Flac v Wav

[fordgtlover]

Quote:

Originally Posted by myhandtel /img/forum/go_quote.gif yes, in short lossless->realtime decompressing->more workload->more noise

Do you a reliable source for this logic?

Quote:

Originally Posted by myhandtel /img/forum/go_quote.gif many people can abx wav and lossless but i can't, so i just stick to lossless

Low bitrate yes - high bitrate, not conclusively.

 

[myhandtel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fordgtlover /img/forum/go_quote.gif Do you a reliable source for this logic? Low bitrate yes - high bitrate, not conclusively.

I dont think it is reliable because it's just a pc with a graphic card, lots of noise.

I know a friend use modded psu, modded motherboard with mobile cpu,
and ssd for os only. Then disable all other chip at the mother for ultimate result. And the power consumption is very low.

Sometimes I can hear some differences at his computer. But I never noticed the high low bitrate is a matter. I think i will look at it.

 

[b0dhi]

Quote:

Originally Posted by myhandtel /img/forum/go_quote.gif yes, in short lossless->realtime decompressing->more workload->more noise many people can abx wav and lossless but i can't, so i just stick to lossless

Who are these "many people"? I don't suppose you have any evidence? Also i trust it's something more reliable than some guy saying "hey I just ABXed wav vs flac" without anything to back it up.

 

[MaZa]

Nobody can ABX wav from Flac, because there is no difference. It can be even measured that it is 1:1 copy. For example, even if the difference between high bitrate MP3 and CD/WAV is (almost) inaudible, it cant fool measurement softwares and difference is clearly visible. FLAC is essentially just ZIPing that is dedicated to audio compression and tag support added, original audio file is completely unmolested. Anyone claiming they can ABX the difference is talking out of their arse, honestly.

I can imagine some problems might arise if your computer is 100% taxed and is unable to decompress it in realtime, but I havent tested this. Even then I GUESS it would only produce choppy audio at worst as it has to stop and load more data to play. Computer noise is pretty much irrelevant if external DAC is used and it is away from other electrical noise, but this applies to CD players aswell.

 

[MaZa]

Quote:

Low bitrate yes - high bitrate, not conclusively.

Bitrate on FLACs doesnt stand for soundquality, only how small the compressor has managed to compress it. AFAIK you cant even adjust it yourself much, much like you cant really adjust how small ZIP/RAR can compress your file, (only how strong algorithm is used can be changed) end result is what it is.

 

[leeperry]

Quote:

Originally Posted by myhandtel /img/forum/go_quote.gif many people can abx wav and lossless

err...right

Quote:

Originally Posted by dazzer1975 /img/forum/go_quote.gif What flac settings do you guys use? Im thinking 5

well 8 of course....but APE in insane mode compresses way better anyway

 

[EnOYiN]

Quote:

Originally Posted by myhandtel /img/forum/go_quote.gif yes, in short lossless->realtime decompressing->more workload->more noise

Nonsense, stop trolling please. Only if you are running a pentium 1 you might get into some trouble and probably not even then. The workload to decompress FLACs is simply too low. Like Maza mentioned you won't end up with noise, but without sound or choppy sound.

Quote:

Originally Posted by myhandtel /img/forum/go_quote.gif many people can abx wav and lossless but i can't, so i just stick to lossless

Read the comment above - the nonsense part. There are hardly any people who are able to consistently tell the difference between a high quality lossy file and a lossless one. Let alone tell the difference between one lossless format and another. You can look up the results of various tests on this very forum. Read up on the subject before saying things which are simply not true please.

Edit: Quote:

Originally Posted by dazzer1975 /img/forum/go_quote.gif What flac settings do you guys use? Im thinking 5 as its default but wondered what the consensus was amongst you flac aficionados

I think it depends mainly on what CPU you've got. If you've got a fast Quad Core (or even faster) I wouldn't hesitate to use FLAC 8, if you've got a slower CPU you might want to use lower settings. Just make sure you won't have to wait too long.

 

[dazzer1975]

Hmm ok, this talk of decompressing putting a strain on the chip and thus perhaps employing lower compression that flac 8 as I have a dual core not quad core chip, how does this affect the useage of flac on dap's?

I do listen to music on my computer but also a lot of it is through my dap's so presumably for the flac capable dap's I would also have to be mindful of the level of compression used incase it ran into trouble decompressing?

Is that right?

 

[rederanged]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dazzer1975 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hmm ok, this talk of decompressing putting a strain on the chip and thus perhaps employing lower compression that flac 8 as I have a dual core not quad core chip, how does this affect the useage of flac on dap's?

Higher settings do not affect the decompression speed, just the time it takes to compress the file in the first place. See:

FLAC - faq

 

[gregorio]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acix /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'm trying to see how I can benefit from FLAC by using it with Nuendo or WaveLab.

FLAC only works with integer bit depths so would not be compatible with Nuendo or Wavelab. Even if it were compatible, you would not want to add the additional processing overhead when processing a number of individual channels during mixing.

G

 

[darklegion]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaZa /img/forum/go_quote.gif I can imagine some problems might arise if your computer is 100% taxed and is unable to decompress it in realtime, but I havent tested this. Even then I GUESS it would only produce choppy audio at worst as it has to stop and load more data to play. Computer noise is pretty much irrelevant if external DAC is used and it is away from other electrical noise, but this applies to CD players aswell.

IIRC cpu usage with flac is very low; probably as low or lower than mp3.No modern PC or portable player is going to have any issue with playing them.

 

[MaZa]

Quote:

Originally Posted by darklegion /img/forum/go_quote.gif IIRC cpu usage with flac is very low; probably as low or lower than mp3.No modern PC or portable player is going to have any issue with playing them.

Yeah, but that was just an estimation of what-if situation, like some program has already brought your CPU to its knees and then you try to add flac playing on top. But it still might be easy enough to not chop audio.

 

[dazzer1975]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rederanged /img/forum/go_quote.gif Higher settings do not affect the decompression speed, just the time it takes to compress the file in the first place. See: FLAC - faq

excellent, thanks for that and the link also.

Thanks to everyone else too for answering my questions and providing the advice and info needed.

 

[myhandtel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by EnOYiN /img/forum/go_quote.gif Nonsense, stop trolling please. Only if you are running a pentium 1 you might get into some trouble and probably not even then. The workload to decompress FLACs is simply too low. Like Maza mentioned you won't end up with noise, but without sound or choppy sound. Read the comment above - the nonsense part. There are hardly any people who are able to consistently tell the difference between a high quality lossy file and a lossless one. Let alone tell the difference between one lossless format and another. You can look up the results of various tests on this very forum. Read up on the subject before saying things which are simply not true please.

well a placebo maybe. Until we can find something to measure it.

 

[krmathis]

Quote:

Originally Posted by myhandtel /img/forum/go_quote.gif yes, in short lossless->realtime decompressing->more workload->more noise many people can abx wav and lossless but i can't, so i just stick to lossless

Yeah, right!

As mentioned by others, if your CPU run out of cycles decoding the FLAC file (very unlikely) you will just end up with choppy music. There will be no noise.

FLAC decode real-time on portables with ~100-200MHz processor, so I doubt your 2-3GHz processor will run out of steam...