[HFCOBRA]

I have tried everything and I cannot get the VU meter to go past -10dB.
 
Right now I am using the Xonar Essence STX for a soundcard.  Does this mean that I cannot clip with this card?  For some reason the windows volume level does not affect the VU meter at all, the only thing that makes the VU meter move is the "amount" of music playing at a part in a song.
 
I am rather new to the subject of clipping and I am getting a dedicated amp sometime in the future.  I am asking this because I want to know whether or not I will have clipping at 100% Windows 7 volume so that I can just use the amp knob to change the volume levels.  I hear that leaving Win7 volume at 100% gives the best quality, but you have to worry about clipping if your soundcard is not high enough quality.
 
I have tried with it set to headphone out and RCA out with my headphones unplugged (since I dont want to break them at 100% windows volume) and it will not pass -10dB.
 
Basically what I need is something that I can use to measure and see if there is clipping so I can know how high to put the Windows volume when I save enough for an external amp.
 
Sorry if this is badly worded, if you need to ask me a question or to clarify feel free to do so!  

 

[HFCOBRA]

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[Joe Bloggs]

As you noticed window‘s volume control does not affect levels in foobar as that's upstream in the audio chain. Many modern songs are highly compressed near the digital limit and this will show as a high VU level in foobar, even lighting the foobar clipping indicator for some mp3s, in which case you need to replaygain scan these mp3s to reduce their level and prevet clipping.

There's a preamp slider in foobar‘s preferences that will affect levels in foobar‘s VU meter.

As for window‘s volume setting, for most systems I find it directly changes the analog gain so there's no real need to peg it at 100%, especially if you‘re going to get an amp which will amplify more cleanly.

 

[Joe Bloggs]

Foobar can detect digital clipping which you don't have. Any clipping caused by setting the windows master volume too high and overdriving the sound card‘s internal amp would be analog clipping and hard to measure at home with anything other than your ears.

 

[HFCOBRA]

Ah I see.  So should I just leave windows volume at 50% when I get my amp or should I try it out at 100% and see if there is clipping?
 
Do you have a "clipping" file of a song that I can listen to so I know what I should be listening for?

 

[musicreo]

I think you should use the Peak meter instead of th VU meter. As long you are under 0db there should be no clipping caused by foobar. 

 

[HFCOBRA]

Quote:

I think you should use the Peak meter instead of th VU meter. As long you are under 0db there should be no clipping caused by foobar. 

Well according to Joe Bloggs there is not a good way to measure it in the OS with foobar.  So I am looking for a sound file that would be close to what analog clipping would sound like or a good description of what it sounds like so I can hear if it is happening for myself.
 
Either that or someone to confirm with evidence that the Xonar STX will not clip with the DAC when you have windows volume set to 100%. I would still use the STX's DAC and output through the RCA plugs to the amp when I get it so I can have the best quality!
 
Thanks for the tip though!  The Peak Meter does not change when I change the volume either, so I think I will have to stick to the method above.   

 

[musicreo]

Quote:

Well according to Joe Bloggs there is not a good way to measure it in the OS with foobar.  So I am looking for a sound file that would be close to what analog clipping would sound like or a good description of what it sounds like so I can hear if it is happening for myself.
 
Either that or someone to confirm with evidence that the Xonar STX will not clip with the DAC when you have windows volume set to 100%. I would still use the STX's DAC and output through the RCA plugs to the amp when I get it so I can have the best quality!
 
Thanks for the tip though!  The Peak Meter does not change when I change the volume either, so I think I will have to stick to the method above.   

 
Yeah, the Peak or the VU-Meter only show the output levesl in foobar. But I think the Windows sound-volume doesn't cause clipping. If you have no clipping at 30% voulume you  shouldn't have clipping at 100% volume.  You can change the volume in your xonar card and have the windows sound volume always at 100%.
 
 

 

[Joe Bloggs]

He's worried that the soundcard's internal amp would be overdriven at 100%, causing distortion.  That's certainly possible but using the output as a line out (to his amp) is the least stressful situation for the sound card.  OTOH as I said he'd likely have plenty of gain available on the amp he could use instead of setting the sound card at 100%.  It could just be a convenience thing--he may find that with the sound card at 100% everything out of the amp would be ear splittingly loud at anything beyond 9 o'clock; then it would be better for him to set the windows volume lower so he could use the volume knob on the amp more comfortably...

 

[HFCOBRA]

Quote:

He's worried that the soundcard's internal amp would be overdriven at 100%, causing distortion.  That's certainly possible but using the output as a line out (to his amp) is the least stressful situation for the sound card.  OTOH as I said he'd likely have plenty of gain available on the amp he could use instead of setting the sound card at 100%.  It could just be a convenience thing--he may find that with the sound card at 100% everything out of the amp would be ear splittingly loud at anything beyond 9 o'clock; then it would be better for him to set the windows volume lower so he could use the volume knob on the amp more comfortably...

I just heard that leaving windows set to 100% yields the best quality.  I would be using the RCA out on the card so that I run through the DAC on the card and skip the amp so I can use my external amp instead.  If you do not think that it really gives better quality output then I will probably just leave it at 50% so that the volume knob on the amp doesn't feel useless.  

 

[HFCOBRA]

bump
 
 
Can anyone describe what analog clipping sounds like?  Without describing what it looks like on the sensor please.  I know the it is when the sine wave hits the top and flattens out, but what does that sound like so I can know whether or not I am clipping?

 

[Joe Bloggs]

Well you know the difference between electric guitar and acoustic guitar is pretty much all distortion and clipping. So it would be a bit like that for all audio.  The place where I hear analog clipping most often and clearly is when a recording of a voice, whether dialog or singing, is too hot and when the person shouts.  You can hear the voice breaking up.  Actually I think it's really hard to tell whether it's your equipment or the recording that's clipping these days because 9 out of 10 modern recordings of anything contain clipping of one sort or another.  Part of me can't really believe you don't know what clipping sounds like

 

[HFCOBRA]

Quote:

Well you know the difference between electric guitar and acoustic guitar is pretty much all distortion and clipping. So it would be a bit like that for all audio.  The place where I hear analog clipping most often and clearly is when a recording of a voice, whether dialog or singing, is too hot and when the person shouts.  You can hear the voice breaking up.  Actually I think it's really hard to tell whether it's your equipment or the recording that's clipping these days because 9 out of 10 modern recordings of anything contain clipping of one sort or another.  Part of me can't really believe you don't know what clipping sounds like

Well I have probably heard it, I just have not known about it so I did not know what it was called.  The description did not help me much sadly.     I guess I can just run W7 at 50% so I do not have to worry.  Is the quality difference really that big?  I can't imagine that it would be.

 

[Joe Bloggs]

Try listening to Cold Cold Heart in Norah Jones‘ Come Away With Me album. Cleanly recorded vocal jazz. Except for overdrive clipping in every loud verse. It will stand out like a sore thumb at the surgeon‘s office. At least it does on the version I hear at KKBOX. It's like a tutorial on what clipping sounds like.

 

[HFCOBRA]

If you mean this song then I did not hear anything out of the ordinary.  Sorry, I guess I really don't know what clipping is or sounds like.  

 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GMs3c8b_tJU