However, behind this was a sound like the 325i, but richer. My guess is once broken in, the PS-1 would sound much like the 325i, but richer. Anyway, point is, you need to let Grados break in.

Since the original post in this thread was very broad, I will continue. People are quick to judge headphones without adequate equipment. Here are some suggestions for anyone willing to dabble in DIY that will make Grados and Senns sing:

Amps
I own both a Zen by Marcello Pellerano (see http://headwize.com/projects/showfil...lerano_prj.htm and http://www.ptsoundlab.com/ when Pascal adds this page to his site again - I adopted a few of Pascal's changes to Marcello's amp, and then used components I saw fit) and a Dynalo. The Zen is a little warmer sounding than the Dynalo, but both sound terrific with the Grados. Also, the Zen in stock configuration has some roll-off at the top end to tame the SR-325 "brightness." I have yet to plug HD650s (as I don't yet own a pair) into the Zen, so I cannot comment here. Senns sound great on the Dynalo with the right DAC (see below). The Dynalo should cost ~$250 to build (depends on which PSU you use), and the Zen ~$400.

The Dynahi is a little better sounding than the Dynalo, but costs more to build. It is also a more challenging build given the heat involved. Both the Grados and Senns sound great with the Dynahi.

In sum, unless you are ruling out DIY, go for the Dynalo. It is by far the best bang for your buck. Contact Dgardner for boards... I think he still has some left.

DACs
This has got to be the most overlooked component. After all, garbage in, garbage out, right? Both the Senns and Grados can significantly benefit from a good DAC.

I truly cannot recommend a commercial DAC, but can recommend one that I recently built for about $500. See http://users.verat.net/~pedjarogic/audio/. Experienced builders had said it was the best DAC they had heard, which I'm starting to believe after hearing the DAC1 this weekend. Anyway, regarding the DAC's effect on sound...

Take the Senns for example. I have read over and over that they do not accurately produce bass, that the bass is weak, etc. And the owners then justify this by saying that it's okay since they only listen to jazz, classical, etc. Since I listen to most everything but country, I was expecting to walk away from a HD650 audition relieved that I didn't have to plunk down the money for a set. And this was indeed my impression after hearing them through the DAC1 (although the Dynahi did do a lot to make up for DAC1 deficiencies re i.e. rock, I might add). However, after playing my TDA1541A DAC through the Dynahi, I experienced what I have yet to read about: accurate bass reproduction through the HD650s. Rock and techno began (I am a Grado owner after all

) to resemble the sweet sound that I have come to expect from my SR-325is. In short, this faithful Grado owner now has to get a pair of HD650s.

A good DAC can also reduce some of the less-desirable features of the Grados. For example, my TDA1541A significantly widens the soundstage and sets you back a few rows when listening to my SR-325i.

So in sum, let your 325i break in, and play them through good equipment. You may be suprised at the result.

Regards,
Bryan