Ferrum Audio ERCO - Headphone DAC/Amp
Jan 17, 2024 at 2:16 AM Post #106 of 120
Blog post
Looks like it's official. Initial pricing for the upgrade is only $200 (free for any Erco purchased at an authorized dealer after July 1st, 2023), which is very nice! I'll look into this; I had been interested in the Wandla for the improved filters, but if I can get them in the Erco (with other analog upgrades) and for only $200 instead of $2800, I'll be a very happy owner! In fact, looking through my receipts, I purchased mine just within the July 1st cut-off window for the

I am living in Turkey, and I have bought in 2022 October. I will wait first impressions from some upgraded Erco units, then will decide if it will worth to send. I already like it's current sound. I will only send if there is clear improvements.

So I hope someone can share their impressions here.
 
Jan 26, 2024 at 12:43 AM Post #107 of 120
Odd, that blog post I linked has been taken down. The price on the Ferrum web store has increased from 1795 EUR/USD seen on the product page to 1975 USD. There was also the Gen 2 upgrade option in the web store a few days ago, but that has been removed. I'm guessing that Ferrum is still working out the logistical details of the Gen 2 upgrade. The store upgrade listing did not have any way to offer proof of purchase within the free upgrade cut-off date, so I didn't go for it. The "click HERE for more info" part of the Erco Gen 2 product page description has never worked either, so I suspect it was announced a bit prematurely.

Next month, if everything goes well, I'll be at a meet-up where someone is planning to bring their Wandla. That way I should be able to compare the Wandla using the HQ Apodizing filter against my Erco side by side to get a sense of what I might get from the Gen 2. Looking forward to it.
 
Jan 29, 2024 at 2:28 PM Post #108 of 120
Updated blog post is now up

As I suspected, Ferrum just didn't have the exact upgrade procedure set up yet. This new blog post mentions how to upgrade the Erco: you open a support ticket and say that you want an upgrade and then they send you instructions. I presume that in the ticket you can provide your purchase receipt to show if you are eligible for the free upgrade. This info was also released earlier today on a Facebook reel on Ferrum's FB page. Plus, the Erco gen 2 product page now has a working link to the upgrade instructions.
 
Mar 29, 2024 at 10:47 AM Post #110 of 120
I really wish the US distributor would get back to me on my Gen 2 upgrade. I contacted them 2 weeks ago after Ferrum support pointed me to them and they responded to my support ticket asking for some info on my unit. I sent them that info later that day, and have heard nothing back from them since, even after I sent two reminder emails. Bit disappointing...
 
Apr 11, 2024 at 6:17 AM Post #111 of 120
Does anyone have any updates on Erco Gen 2 yet?
I'm looking to get mine upgraded. It seems good. But no reviews anywhere yet, and this forum has been weirdly quiet!
 
Apr 11, 2024 at 6:23 AM Post #112 of 120
Does anyone have any updates on Erco Gen 2 yet?
I'm looking to get mine upgraded. It seems good. But no reviews anywhere yet, and this forum has been weirdly quiet!
Lieven of headfonia.com is listening to it but have not published a complete review yet. In the latest audeze mm 100 review on their website are some initial impressions in the pair up section. I am curious about his thoughts because I value his opinion a lot.
 
Apr 11, 2024 at 8:33 AM Post #113 of 120
Does anyone have any updates on Erco Gen 2 yet?
I'm looking to get mine upgraded. It seems good. But no reviews anywhere yet, and this forum has been weirdly quiet!
I should be starting the upgrade soon. I contacted my dealer and he contacted the US distributor and the distributor finally got back to me after over 3 weeks of silence. I'll send out my unit for the upgrade next week. I see that Audio46 finally has 2 units of the Gen 2 in stock now, so hopefully we'll have more reviews soon.
 
Apr 11, 2024 at 8:36 AM Post #114 of 120
I should be starting the upgrade soon. I contacted my dealer and he contacted the US distributor and the distributor finally got back to me after over 3 weeks of silence. I'll send out my unit for the upgrade next week. I see that Audio46 finally has 2 units of the Gen 2 in stock now, so hopefully we'll have more reviews soon.
I called a store that Ferrum sent me to - they said Ferrum haven't shipped the parts yet and it's unknown still. So there's a waiting list until they get back. Explains why a lot of stores are being radio silent. There's probably a ton of boards that need producing and shipping!
 
Apr 18, 2024 at 2:12 PM Post #115 of 120
Sooo, I got my Erco Gen 2 back today. I shipped it out on Monday and on Wednesday the distributor overnighted it back to me.

