[manukmanohar]

Just got the Fiio BTR5 a few days back. On balanced mode, it trumps the ES100 not just in terms of tonality, based on initial impressions. There was a step up in resolution as well. As of now, I found BTR5 > Hiby W5 > ES100 for SQ alone. (Hiby W5 from memory as i no longer have them).

Those who are using it with clip mode, any idea what would be the ideal length for the cable. I was planning to get a short balanced cable. Would 65 cm do?

 

[sinquito]

Anyone compared this with Q5/Q5S? How does it fare with stock amp module? Thinking of getting BTR5 to replace my Q5+THX combo.

I have the Q5s, recently I've been using the BTR5. SQ sound pretty much the same to me, but I haven't done a proper comparison. If I have to choose one, probably would be the BTR5 as is more convenient, smaller, doesn't heat up like the Q5s, has a pretty useful screen, it's USB C instead of micro USB and it 1/3 of the price of the Q5s. The only two things that the Q5s seems to be better is the optical/coax input and line in/line out and that you can swap the amp modules. Maybe if you have a lot of 4.4 mm balanced cables (stock AM3E amp). I never quite liked the Q5s and end up buying a AM5 module because the stock module on the 3.5 mm is very feeble. The cost of the AM5 was the same as the BTR5 itself...

 

[psikey]

My review is up.

Don't agree at all with your comments on balanced. Most people who would buy this device are audio enthusiasts with mid to high end IEM's/headphones and in many cases have balanced cables. I had 2.5mm and 4.4mm for my SE846's already.

I also found the Balanced noticeably better than SE for sound stage, separation and generally more 3D and just nicer. I also find SE very good on this too so balanced isn't a must if you don't have the cables to still enjoy it. Slightly more battery life SE too.

I wouldn't have bought this without balanced.

 

[psikey]

Just got the Fiio BTR5 a few days back. On balanced mode, it trumps the ES100 not just in terms of tonality, based on initial impressions. There was a step up in resolution as well. As of now, I found BTR5 > Hiby W5 > ES100 for SQ alone. (Hiby W5 from memory as i no longer have them).

Those who are using it with clip mode, any idea what would be the ideal length for the cable. I was planning to get a short balanced cable. Would 65 cm do?

Well I use SE846 with MMCX connectors and Fiio's own Short balanced is perfect length & quality. I had a longer 2.5mm balanced cable but wanted the neatness of the shorter one.
https://penonaudio.com/fiio-lc-2.5bs-3.5bs.html?search=FiiO LC-2.5BS

They show length at Length: 45cm

Mine

 

[sinquito]

Regarding balanced cables, I didn't have a pair of balanced cables until last week that I got my AKG N5005, out of curiosity, first I listen to them on the BTR5 with the included 2.5 mm, they sounded ok, then I switched to the remote 3.5 mm cable and to my surprise the difference in loudness was not all that much, this is not a formal comparison, but to me balanced only makes sense when more power is needed and most IEMs are very efficient anyway. What I did find very useful is that the remote cable works with the BTR5, so you can play, pause, skip, go back and change volume using the remote, without taking out the Fiio out your pocket/pouch. I read about this feature on the Fiio webpage, but I forgot about it, but using it in real life is almost game changer, super convenient to say the least.

 

[pilgrimbilly]

Don't agree at all with your comments on balanced. Most people who would buy this device are audio enthusiasts with mid to high end IEM's/headphones and in many cases have balanced cables. I had 2.5mm and 4.4mm for my SE846's already.

I also found the Balanced noticeably better than SE for sound stage, separation and generally more 3D and just nicer. I also find SE very good on this too so balanced isn't a must if you don't have the cables to still enjoy it. Slightly more battery life SE too.

I wouldn't have bought this without balanced.

My thoughts exactly. Why the reviewer thinks balanced is a "minus" baffles me.

 

[Devodonaldson]

Interesting. I also have both and think in AAC mode XDSD has slightly better resolution while sounding a bit softer and warmer. Overall to me it wins in SQ, though it is a close match and depending on ones preferences maybe. LDAC might change things though....haven`t used it yet because I only have Apple devices....

Update to my findings. The treble that I was missing was easily found by turning on 3d mode. The sparkle that APTX misses when compared to LDAC is put back by the 3d mode, and I can certainly say that the XDSD even in APTX definitely beats the BTR5, as good as it is for being super portable. I'm glad, seeing as I paid nearly 4x as much for the XDSD. So 3d mode has 2 purposes. 1) boost treble, 2) add stereo-like imaging to mono recordings.

