[DenverW]

I would experiment. You can always resell something if it isn’t to your taste. I think a original focal clear would suit your chain very well, and is a very near step to high end headphones. They will be more intimate with a smaller than speakers (as pretty much any headphone would be) but they’re comfortable and sound great. Zmf Aeolus have been going used in a very similar price range.

 

[DenverW]

Thanks for chiming in, Deolum. I understand some technologies change quickly, but I'm skeptical that headphone technology is excelling at such a pace. I think the Sennheiser HD 650 headphones seem like a good first choice, especially for someone who is inexperienced and not entirely sure what sound-signature they are looking for. After reading through the responses here, and a lot of reviews elsewhere, it seems to me that each pair of cans has its own strengths and is particularly well-suited for some music, but not all. So, it seems inevitable that I will end up purchasing a second pair at some point. My only worry with the HD 650s is that they will not live up to the rest of my audio chain. Do you think the Bifrost 2 and Jotunheim 2 combo is overkill for the 650s?

Another thought I've been having is, maybe I should buy a pair that do something my loudspeakers can't do. I listen with loudspeakers most of the time, so I'm very tempted to go with the suggested HIFIMAN Arya headphones, thinking they might deliver a totally different sound based on the planar technology, as well as a larger sense of sound-stage because each ear is totally isolated.

Both the hd650 and hd600 scale very well and would not be wasted on your chain. They’re classics for a reason, and I have both.

 

[Bhk1004]

under 1k depending on preferences, my vote goes to HE6SE, HD800, and Clears. I also have a soft spot for ZMF Aeolus, its like my comfort food of headphones. Can just mindlessly listen all day.

 

[HBen]

Hifiman Edition X V2, Arya or HE1000V1 can surely all be had at this price point and are imo pretty hard to beat in that price range. They are also great all rounders and very comfortable. A great alternative would a HD800 make, but the already mentioned HD650 or 600 surely are great cans too even if not as good as the HD800 or the mentioned Hifimans.
ZMF's are good too but too heavy for longer listening periods or to be the main headphone imo.
Best of luck and have fun on your headphone journey.


@E8ArmyDiver:

A few observations.A new,under $1000.00 headphone(even @$500.00ish) will absolutely outperform a used 3 year old TOTL can..Trickle down technology means looking in the middle of a line up gets you 90% of what that $3000.00 headphone gives you for half the cost..Some TOTL headphones are a beeatch to drive & need superb(expensive)amps/dacs to perform.I'm not familiar with your gear but Schiit is all over here (hahahahahahahaa couldn't resist)so I'm sure someone has stepped in it..

I'm really curious to know which 500$ (or even 1000$) headphones are better than a Hifiman Susvara or Shangri-La, a Sennheiser Orpheus, a Stax 009/007, an Abyss Diana or 1266 Phi, a Focal Utopia or an Audeze LCD4, since these are all over 3 years old.
Obviously we are all wasting our money so please let us know what we obviously don't so we can have 500$-headphones that are better than the ones mentioned as well.

 

[E8ArmyDiver]

^^^ you obviously looking for a fight & I'm game..It's clear you have drank the kool aid.HOW MANY minor upgrades have EVERY one of your so called TOTL's undergone in the last 3 years???So your saying ALL these upgrades mean nothing & the 3 year old model sounds exactly the same as a current version.TOTL being better is an illusion created by high $ manufacturers & your sub conscience mind to justify throwing $ away to prove you can afford "the best".
For the record,the iBasso SR-1,with the PT-1 pads could challenge ANY TOTL in a double blind,level matched listening contest but then you $ for sound zelotts WON'T take a challenge like that,instead believing in your golden ears...

 

[PointyFox]