I think the Gen 2 sounds better. Now of course, it's not an A/B test so I'm only comparing from memory, but it sounded more defined and clearer in the upper treble. I'm not going to go into further detail, because of the next thing that happened.

I had listened for about 25 minutes when the distributor called me and said that they had made a mistake on my unit :upside_down:. They missed installing some bolt or nut which, if I understood correctly, would cause reliability issues over the long term. In theory, that mistake shouldn't have affected the sound, but I'll reserve any further impressions until it gets fixed. They had been upgrading some 40 units and mine was the odd one out, or so they say. So I need to send it back. Womp womp. Fortunately, they've sent me a shipping label and they'll get this fixed ASAP. What an adventure though...
 
Apr 18, 2024 at 2:15 PM Post #116 of 120
Sooo, I got my Erco Gen 2 back today. I shipped it out on Monday and on Wednesday the distributor overnighted it back to me.

I think the Gen 2 sounds better. Now of course, it's not an A/B test so I'm only comparing from memory, but it sounded more defined and clearer in the upper treble. I'm not going to go into further detail, because of the next thing that happened.

I had listened for about 25 minutes when the distributor called me and said that they had made a mistake on my unit :upside_down:. They missed installing some bolt or nut which, if I understood correctly, would cause reliability issues over the long term. In theory, that mistake shouldn't have affected the sound, but I'll reserve any further impressions until it gets fixed. They had been upgrading some 40 units and mine was the odd one out, or so they say. So I need to send it back. Womp womp. Fortunately, they've sent me a shipping label and they'll get this fixed ASAP. What an adventure though...
Glad it sounds good. That's definitely a concern though. We have to trust whichever distributor to upgrade it correctly, and it's hard to know until long-term...

I'm sure they're trained first, but it's still a little worrying.
 
Last edited:
Apr 22, 2024 at 1:11 PM Post #117 of 120
Received the fixed Erco 2 on Saturday. Fast 2-day turnaround with the distributor (I sent it back out on Thursday), so props to them on that. Listened to it yesterday and my impressions are positive.

My listening chain was the Erco 2 acting as a DAC with XLR line output feeding a CCS-modded Stax SRM-006tS driving the Stax SR-X9000. I'm using the Erco's stock PSU, but with the Shunyata Delta v2 NR power cable connecting the PSU to the wall. Now, I think the Delta makes a difference to the sound (more than the Hypsos), but I also used the Delta on the Erco before I upgraded to the Gen 2, so the cable (and any views on cable effects) should be irrelevant to any differences I hear between gen 1 and gen 2.

The two most significant changes vs the Gen 1 are the reduction in "hash" or "haze" in the treble and more precise imaging and localization of sounds. The two combine to produce a more pronounced sense of detail, but I don't think it has more absolute detail, just that it's easier to pick up on details on the Erco 2.

The reduction of hash in the treble has the dual effects of reducing perceived overall treble quantity as well as increasing the perception of mids and bass. To be clear, there is no reduction of treble quality or presence of notes. It's not like a shelving EQ which reduces quantity without changing its texture or quality. The decrease in hash comes from the improved antialiasing filter (HQ Apodizing) which has full attenuation before the Nyquist frequency. Thus, there's no aliasing to contribute to the "hash" in the upper treble. For me, this improvement is most obvious with hi-hats and cymbals. On many DACs, including the FiiO K9 Pro I used for comparison (since I don't have the Erco gen 1 for direct comparison), there's a slight smearing of hi-hat hits on either side of the transient, so instead of a clean transient like "TSH" it sounds more like "sTSHss"; there's this slight sizzle before and after the hit. This gives the hi-hats a "shimmering" character which can sound softer or sifted (think of sifting sugar or salt and that soft "shshshsh" sound it makes), but it also smears the sound. The Erco 2 does not do that. Cymbals and hi-hats are crisp and clear in attack and decay. Because there's no extra shimmer, the upper treble sounds less busy, so other parts of the sound seem easier to hear at the same time, but the treble is no less detailed and it is often easier to separate different notes from each other.

This is really helpful for the EDM that I enjoy because there's often a layer of noise in the track that adds energy to the sound and the Erco 2 lets the noise add the energy without letting it pollute the rest of the track. Songs I used for this were "Worst Day" by Illenium and MAX, "Love Is A Highway" by Nurko and NERIAH, and "Rest of My Life" by Culture Code and Medyk. All of these tracks have that layer of white-ish noise during the drop alongside synths, hi-hats, electronic snares, and more, and the cleaner treble on the Erco 2 allows elements of the music to remain crisp and clear during the busy portions. In particular, the soft background vocal echoes in the drop of "Love Is A Highway" are distinct on the Erco 2 vs other DACs where they're harder to hear. The cleaner treble also improves mids and bass (or more accurately, notes/instruments that lean on those frequency bands) because better treble cleans up the transients for those notes. So it seems like mids and bass are more prominent, but they aren't boosted, they're just cleaner and unimpeded by treble hash and smeared transients.

