[userlander]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donunus /img/forum/go_quote.gif I was just observing the extra punchiness people have been talking about with the udac. Ive noticed that the upper bass is slightly boosted but only if I use the internal amp. IMO this is actually a nice boost to make the little amp in it feel more controlled than the usual amp at the small specified power output it has. As for the lower mids I feel it is perfect with my hd580s. The midrange is a little boosted too when the internal amp is used but also in a pleasant way. When using the udac with my little dot mk2 with ef92... What else can I say? I prefer it to any other dac i've ever owned including the almost $1000 mhdt havana Take note again that all these impressions are made using hd580s. EDIT: Just to give you guys an idea of how much of a boost in bass were talking about here, The uDac boosts the bass(compared to my other dacs) relatively less than using the hd650 cable on the hd580s vs the stock cable.

Better than the $1,000 havana dac?? Wow, that is some impression the uDAC has made on you. In my brief listening so far, the MF V-DAC easily bests both the uDAC and the DAC Extasy I just got in every aspect -- there's just "more" of everything: clarity, extension (at both ends), presence -- it's clearly in another league from these two budget dacs. That DAC is $200 more, though. It's said to perform above its price also, just like these other dacs do in their class, but I didn't realize it could compete with $1,000 DACs. That's good to know.

As I compare these two new DACs, the uDAC and the Extasy, I'm trying to come up with new ways to describe this midrange forwardness more accurately. I was thinking that on a scale of -5 to 5, with 0 being completely neutral, -5 being very "U"-shaped recessed, and 5 being inverted "U" shaped forward, the uDAC is about a 2. Does that accord with everyone's experience? Maybe 1.5 - 2?

Someone asked a few pages back when we were talking about this forward issue what I would recommend then for around $100 if not the uDAC. I can say now that clearly that would be the Dac-Extasy, which compares favorably to the uDAC without having that low midrange hump. More impressions comparing these two to come, but preliminarily I can recommend the Dac-Extasy to anyone looking for a more neutral DAC without this forwardness issue. As I said in the hotaudio thread, the two dacs are very much in the same class, and a comparison is going to be very difficult -- in the end I suspect coming down to nothing more than personal preferences. But that would be my answer right now at least.


>>edit: a couple of pics:

 

[glac1er]

I've just googled the DAC Extasy and it seems to cost $190. That's quite a bit more than the uDAC, looking forward to your impressions on these two

.

 

[userlander]

Quote:

Originally Posted by glac1er /img/forum/go_quote.gif I've just googled the DAC Extasy and it seems to cost $190. That's quite a bit more than the uDAC, looking forward to your impressions on these two .

I don't really know how much it "actually" costs, to be honest.

He tends to change his prices all the time, I guess based on demand. He also has a "make offer" link, and generally seems to take reasonable offers. So all I know is I got it for much less so that it's comparable with the uDAC by using the "make offer" link.

 

[K_19]

Yeah, hotaudio sometimes has outrageous sales on their amps/dacs. Wouldn't be surprised if it drops it to the uDAC's price at some point.

 

[roker]

From my point of view though, the µDac is a very good travel companion. Having the headphone amp is a big plus for people that want good audio while traveling or at work.

I also felt my Keces 151 bested it:

Digital Rain | A Blog about Electronics and Entertainment.

 

[userlander]

Quote:

Originally Posted by roker /img/forum/go_quote.gif From my point of view though, the µDac is a very good travel companion. Having the headphone amp is a big plus for people that want good audio while traveling or at work. I also felt my Keces 151 bested it: Digital Rain | A Blog about Electronics and Entertainment.

That is definitely a plus of the uDAC. I would estimate that the uDAC can output roughly about 25 percent more power than the HP-out of the extasy (I think my math is right

). Or put another way, the two are approx. volume matched when the uDAC volume is at about 3/4 -- about where the marker would be if there were a dot on the opposite side of the case from where there's one now for "full" (there's no volume control on the extasy, in case anyone didn't see the picture).

The volume is fine on both with low impedance phones, but for more demanding phones you might require the extra power of the uDAC if you didn't have an amp. I'm not sure how the extasy would drive phones like the HD600, etc. I don't have those anymore to test. I think Larry and possibly some others have said the uDAC is more than adequate for casual listening with HD600, but for more demanding or critical listening you obviously would want a full scale amp for phones like that, pretty much regardless of the DAC.