• I prefer to purchase second-hand to maximize value. Maybe this also means something several years old so I can actually find a pair on the used market.
  • Focal Clear seems to be selling for cheaper than usual since they were replaced with the MG version (which I think sounds worse).
• Would like to keep it under $1000.
  • Good headphones under $1000 used: ZMF Eikon, Focal Clear, Sennheiser HD800(S), or the Koss ESP/95X or Sennheiser HD600 if you want to go cheap (~$200 for HD600 and $250 for Koss ESP/95X).
• Open or closed? These are for an at-home office that remains pretty quiet during the day, so open are acceptable, but I have no experience with open-back headphones. What matters the most to me is the quality of the sound. If you recommend one over the other, why?
  • Open generally sounds better (sounds more open).
• More than aesthetics, I value durability and longevity.
  • Of the headphones I mentioned, the most long lasting are the ZMF Eikon (replaceable headband, pads, and cable), and the HD600 (replaceable headband cushion, pads, and cable). The Focal has a non-replaceable headband pad, but replaceable earpads and cable. The HD800(S) has replaceable parts, but they are a little hard to find and expensive. The Koss ESP/95X has replaceable pads, but not cable or headband.
• Audio chain will be PC streaming sources > Schiit Bifrost 2 > Schiit Lokius > Schiit Jotunheim 2. Hopefully it pairs well with the Jotunheim. Balanced vs SE?
  • That's already overkill. No need to upgrade. Balanced is only audibly better if the SE output doesn't make your headphones loud enough, otherwise they're audibly identical.
• I listen to all kinds of rock, electronic, pop, instrumental, indie/folk/weird stuff, blues and jazz. So something that is well-rounded would probably be best. I can use the EQ if needed, so I don't need something bass heavy or overly sharp and analytical.
  • Best without EQ would be the Focal Clear and ZMF Eikon. The others are a little lacking in bass and the HD800 is a little treble heavy. The Koss ESP/95X and HD800S are pretty good without EQ.
• Personal experience is preferred over hear-say, but I also appreciate links to elsewhere if you know a good source.
  • I've owned all these headphones. I've owned at least 100 headphones. I saw the Arya mentioned but I don't recommend it due to a lack of dynamics/impact and I think the HD800S, Clear, and Eikon outperform it.

ZMF Eikon: ~$900-1100. Semi-closed back. Durable, good looking, slightly heavy. Good dynamics and tone. Sounds pretty open for a closed-back.
Focal Clear: ~$750-950. Open back. Great dynamics, excellent tone. Soundstage a little close.
Sennheiser HD800(S): ~$700-1050. Open back. Great soundstage. Lacking a little in bass.
Koss ESP/95X: ~$250-400. Open back. Electrostatic. Phenomenal price to performance. Electrostatic speed, great mid-range. Lacking a little in bass.
Sennheiser HD600: ~$150-220. Open back. Durable. Good tone. Lacking a little in bass. I prefer it to the HD650 due to more natural tone.

 

[DenverW]

^^^ you obviously looking for a fight & I'm game..It's clear you have drank the kool aid.HOW MANY minor upgrades have EVERY one of your so called TOTL's undergone in the last 3 years???So your saying ALL these upgrades mean nothing & the 3 year old model sounds exactly the same as a current version.TOTL being better is an illusion created by high $ manufacturers & your sub conscience mind to justify throwing $ away to prove you can afford "the best".
For the record,the iBasso SR-1,with the PT-1 pads could challenge ANY TOTL in a double blind,level matched listening contest but then you $ for sound zelotts WON'T take a challenge like that,instead believing in your golden ears...

Count me as a sound zealot then. I didn't find it a bad headphone, but I don't find the sr-1 matching any of the recommendations I mentioned above, and would take less expensive headphones such as the hd600 over it. If you think it could match a well driven susvara, 009, or other totl headphones with just some different pads...well then, more power to you.

Lets get back to helping this fella find a good pair of cans for work.

 

[zomkung]

KOSS ESP 95X with Leather Pads.

• I prefer to purchase second-hand to maximize value. Maybe this also means something several years old so I can actually find a pair on the used market.
  • Focal Clear seems to be selling for cheaper than usual since they were replaced with the MG version (which I think sounds worse).
• Would like to keep it under $1000.
  • Good headphones under $1000 used: ZMF Eikon, Focal Clear, Sennheiser HD800(S), or the Koss ESP/95X or Sennheiser HD600 if you want to go cheap (~$200 for HD600 and $250 for Koss ESP/95X).
• Open or closed? These are for an at-home office that remains pretty quiet during the day, so open are acceptable, but I have no experience with open-back headphones. What matters the most to me is the quality of the sound. If you recommend one over the other, why?
  • Open generally sounds better (sounds more open).
• More than aesthetics, I value durability and longevity.
  • Of the headphones I mentioned, the most long lasting are the ZMF Eikon (replaceable headband, pads, and cable), and the HD600 (replaceable headband cushion, pads, and cable). The Focal has a non-replaceable headband pad, but replaceable earpads and cable. The HD800(S) has replaceable parts, but they are a little hard to find and expensive. The Koss ESP/95X has replaceable pads, but not cable or headband.
• Audio chain will be PC streaming sources > Schiit Bifrost 2 > Schiit Lokius > Schiit Jotunheim 2. Hopefully it pairs well with the Jotunheim. Balanced vs SE?
  • That's already overkill. No need to upgrade. Balanced is only audibly better if the SE output doesn't make your headphones loud enough, otherwise they're audibly identical.
• I listen to all kinds of rock, electronic, pop, instrumental, indie/folk/weird stuff, blues and jazz. So something that is well-rounded would probably be best. I can use the EQ if needed, so I don't need something bass heavy or overly sharp and analytical.
  • Best without EQ would be the Focal Clear and ZMF Eikon. The others are a little lacking in bass and the HD800 is a little treble heavy. The Koss ESP/95X and HD800S are pretty good without EQ.
• Personal experience is preferred over hear-say, but I also appreciate links to elsewhere if you know a good source.
  • I've owned all these headphones. I've owned at least 100 headphones. I saw the Arya mentioned but I don't recommend it due to a lack of dynamics/impact and I think the HD800S, Clear, and Eikon outperform it.

