FLAC vs. 320 Mp3
Jan 28, 2020 at 8:42 PM Post #601 of 1,406
I don't know much and I can prove it but what I do know for sure is I can not distinguish Apple Music downloads from the same music I've downloaded in 24/192; thus, I have curtailed hi-res purchases. I typically enjoy Apple Music via usb connection from PC to OPPO-205 DAC, which sounds better, in all manner I can discern better, than listening to Apple Music via X-FI HD, or Airport Express.
 
Feb 3, 2020 at 7:26 PM Post #602 of 1,406
I’m a filthy casual. I enjoy Apple Music AAC files through my Bluetooth amp and I cannot tell difference between this and FLAC. Let alone DSD.
 
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Feb 3, 2020 at 9:36 PM Post #603 of 1,406
I’m a filthy casual. I enjoy Apple Music AAC flies through my Bluetooth amp and I cannot tell difference between this and FLAC. Let alone DSD.
Yes, my experience is similar. I do sense that my usb to OPPO DAC delivers AAC, ALAC, and AIFF from iTunes with greater definition and less smearing than my wireless PC to Airport Express connection via S/PDIF to Pre-Pro, when playing music at life-like volume. At any rate, yeah, AAC satisfies. No more hi-res purchases for me other than multi-channel SACD.
 
Feb 4, 2020 at 4:09 AM Post #604 of 1,406
Yes, my experience is similar. I do sense that my usb to OPPO DAC delivers AAC, ALAC, and AIFF from iTunes with greater definition and less smearing than my wireless PC to Airport Express connection via S/PDIF to Pre-Pro, when playing music at life-like volume. At any rate, yeah, AAC satisfies. No more hi-res purchases for me other than multi-channel SACD.
Great to hear people being rational and not chasing the phantom hi-res gains saving money in process. Can always appreciate down to earth people in this forum.

I’m very fortunate to not being able to tell any difference between wired and wireless sound quality. Perhaps, I’m just being open-minded and honest with myself. After browsing audiophile communities, it’s easy to develop a bias towards new technology (for example DSP, Bluetooth and etc) being always worse than a traditional analog wired as-little-digital-as-possible setup.
 
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Feb 4, 2020 at 7:28 AM Post #605 of 1,406
Great to hear people being rational and not chasing the phantom hi-res gains saving money in process. Can always appreciate down to earth people in this forum.

I’m very fortunate to not being able to tell any difference between wired and wireless sound quality. Perhaps, I’m just being open-minded and honest with myself. After browsing auriophile communities, it’s easy to develop a bias towards new technology (for example DSP, Bluetooth and etc) being always worse than a traditional analog wired as-little-digital-as-possible setup.
Until recently I did not distinguish AAC via Airport Express to Pre-Pro from AAC via usb DAC to Pre-Pro; but, one evening I was playing some Dance music at about 80 db via Airport Express and out of curiosity I wanted to see if switching to usb DAC means to music would sound different. It did. I'd describe it as not smudged as the Airport Express route seemed to be. I perceive this had something to do with a 20 year old DAC doing the processing vs my OPPO's DAC doing it. At any rate, I then compared and contrasted AAC, ALAC, and AIFF of same music in iTunes Library via OPPO DAC to Pre-Pro, which did not produce results which I could discern as being different, in any manner that different could be discerned So, it appears, I'll keep plowing along with Apple Music, since there seems now to be no point to hi-res downloads. If technology improves for me to hear a better performance from hi-res ALAC or other I suppose I might re-visit hi-res. BTW, I still buy multi-channel SACDs, not for the impression that the overall sound is in any way better; but, because some do add breadth and depth giving me a feeling of having a great seat at a live performance of the music.
 
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Feb 4, 2020 at 11:56 AM Post #606 of 1,406
Try level matching. It might sound the same if you do.
 
Feb 5, 2020 at 9:57 AM Post #607 of 1,406
Try level matching. It might sound the same if you do.
AAC, ALAC, and AIFF do sound like each other, processed by OPPO DAC and they sound like each other when processed by Pre-Pro's DAP; and thus, I no longer have interest in buying hi-res downloads when I cannot distinguish them from AAC downloads of same. What sounds different is Airport Express to Pre-Pro's DAP vs. OPPO-205 DAC to Pre-Pro's analog input. In this scenario at high volume with volume matching, I can distinguish the OPPO DAC means to music as being divergent from the Airport Express to Pre-Pro DAP means. And, I prefer the OPPO means, since it does not seemed smeared as does music processed by Pre-Pro's DAP (Sony TA-E9000ES).
 
