FlaresPro/FlaresGold by Flare Audio
Apr 9, 2018 at 5:06 PM Post #541 of 1,354
Sorry, you're right. I couldn't remember as I sent mine back for the same reason. The offending spikes are in the upper treble - brilliance range. Around 8-9khz if I remember correctly and then there is another one slightly higher but which causes less issue.

Mentioning the issue regardless still is an interesting topic. I'm curious how many iems have an upper treble emphasis like the FlaresPro, and not just bumps or spikes similar to the HFM RE00? I really don't see many of them, but there are alot that focus on lower treble, especially with all the v-shape iems there are. I'm also interested in where exactly in the upper treble range the hiss/fizzyness of the FlaresPro comes from. Its extended quite a ways through the spectrum, and knowing where the noise comes from could be quite helpful in avoiding it in the future.

For now, I really believe the FlaresGold is going to be the best iem in terms of the particular sound styling it provides to those looking for it. The iem really begins to explore a 3d spacing that can only expand over time, possibly with a FlaresPlatinum or something similar. The 3d spacing could also have a negative impact on treble, if that is where the tuning is being adjusted to support, which needs to be done very carefully, if so. If someone could get a frequency response graph of the FlaresGold, that would be great. I'll try asking again, as they may have missed my question for it a few weeks ago.
 
Apr 10, 2018 at 5:36 AM Post #542 of 1,354
Ok this is just embarrassing, the right unit of my Gold has a flimsy mmcx connector so I have been listening unbalanced since yesterday. Tried with the supplied y-cable from pro and it still has the problem so it's definitely not the y-cable. They can be made to sound right/no imbalance if I fiddle with the mmcx, but yeah I'm not gonna live with it, especially for something so expensive.

Contacted Flares but I don't expect speedy response as my last inquiry took them like three days to respond. Really not the kind of QC you'd expect from items at this price level... I'm quite disappointed.

As a side note, they sound absolutely sublime now, I've also found the best tips combination for me (spinfit and foam combo, symbio-style), it's a shame that I likely will have to part with them for a period of time now. Urgh.
 
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Apr 10, 2018 at 10:23 AM Post #544 of 1,354
I'd take a fixed cable version over improved bluetooth module any day. I just can't be bothered to deal with the possible failure points and mmcx quirks these days. Don't really care about cable swapping when the IEM already sounds this good and it's not like they're offering a balanced cable accessory. I just want to be hassle free, wish they gave us a choice.

Oh right, I got a speedy response this time, hopefully it's not a one off...
 
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Apr 10, 2018 at 7:10 PM Post #547 of 1,354
I would still like to see them make a balanced cable.
My flarespro are still stuck at home in the box ,not looking like I'm going to be able to post til friday now.

Flares Pro and Flares Gold are balanced. It's mentioned on their site and in the downloadable booklet you can get from the site as well. It's one of the neat tricks Flare did.

I'd prefer to have an easier way to replace the cable, but I've filed that under acceptable flaw. There are female to female mmcx connectors which help with that flaw, too.
 
Apr 14, 2018 at 1:40 PM Post #548 of 1,354
Question for you all Pros and Golds owners out there:

What portable DAP have you found gives you the best synergy?

I've been using the DX200 and the ZX300, and I find for the same files that the DX200 works out well. I had and sold the Hiby R6 before I could form a good opinion (I preferred the DX200, but that could be confirmation bias and I did not burn in the Hiby at all.)

What players should I try with the Pros/Golds?
 
Apr 14, 2018 at 2:07 PM Post #549 of 1,354
Question for you all Pros and Golds owners out there:

What portable DAP have you found gives you the best synergy?

I've been using the DX200 and the ZX300, and I find for the same files that the DX200 works out well. I had and sold the Hiby R6 before I could form a good opinion (I preferred the DX200, but that could be confirmation bias and I did not burn in the Hiby at all.)

What players should I try with the Pros/Golds?

I think without spending a vast amount of cash the DX200 is cracking match already.
I use the DX200 and the MojoPoly, both are excellent with the Golds. I feel no need to spend any further outlay for what be nothing more than a very small incremental increase in SQ.
 