This reduction in treble hash is something that you can get with apodizing filters in HQPlayer. I experimented with HQPlayer for a bit prior to getting the Erco Gen 2 and I heard there a reduction in hash and a perceived increase in bass prominence as well as better perceived detail. Since the Erco 2's (and Wandla's) HQ Apodizing filter was developed by the guy who makes HQPlayer, it makes sense that this filter does similar things.

The more precise imaging is also related to that absence of haze and smearing. This time, it's like the lack of smear in the spatial rendering of a note. Think of looking at a light through frosted glass; the glass will diffuse the light around it and the edges becomes hazy while the light source appears larger than it is. If you look at the light without the glass, the edges of the light source are better defined. The increased spatial definition makes it easier for me to "lock on" to sounds, so it increases the perception of detail. Now, if I were to A/B compare vs another DAC, I can hear all of those same details, but on the other DAC, the sound isn't as well defined in space, more like a blob of sound, so it is harder for me to lock on to it unless I already knew it was there.

Fortunately, the Erco 2 retains the punchy and dynamic sound of the original Erco. The slight emphasis to the leading edges of notes makes music "pop", like each pluck of a string or smack of a drum stick is momentarily highlighted vs the trailing decay. I found this quality to be very engaging on the original Erco and I'm glad to see that the Gen 2 refinements haven't removed this aspect of the sound. I suppose it's not as punch-emphasized as the Gen 1, but mainly because you can hear better texture in bass due to the cleanup of the treble, so that improved texture competes with the punch for your attention. The punch didn't get worse, everything else just got better.

Listening to the X9000 with the Erco 2 was probably the best I've heard the X9000 at home. I did not really enjoy the X9000 with the original Erco; the original was too forward and when combined with the midrange emphasis of the X9000 it sounded like the mouths of vocalists were stretched out between my eyeballs - they were rendered too wide and too forward for my tastes. And that resulted in "soundstage collapse" where it sounded like the music had no frontal depth, just a flat sheet between my ears. Even though the K9 Pro was less dynamic, I often preferred the X9000 on that DAC since it wasn't so forward that the soundstage collapsed. The more precise imaging of the Erco 2 fixes that problem. The midrange is still pretty forward on the X9000, but vocalists are now better defined in space - not as wide - and I can get the spatial layering that I heard when I demoed the X9000 on the Chord Hugo TT2. The difference in treble quality from the Erco 2 was also easily apparent on the X9000.

Anyways, I like the Erco Gen 2; I think it's a noticeable and real upgrade (rather than just a different flavor) from the Gen 1. I can't wait to listen more.
 
Last edited:
Apr 22, 2024 at 1:51 PM Post #118 of 120
Received the fixed Erco 2 on Saturday. Fast 2-day turnaround with the distributor (I sent it back out on Thursday), so props to them on that. Listened to it yesterday and my impressions are positive.

My listening chain was the Erco 2 acting as a DAC with XLR line output feeding a CCS-modded Stax SRM-006tS driving the Stax SR-X9000. I'm using the Erco's stock PSU, but with the Shunyata Delta v2 NR power cable connecting the PSU to the wall. Now, I think the Delta makes a difference to the sound (more than the Hypsos), but I also used the Delta on the Erco before I upgraded to the Gen 2, so the cable should be irrelevant to any differences I hear between gen 1 and gen 2.

The two most significant changes vs the Gen 1 are the reduction in "hash" or "haze" in the treble and more precise imaging and localization of sounds. The two combine to produce a more pronounced sense of detail, but I don't think it has more absolute detail, just that it's easier to pick up on details on the Erco 2.

The reduction of hash in the treble has the dual effects of reducing perceived overall treble quantity as well as increasing the perception of mids and bass. To be clear, there is no reduction of treble quality or presence of notes. It's not like a shelving EQ which reduces quantity without changing its texture or quality. The decrease in hash comes from the improved antialiasing filter (HQ Apodizing) which has full attenuation before the Nyquist frequency. Thus, there's no aliasing to contribute to the "hash" in the upper treble. For me, this improvement is most obvious with hi-hats and cymbals. On many DACs, including the FiiO K9 Pro I used for comparison (since I don't have the Erco gen 1 for direct comparison), there's a slight smearing of hi-hat hits on either side of the transient, so instead of a clean transient like "TSH" it sounds more like "sTSHss"; there's this slight sizzle before and after the hit. This gives the hi-hats a "shimmering" character which can sound softer or sifted (think of sifting sugar or salt and that soft "shshshsh" sound it makes), but it also smears the sound. The Erco 2 does not do that. Cymbals and hi-hats are crisp and clear in attack and decay. Because there's no extra shimmer, the upper treble sounds less busy, so other parts of the sound seem easier to hear at the same time, but the treble is no less detailed and it is often easier to separate different notes from each other.