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Feb 5, 2020 at 1:00 PM Post #608 of 1,406
What model Airports are you using? Is it an older model? I have the little flat ones and they sound fine. I find no difference between my Oppos and anything else. It's all transparent. There's nothing in the specs of the airport that would suggest it might sound different. Have you tried more than one to make sure it isn't just a bad one?
 
Feb 5, 2020 at 2:08 PM Post #609 of 1,406
What model Airports are you using? Is it an older model? I have the little flat ones and they sound fine. I find no difference between my Oppos and anything else. It's all transparent. There's nothing in the specs of the airport that would suggest it might sound different. Have you tried more than one to make sure it isn't just a bad one?
My second generation Airport Express is not set to output analog. Instead, I send 16/44.1 optical S/PDIF from it to pre-pro, whereby pre-pro does digital to analog conversion; therefore the this vs. that is between 20 year old Sony TA-E9000ES DAP and OPPO-205's DAC. At high volume I can distinguish divergence between these digital to analog converters, the music sounding as if it was smeared from the Sony. At lower volume I can not discern one means to the music sounds better than the other. I have not used the Airport Express recently to do digital to analog conversion. In fact it's probably been 6 years since I've used Airport Express to do digital to audio conversion (not enough RCA's on my pre-pro); plus, sending digital from Airport Express allows me to record streams to DAT without DAT Recorder doing an analog to digital conversion.
 
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Feb 5, 2020 at 5:34 PM Post #610 of 1,406
Ah! So if I'm understanding correctly, the bottleneck is the Sony, not the Airports. I just take the analogue out of the Airport and it sounds fine.
 
Feb 5, 2020 at 6:06 PM Post #611 of 1,406
Ah! So if I'm understanding correctly, the bottleneck is the Sony, not the Airports. I just take the analogue out of the Airport and it sounds fine.
Yes, you understand correctly in spite of my poor communication. At some point I may re-visit analog output from Airport Express and then I could compare and contrast Airport Express DAC to OPPO's. At any rate, bottleneck is indeed my 20 year old Sony's DAP. This pre-pro also does not have HDMI input and a few other contemporary features I'd like to have. Nevertheless, with the OPPO, as well as Airport Express connected to the old Sony, it delivers stereo that sounds pretty nice. For multi-channel I have connected my OPPO to another 20 year old multi-channel analog preamplifier, a Sony TA-P9000ES. Using the OPPO's multi-channel bass management I'm still real happy with this preamp too.
 
Feb 19, 2020 at 6:14 PM Post #612 of 1,406
I ran some listening tests awhile back on a much higher quality setup than what I own. I took an album I knew well and made a WAV file then from that WAV file I created several MP3 files with LAME (320, -V0, -V2, -V4 and -V5) and several AAC versions with iTunes (256, 192, 128, 96). My conclusions were basically that if I knew what I was listening to, I could hear the degradation with LAME -V5 and still somewhat with Apple AAC 128. At the ~192Kbs mark, I really couldn't tell the difference. When I don't know which is which, I cannot tell at those low rates. I was really surprised because I always remembered 128Kbs MP3 files sounding terrible like I was underwater. Maybe LAME has just gotten that much better over the years, who knows? I tend to buy stuff on iTunes now (I think CDs are pointless unless you have to have a lossless file or different mastering) and I just convert everything to LAME -V0 or Apple AAC 256. It takes up much less space than carrying FLAC and I can't hear a difference.

Anyone else been impressed with Apple AAC? I am also curious if anyone here has ever tested the free Fraunhofer codec (FDK-AAC) with lossless to see if it's any better or worse than the Apple encoder.
 
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Feb 19, 2020 at 7:05 PM Post #613 of 1,406
I've tested and I've found AAC > LAME > Fraunhofer. They are all very good at 192, but the difference between them is with certain kinds of hard to compress sounds. They're all pretty much perfect by 320, but AAC is perfect at 256. Always use VBR when you encode because it can only help. It can't hurt.
 
Feb 19, 2020 at 10:15 PM Post #614 of 1,406
I've tested and I've found AAC > LAME > Fraunhofer. They are all very good at 192, but the difference between them is with certain kinds of hard to compress sounds. They're all pretty much perfect by 320, but AAC is perfect at 256. Always use VBR when you encode because it can only help. It can't hurt.

When you say Fraunhofer are you talking about their AAC or MP3 encoder? I understood that generally AAC is more efficient than any MP3 encoder.
 
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Feb 20, 2020 at 3:06 AM Post #615 of 1,406
Regular plain vanilla first generation MP3 (pre-LAME)
 

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