Apr 14, 2018 at 4:25 PM Post #550 of 1,354
I think without spending a vast amount of cash the DX200 is cracking match already.
I use the DX200 and the MojoPoly, both are excellent with the Golds. I feel no need to spend any further outlay for what be nothing more than a very small incremental increase in SQ.
Ha ha! Confirmation for my confirmation bias! I’m still only using Amp1 with the DX200, but I’m expecting Amp4s to arrive soon. Not that it will help with the Golds, really, but I’ll give it a go. Mostly going to use that with the Monolith M1060. Would Amp2 or Amp5 be worthwhile for the Golds, do you think?

Also, anyone use a FiiO DAP with the Golds? I’ve got the Q5 amp now, but the X7 Mark II is whispering to me again with its second SD card slot. My recollection is that the X7 Mark II was pretty good with the Pros. Never tried the X5III or any of their other models with Golds or Pros. Anyone have experience they are willing to share?
 
Apr 15, 2018 at 12:22 AM Post #551 of 1,354
Question for you all Pros and Golds owners out there:

What portable DAP have you found gives you the best synergy?

I've been using the DX200 and the ZX300, and I find for the same files that the DX200 works out well. I had and sold the Hiby R6 before I could form a good opinion (I preferred the DX200, but that could be confirmation bias and I did not burn in the Hiby at all.)

What players should I try with the Pros/Golds?

I really like the Meridian Explorer 2, which works great with the Gold. Regarding the Pro I really can't say anything specific because I wasn't happy with the treble tuning on it. The Gold still has the treble sparkly detail, but without the harshness of the Pro.

I'm really looking toward getting a dac with the Cirrus Logic CS43130, which the Nexum Aqua+ has, but I don't want a wireless dac, rather a wired one with the Cirrus Logic chipset. It goes up to 32-bit 384khz, whereas the Meridian Explorer 2 goes up to 24-bit 192khz. I've heard Cirrus Logic chipsets are generally less bassy, more mid/treble oriented like some ESS Sabre chipsets, but with less bass than the ESS Sabre. The Meridian Explorer 2 is a mid/treble oriented dac, which is the sound profile I like, but with treble emphasis in the lower treble, not the upper treble.
 
Apr 15, 2018 at 9:43 PM Post #552 of 1,354
When I read the term "endgame" here on Head-Fi, I'm assuming this means when a person has found the iem or headphone that has matched all of the qualities they are looking for in regard to their sound signature preference. Is this correct?

If so, the FlaresGold almost is this for me, and so long as someone isn't looking for a V-Shaped sound, but rather more neutral or having the perfect balance needed in an iem where forward mids/vocals and an enhanced, yet non-harsh, non-fatiguing treble, then the FlaresGold is very likely an "endgame" product. I cannot imagine an iem, at least a dynamic driver iem with this sound signature, being better than the FlaresGold. It absolutely is worth the cost.

The only exception to this "endgame" definition, that is if I am understanding it correctly, would be a planar magnetic or electrostatic iem with this tuning. The reason I say this, is I've read that planar magnetic and electrostatic drivers can offer a more precise tuning, is this right? If so, then its strange how many complaints I've read on Head-Fi from people complaining about having to EQ their planar magnetic iems.

Prior to the FlaresGold being released while I was still in the process of locating the R2Pro that I later ended up needing to return after I received it due to the issues I wrote about here at the time, I had contemplated purchasing the Unique Melody ME1 planar magnetic iem, which apparently has a similar tuning to the FlaresGold, with the exception of a major flaw which kept me from buying it. According to what some people on Head-Fi wrote about it, the ME1 has a dip in the lower treble tuning at a very crucial point in the region that a poor tuning can negatively impact the detail level.

Looking at two frequency response graph of the ME1, which one compares it with the Campfire Jupiter, while the other one compares it with the HiFiMan RE800 (It would be great for a frequency response graph of the FlaresGold. I was told by my contact at Flare Audio that they are in the process of upgrading their testing equipment for better accuracy, and they'll give more information to me when they have more to tell me about it). Anyways, here are the Unique Melody ME1 frequency response graphs. I'll continue with my commentary afterwards :

9935280_l.png

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From looking at that, there is a dip around 3k, then while it rises back up, sharply dips again around 4k. This being the lower treble, is unacceptable to me, and to read from people here that this has affected detail negatively, is very disappointing to me, especially based on reading how planar magnetic drivers are capable of more precise tuning. If so, then its odd how the ME1 has this issue, causing people to need EQ. Apparently its not only the ME1 planar magnetic driver iem that needs EQ, as I've read the same about these iems from Audeze.