 

[Devodonaldson]

Hi All, (first post) I have purchased the BTR5 and really like it. BT when on the move and wired when at home.

My home setup is TIDAL/Spotify > iphone 11 > CCK > BTR5 (3.5mm)> HD599 . The sound to my ears is very detailed, but as always I want to see if I can get better, from wired as it always shows 44.1 on the BTR5. Can this be increased? I noticed a comment on the youtube review which mentions installing the Onkyo app to get some hi-res love, are there any other options to try? Any tips appreciated.

If you want to see some different numbers you're going to have to listen to some higher quality audio files. Spotify maxes out at 320kbps 16/44.1 files. Tidal Music hi-res tier, Qobuz, or your own purchased hi-res music files are what you will need

 

[joshnor713]

Don't agree at all with your comments on balanced. Most people who would buy this device are audio enthusiasts with mid to high end IEM's/headphones and in many cases have balanced cables. I had 2.5mm and 4.4mm for my SE846's already.

I also found the Balanced noticeably better than SE for sound stage, separation and generally more 3D and just nicer. I also find SE very good on this too so balanced isn't a must if you don't have the cables to still enjoy it. Slightly more battery life SE too.

I wouldn't have bought this without balanced.

Balanced isn't needed generally for IEMs, which doesn't require much to drive. You can attain the same thing from a properly made unbalanced port. Typically when manufacturers put both, it's tuned to the balanced port and the unbalanced port is an afterthought. Not all the time but many of the times. Speaking of just about all IEMs, balanced is just a fad.

 

[elNan]

...but to me balanced only makes sense when more power is needed and most IEMs are very efficient anyway

That's correct my friend @sinpito, balanced cables only make sense when you need more output power and your amplifier isn't powerful enough over SE.

 

[HipHopScribe]

Personally I think the whole balanced phenomenon in 99% audiophile nonsense (balanced for highly efficient IEMs is just silly), but FiiO is trying to sell a product and buyers want balanced, so it's really a no-brainer for FiiO to use it as a selling point

 

[manukmanohar]

Personally I think the whole balanced phenomenon in 99% audiophile nonsense (balanced for highly efficient IEMs is just silly), but FiiO is trying to sell a product and buyers want balanced, so it's really a no-brainer for FiiO to use it as a selling point

And the sad thing is that Fiio and other companies in future, would continue to do much more than just increasing the power possible in balanced mode vs SE mode. (see dual DAC in balanced mode vs single DAC use in SE mode for BTR5). This makes people wrongly conclude that the reason why BTR5 sounds good in balanced mode, is because no matter the power requirement (i.e how little would be required for most IEMs), balanced will always be better.

If for the same space, Fiio had opted to improve the SE circuitry alone, I'm sure they would be able to squeeze much much higher SQ out of the SE mode, without people having to buy extra balanced cables etc, especially for a device, which compared to other portable DACs is relatively on the lower side in both price and overall size. And that I think was the reviewer's point (not that balanced mode doesn't sound better currently than single ended mode).

Having said all that, I understand if people are using this for hard to drive headphones etc. for budget or convenience reasons, (in which case, probably having a balanced mode, might help get more power for the space required for the circuitry) , although in my opinion, it is probably not the best choice

 

[joshnor713]

I'm sure their competition (the popular ES100) is also a big factor in what drove them to design to a balanced port. Anyways, they (like many other companies) are doing it for all the reasons than what's practical.

 

[psikey]

If balance makes no difference, how am I hearing things improved? Just down to using 2 DACs? Vs 1 DAC in SE ?

A Sony ZX507 also sounds noticeably improved with 4.4mm balanced vs SE.

 

[sinquito]

If balance makes no difference, how am I hearing things improved? Just down to using 2 DACs? Vs 1 DAC in SE ?

A Sony ZX507 also sounds noticeably improved with 4.4mm balanced vs SE.

It's just your perception, you need two DACs in balanced because the ES9218P is a stereo DAC (meaning it has only two output channels), for balanced stereo you need four channels (two for right and two for left). That's why you need an additional DAC. Take a look at this short post by Benchmark:

https://benchmarkmedia.com/blogs/application_notes/audio-myth-balanced-headphone-outputs-are-better

I don't want to derail the thread, but I think that you heard that the balanced output sounds "better" because it's louder and our brains tell us that music sounds better if it's louder. If you can, try to listen balanced vs single ended volume matched. Anyway, I won't try to convince, just sharing my opinion.