ZMF Eikon: ~$900-1100. Semi-closed back. Durable, good looking, slightly heavy. Good dynamics and tone. Sounds pretty open for a closed-back.
Focal Clear: ~$750-950. Open back. Great dynamics, excellent tone. Soundstage a little close.
Sennheiser HD800(S): ~$700-1050. Open back. Great soundstage. Lacking a little in bass.
Koss ESP/95X: ~$250-400. Open back. Electrostatic. Phenomenal price to performance. Electrostatic speed, great mid-range. Lacking a little in bass.
Sennheiser HD600: ~$150-220. Open back. Durable. Good tone. Lacking a little in bass. I prefer it to the HD650 due to more natural tone.

Vote KOSS ESP/95X, but you'll need the leather pads.

 

[Deolum]

^^^ you obviously looking for a fight & I'm game..It's clear you have drank the kool aid.HOW MANY minor upgrades have EVERY one of your so called TOTL's undergone in the last 3 years???So your saying ALL these upgrades mean nothing & the 3 year old model sounds exactly the same as a current version.TOTL being better is an illusion created by high $ manufacturers & your sub conscience mind to justify throwing $ away to prove you can afford "the best".
For the record,the iBasso SR-1,with the PT-1 pads could challenge ANY TOTL in a double blind,level matched listening contest but then you $ for sound zelotts WON'T take a challenge like that,instead believing in your golden ears...

Sadly most upgrades make headphones worse. I agree that totl is overrated. Thats why my favourite headphones of all time are currently HD650 (first version), HD250 (600 ohm) and HE560 (V1). Even though i owned many totl headphones including Susvara and still own the Empyrean and the ADX-5000.

But as much as totl is overrated, upgrades are as well. HD650 first version is usually better than old one, Audezes fazor upgrade wasn't a real upgrade, HD800S was a sidegrade not an upgrade, HekSE isn't better than HekV2 and even though i like the new Hifimans they're not really better than the old ones. Usually all these newer headphones appear to be slightly better technical wise but they have some sort of boosted treble. The older headphones sound more realistic and natural to me. The only thing where new headphones are really better is drivability with low power sources. The older headphones usually need lots of power.

Thanks for chiming in, Deolum. I understand some technologies change quickly, but I'm skeptical that headphone technology is excelling at such a pace. I think the Sennheiser HD 650 headphones seem like a good first choice, especially for someone who is inexperienced and not entirely sure what sound-signature they are looking for. After reading through the responses here, and a lot of reviews elsewhere, it seems to me that each pair of cans has its own strengths and is particularly well-suited for some music, but not all. So, it seems inevitable that I will end up purchasing a second pair at some point. My only worry with the HD 650s is that they will not live up to the rest of my audio chain. Do you think the Bifrost 2 and Jotunheim 2 combo is overkill for the 650s?

Another thought I've been having is, maybe I should buy a pair that do something my loudspeakers can't do. I listen with loudspeakers most of the time, so I'm very tempted to go with the suggested HIFIMAN Arya headphones, thinking they might deliver a totally different sound based on the planar technology, as well as a larger sense of sound-stage because each ear is totally isolated.

Absolutely no overkill. When i didn't have the HD650 but HD600 i ran them from my Metrum Pavane -> Audiovalve Solaris setup and they were maybe my second most favourite headphone there after the Utopia.

 

[Barone Birra]

Fostex TH 909, if you're lucky enough to find it under 1000. Detailed but fun and punchy.

 

[ohmy]

@Levanter @DenverW @Bhk1004 @HBen @PointyFox
You all mentioned or praised the ZMF headphones. I'm giving the Auteur, Eikon, and even Verite some serious consideration. The are made in the USA and look to be highly durable, which I appreciate. I don't need them to be so aesthetically pleasing, but wow, it goes without saying - they are gorgeous! I enjoyed the description of the Auteur, being made neutral and ready for tweaking. I personally like to play with EQ while I listen. I will post back here when I do finally pick a pair, even if it's not ZMF. Either way, thank you so much for the recommendations!

 

[PointyFox]

I've owned 2 pairs of ZMF Eikons, 1 pair of ZMF Verite, and have a pair of ZMF Verite Closed on order

The only complaint I hear is that some of them can feel heavy, but ZMF makes a pad that widens the headband further that can be used to increase comfort.