The notion that iems with more precise tuning capabilities could end up with these issues, while Flare Audio is capable of such excellent tuning on an iem featuring more difficult-to-tune dynamic drivers, is quite a complexity to wonder about. While I don't have the FlaresGold frequency response graph, I do still have the FlaresPro frequency response graph. Despite the harsher upper treble on the Pro than the Gold, its still interesting to see how much smoother and stable most of the tuning is, when compared with the Unique Melody ME1. Here is the FlaresPro frequency response graph :

FLARES PRO Freq Resp.png


Now those of you who've been reading my posts quite likely can see why I'd be interested in the Unique Melody ME1. There is less lower bass/sub bass than the FlaresPro, while the other areas of the bass are similar - mostly neutral. However, after some time of listening to the FlaresGold and remembering more about the FlaresPro, at least to my hearing, the FlaresGold sounds quite a bit less bassy (not to say the FlaresPro was bassy, but definitely more than the FlaresGold. Any opinions/thoughts about this, different hearing perspectives welcome?

Still, this is from my hearing, I understand others might hear differently, but the more I listen to the FlaresGold, the more I'm remembering the FlaresPro, and its my opinion - followed up with what I said in a post I wrote here a few days ago describing the FlaresPro - the more I listen/remember, the more I think the FlaresPro had a light V-Shape sound, but one that didn't necessarily recess the mids/vocals, as Flare Audio seems to be trying to provide a more forward sound, in general.

So, rather than recessing the mids/vocals to give weight to the bass/treble on the FlaresPro, Flare Audio kept most of the bass and treble near neutral, in order to not make the mids/vocals recessed-sounding. Instead, Flare enhanced the lower bass/sub bass and also the upper treble, whereas most audio companies trying to produce a V-Shape recess the mids/vocals by lifting the mid bass/upper bass, along with the lower treble/mid treble. The only part of the V-Shaped sound I don't mind and actually do like, is the enhanced lower treble. Yet certainly not at the expense of the mids/vocals.

Prior to my having purchased the FlaresPro, I conversed through email with a representative at Flare Audio. I requested a frequency response graph of the FlaresPro, which I received not long afterwards, though I did receive an apology for the perceived delay in providing it to me, which was part of the overall excellent nature in which Flare Audio took great care in communicating towards me. After my inital viewing of the frequency response graph, I relayed my concerns to Flare Audio regarding the enhanced sub bass/lower bass, to which they replied how the graph expressed the quantity based on the capabilities of the FlaresPro, rather than a standard sound signature output for every song.

Perhaps this is the case. After all, my listening to the FlaresPro was not overly thorough, not even the least a complete testing of all the various sound attributes and capabilities of the FlaresPro, because of my sudden noticing of the incompatibility the FlaresPro has with certain songs that delivers the harsh treble during playback of certain moments in music featuring prominant cymbal and tambourine instrumentals. This made the continuation of listening to the FlaresPro unbearable for me. Yet, I now regret I didn't try listening to more music for the sake of testing analysis. While I did get some perception of the graph's showing the capabilities of the FlaresPro, rather than as a standard sound signature output for every song - after all, not every song had the harsh treble to it - I didn't get a full analysis of this in regards to the bass.

Due to the limitation of my bass testing of the FlaresPro , I cannot be certain of my comparisons, but from what I do remember, the bass on the FlaresPro was more bassy than the FlaresGold, while the FlaresGold has a bass quantity more similar to that of the R2A, despite the bass quality of the FlaresGold being more refined than the R2A. Also, while I won't judge the FlaresPro to the extent of saying that the bass bleeds into the mids/vocals, the limited memories of the FlaresPro brought forth by listening to the FlaresGold makes me remember the bass sounding prominent enough where at times it did stand out among the mids/vocals, but not necessarily where the bass bled into the mids/vocals, nor did the bass make the mids/vocals sound recessed.

As I mentioned a few paragraphs earlier in this post, there is a way in which Flare Audio went for its own type of a V-Shaped sound in the FlaresPro that differs from the normal V-Shape sound signature. Its actually more like a wide "w" without the middle diagonal lines, and not a capital "W", but rather a lowercase "w". Whereas the FlaresGold is much more neutral, like the R2A, but with the treble detail of the FlaresPro, except without the harshness of the FlaresPro. The mids/vocals on both are forward, though because the bass is not so prominent on the FlaresGold in a sometimes overshadowing way, the FlaresGold can sound like putting the middle diagonal lines back into the lowercase "w", though the second line inwards doesn't dip, it stays at least flat. Although I'd suggest, based on what I've read about upper bass being what can "bleed into" the mids/vocals if extended, there ought to be a dip around there, while the earlier bass remain neutral. At least this is how the FlaresGold sounds to me.