I do know it's more than fine with MS-1s with PC app. volume at 60%, with 80% being absolutely as high as I'd want to go (and that's LOUD). It sounded fine with DT880s too, but those are 250ohm, not 300. So against all that, estimate that the uDAC still has roughly 25% more headroom, and that might make some difference with 300+ ohm phones. The uDAC's more emphasized lower mids would probably contribute to a more "boosted" or amplified feeling, too, as long as it didn't get too muddy.

There's still no doubt those frequencies are relatively enhanced or forward on the uDAC compared to neutral. I'm starting to see that there's also a very slight sense of "sizzle" on the high end, which together makes the vocal mid area *relatively* more recessed sounding in comparison. On Pearl Jam - "Even Flow," for example, the vocals are ever so slightly recessed compared to the extasy, which has an overall more even response throughout the spectrum. Same for The Jam - "That's Entertainment," and it seems to be the pattern with everything else, too.

So once again, keep in mind that all these observations are all RELATIVE, and that we are also talking about micro-level differences. "Regular" non-audio enthusiast listeners probably wouldn't even notice. But supposedly that's what we're about, so we might as well try to be as accurate as possible about it.

 

[wonedad]

uDAC > powered sub woofer > active speakers

could this possibly work? I want some opinions before I throw my reference sub into the chain.

 

[Armaegis]

As long as your sub has a line out for the speakers.

 

[AmanGeorge]

Yep - I have used this exact setup at my desk (my sub has a line out)

 

[donunus]

Quote:

Originally Posted by userlander /img/forum/go_quote.gif Better than the $1,000 havana dac??

The havana is more like an apples an oranges comparison though since it has a totally different sound. Its like comparing analog to digital. I just happen to not like the sound of analog. It lacks bite, drive and is a little too fat sounding for me. I'm sure that for an analog lover, the havana trounces the udac. I just listened to a vpi turntable recently that sounded very much like the havana.

 

[userlander]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donunus /img/forum/go_quote.gif The havana is more like an apples an oranges comparison though since it has a totally different sound. Its like comparing analog to digital. I just happen to not like the sound of analog. It lacks bite, drive and is a little too fat sounding for me. I'm sure that for an analog lover, the havana trounces the udac. I just listened to a vpi turntable recently that sounded very much like the havana.

I see - I didn't really know anything about it except that it was a tube dac.

Glad you got everything sorted out with the shipping and are enjoying your uDAC.

 

[drizek]

userland, I am surprised that you say the uDAC puts out a lot of volume. My iBasso T1 gets my HD 580s louder than the uDAC. Not by much, but I was surprised. I expected the uDAC amp to be a little more powerful . This can only be good for my hearing though.

 

[donunus]

The udac wont let your ears bleed with the 580 but the thing is it gets rid of the veil in the way it sounds compared to onboard laptop sound. I havent heard the ibasso though.

 

[userlander]

I haven't heard the ibasso either, but I just listened to the uDAC straight out of HP jack with DT880, and pretty much confirms earlier observations with MS-1. With uDAC at 100%, 60-80 percent is comfortable with DT880.

By contrast, I plugged in my PK3s, and anything over about 40 percent (with uDAC at full) was too much. So there is fair amount of power from the uDAC for portable listening, no doubt about that, and even for driving larger phones to adequate volume levels.

I think what donunus says here is also true, at least for the 880s:

Quote:

Originally Posted by donunus /img/forum/go_quote.gif userlander, Maybe the dt880s and the uDac also dont match very perfectly in the bass because the 880s are pretty punchy down there and the udac is said to be the same. Maybe it comes out to be too much? The hd580/600s however are rich in the lower mids but the midbass can use the added punch/control. I hope this uDac gives me just that.

 

[HeatFan12]

Well, received it and have been listening for a while with the built-in headamp. Phones I had out were the ESW9s so plugged them in and they sound very very good. Granted, the ESW9s are easily driven but I know their sig very well and have to say the uDac hits it well. Next couple of days my other phones will fall into the rotation.

My word for the day to describe the uDac- "aggresively laid back"...lol..

Plugged it in to my Windows 7 laptop and Vistax64 desktop and so far so good with WASAPI, KS and ASIO4ALL...

The real test for me will be with one of my tube amps to see how it behaves noise-wise. I have moved around all my gear to have black backrounds with all my amps, especially straight tube..

NuForce has definitely come out with a winner. Want to thank Larry for giving us the heads up on this product and everyone else's input is much appreciated.....