I prefer the Drop velour pads on the Koss. Way more breathable than the leather.

 

[HiFiHawaii808]

@Levanter @DenverW @Bhk1004 @HBen @PointyFox
You all mentioned or praised the ZMF headphones. I'm giving the Auteur, Eikon, and even Verite some serious consideration. The are made in the USA and look to be highly durable, which I appreciate. I don't need them to be so aesthetically pleasing, but wow, it goes without saying - they are gorgeous! I enjoyed the description of the Auteur, being made neutral and ready for tweaking. I personally like to play with EQ while I listen. I will post back here when I do finally pick a pair, even if it's not ZMF. Either way, thank you so much for the recommendations!

I highly endorse zmf headphones. The auteur would be most like the arya or hd800s. Zmf headphones sound best with tube amps. Keep that in mind. Also, zmf headphones are low risk because they hold their value. You can try out several and not have to worry about reselling it.

 

[ohmy]

• I prefer to purchase second-hand to maximize value. Maybe this also means something several years old so I can actually find a pair on the used market.
  • Focal Clear seems to be selling for cheaper than usual since they were replaced with the MG version (which I think sounds worse).
• Would like to keep it under $1000.
  • Good headphones under $1000 used: ZMF Eikon, Focal Clear, Sennheiser HD800(S), or the Koss ESP/95X or Sennheiser HD600 if you want to go cheap (~$200 for HD600 and $250 for Koss ESP/95X).
• Open or closed? These are for an at-home office that remains pretty quiet during the day, so open are acceptable, but I have no experience with open-back headphones. What matters the most to me is the quality of the sound. If you recommend one over the other, why?
  • Open generally sounds better (sounds more open).
• More than aesthetics, I value durability and longevity.
  • Of the headphones I mentioned, the most long lasting are the ZMF Eikon (replaceable headband, pads, and cable), and the HD600 (replaceable headband cushion, pads, and cable). The Focal has a non-replaceable headband pad, but replaceable earpads and cable. The HD800(S) has replaceable parts, but they are a little hard to find and expensive. The Koss ESP/95X has replaceable pads, but not cable or headband.
• Audio chain will be PC streaming sources > Schiit Bifrost 2 > Schiit Lokius > Schiit Jotunheim 2. Hopefully it pairs well with the Jotunheim. Balanced vs SE?
  • That's already overkill. No need to upgrade. Balanced is only audibly better if the SE output doesn't make your headphones loud enough, otherwise they're audibly identical.
• I listen to all kinds of rock, electronic, pop, instrumental, indie/folk/weird stuff, blues and jazz. So something that is well-rounded would probably be best. I can use the EQ if needed, so I don't need something bass heavy or overly sharp and analytical.
  • Best without EQ would be the Focal Clear and ZMF Eikon. The others are a little lacking in bass and the HD800 is a little treble heavy. The Koss ESP/95X and HD800S are pretty good without EQ.
• Personal experience is preferred over hear-say, but I also appreciate links to elsewhere if you know a good source.
  • I've owned all these headphones. I've owned at least 100 headphones. I saw the Arya mentioned but I don't recommend it due to a lack of dynamics/impact and I think the HD800S, Clear, and Eikon outperform it.

ZMF Eikon: ~$900-1100. Semi-closed back. Durable, good looking, slightly heavy. Good dynamics and tone. Sounds pretty open for a closed-back.
Focal Clear: ~$750-950. Open back. Great dynamics, excellent tone. Soundstage a little close.
Sennheiser HD800(S): ~$700-1050. Open back. Great soundstage. Lacking a little in bass.
Koss ESP/95X: ~$250-400. Open back. Electrostatic. Phenomenal price to performance. Electrostatic speed, great mid-range. Lacking a little in bass.
Sennheiser HD600: ~$150-220. Open back. Durable. Good tone. Lacking a little in bass. I prefer it to the HD650 due to more natural tone.

Whoa, you went above an beyond with your response... thank you, PointyFox! This was super helpful and I'm taking all of your recommendations to heart. I have to ask, do you have any experience with the ZMF Auteur vs Eikon. Those seem like a sweet-spot for most of my needs/wants. I'll be doing my due diligence and looking for reviews specifically about the ZMF line but would love to hear your (brief) take on any/all of their models. Again, thank you for the wonderful reply. Edit: Oops, just saw your recent reply. Thanks for the input!

 

[DenverW]

I would recommend the auteur with perf leather auteur and suede eikon pads (If ordering from zmf you get to pick). Those are my two favorite pad types and have sound signatures different enough to make pad swaps enjoyable.