I'll write a post in a few days discussing planar magnetic drivers more in relation to Flare Audio, and discuss more about issues regarding lower and upper treble. One thing for certain though, it sure sounds Flare Audio got them both right in the tuning of the FlaresGold.
 
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Apr 15, 2018 at 11:04 PM Post #553 of 1,354
Arysyn,

I love that you keep sharing these graphs. I find it quite interesting. Thank you! I really like the effort you've put into this search for the endgame iems - I almost feel like I'm part of a saga! For me, I know myself: there is no endgame for me, but rather an evolving journey through music. I'm glad we're both sold on the Flares Gold, I'd love to see the graph of the Golds to visualize better what I'm hearing.

I know I asked people what portable DAPs they are using, and I'd like to thank people for their responses.

Follow up, since I'm interested: has anyone used the Golds (or Pros) with the KANN or any of the AK 300 series? Or the iBasso DX150? Long shot, I know, but I'm interested in what you all think of the pairing. I've listened to the FiiO Q5, which shares a DAC with most of those, and I do like what I hear, but I've not been listening critically when I'm using the Q5, it's mostly on the go. Anyone have any impressions or thoughts they'd like to share? Thanks, you're an awesome group!
 
Apr 16, 2018 at 12:25 AM Post #554 of 1,354
Arysyn,

I love that you keep sharing these graphs. I find it quite interesting. Thank you! I really like the effort you've put into this search for the endgame iems - I almost feel like I'm part of a saga! For me, I know myself: there is no endgame for me, but rather an evolving journey through music. I'm glad we're both sold on the Flares Gold, I'd love to see the graph of the Golds to visualize better what I'm hearing.

I know I asked people what portable DAPs they are using, and I'd like to thank people for their responses.

Follow up, since I'm interested: has anyone used the Golds (or Pros) with the KANN or any of the AK 300 series? Or the iBasso DX150? Long shot, I know, but I'm interested in what you all think of the pairing. I've listened to the FiiO Q5, which shares a DAC with most of those, and I do like what I hear, but I've not been listening critically when I'm using the Q5, it's mostly on the go. Anyone have any impressions or thoughts they'd like to share? Thanks, you're an awesome group!

Thank you, Victor for your kind recognition. By the way, I finished writing my post, so you might want to read the additions. I made the mistake of typing my post here, rather than to Notepad, which after a certain time the page on Head-Fi refreshes. I realized this after writing a bit, but I didn't feel like copy/pasting it into Notepad and back here again. So, I kept saving it here as I continued editing/writing. I'll definitely try to remember Notepad first. I've had a few messages get lost writing here instead, so its a good idea for everyone to consider.

I really like frequency response graphs, as they give a great visualization of the sound signature profile, so long as they are accurate and maintain a professional look to them. The problem is not every audio company is fond of frequency response graphs, and often claim the risk of inaccuracy when a potential customer, etc. requests a frequency response graph.

I get the idea perhaps Flare Audio may be thinking this way about frequency response graphs too. They don't post them online and its quite difficult to find frequency response graphs of Flare Audio's products online. I was surprised they even provided me with the frequency response graph of the FlaresPro.

Perhaps when Flare Audio updates me about their new testing equipment, it won't be long until they provide a frequency response graph of the FlaresGold to me. In the meantime, if you wanted to and could possibly obtain, if you or anyone here in this thread wanted to try messaging/writing to Flare Audio, its possible they may be able to get one made on another equipment l, or however they made the FlaresPro frequency response graph for me.

Also, Victor - Please let me know if you find any non-wireless/Bluetooth, usb-wired portable amp/dac featuring the Cirrus Logic CS43130 chipset. I am very interested in it as a potential replacement for my Meridian Explorer 2.
 
Apr 16, 2018 at 3:19 PM Post #555 of 1,354
I just received disappointing news from Nexum, the company that makes the Aqua+ dac which features the Cirrus Logic CS43130 I'm wanting to try with the FlaresGold. According to Nexum, its Bluetooth/Wireless only.

I really want to try this dac. Supposedly the Exynos version of the Samsung Galaxy S8/S8+ has it, and gets great reviews.
 

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