This is really helpful for the EDM that I enjoy because there's often a layer of noise in the track that adds energy to the sound and the Erco 2 lets the noise add the energy without letting it pollute the rest of the track. Songs I used for this were "Worst Day" by Illenium and MAX, "Love Is A Highway" by Nurko and NERIAH, and "Rest of My Life" by Culture Code and Medyk. All of these tracks have that layer of white-ish noise during the drop alongside synths, hi-hats, electronic snares, and more, and the cleaner treble on the Erco 2 allows elements of the music to remain crisp and clear during the busy portions. In particular, the soft background vocal echoes in the drop of "Love Is A Highway" are distinct on the Erco 2 vs other DACs where they're harder to hear. The cleaner treble also improves mids and bass (or more accurately, notes/instruments that lean on those frequency bands) because better treble cleans up the transients for those notes. So it seems like mids and bass are more prominent, but they aren't boosted, they're just cleaner and unimpeded by treble hash and smeared transients.

This reduction in treble hash is something that you can get with apodizing filters in HQPlayer. I experimented with HQPlayer for a bit prior to getting the Erco Gen 2 and I heard there a reduction in hash and a perceived increase in bass prominence as well as better perceived detail. Since the Erco 2's (and Wandla's) HQ Apodizing filter was developed by the guy who makes HQPlayer, it makes sense that this filter does similar things.

The more precise imaging is also related to that absence of haze and smearing. This time, it's like the lack of smear in the spatial rendering of a note. Think of looking at a light through frosted glass; the glass will diffuse the light around it and the edges becomes hazy while the light source appears larger than it is. If you look at the light without the glass, the edges of the light source are better defined. The increased spatial definition makes it easier for me to "lock on" to sounds, so it increases the perception of detail. Now, if I were to A/B compare vs another DAC, I can hear all of those same details, but on the other DAC, the sound isn't as well defined in space, more like a blob of sound, so it is harder for me to lock on to it unless I already knew it was there.

Fortunately, the Erco 2 retains the punchy and dynamic sound of the original Erco. The slight emphasis to the leading edges of notes makes music "pop", like each pluck of a string or smack of a drum stick is momentarily highlighted vs the trailing decay. I found this quality to be very engaging on the original Erco and I'm glad to see that the Gen 2 refinements haven't removed this aspect of the sound. I suppose it's not as punch-emphasized as the Gen 1, but mainly because you can hear better texture in bass due to the cleanup of the treble, so that improved texture competes with the punch for your attention. The punch didn't get worse, everything else just got better.

Listening to the X9000 with the Erco 2 was probably the best I've heard the X9000 at home. I did not really enjoy the X9000 with the original Erco; the original was too forward and when combined with the midrange emphasis of the X9000 it sounded like the mouths of vocalists were stretched out between my eyeballs - they were rendered too wide and too forward for my tastes. And that resulted in "soundstage collapse" where it sounded like the music had no frontal depth, just a flat sheet between my ears. Even though the K9 Pro was less dynamic, I often preferred the X9000 on that DAC since it wasn't so forward that the soundstage collapsed. The more precise imaging of the Erco 2 fixes that problem. The midrange is still pretty forward on the X9000, but vocalists are now better defined in space - not as wide - and I can get the spatial layering that I heard when I demoed the X9000 on the Chord Hugo TT2. The difference in treble quality from the Erco 2 was also easily apparent on the X9000.

Anyways, I like the Erco Gen 2; I think it's a noticeable and real upgrade (rather than just a different flavor) from the Gen 1. I can't wait to listen more.
Very nice impressions! Interesting you mentioned the treble "hash" - It's something I especially notice with Focal Utopia or Stellia (less so with LCD-5). This slightly grainy, dry effect in the upper mids and treble. It's smooth, but with a weird grainy texture that shouldn't be there. Glad Erco 2 fixes that.

I personally use Hypsos with Erco (and Ferrum Link cable, which is essential). I found Erco very disappointing without the Power Link. But I haven't tried other cables. I also use it as both amp + DAC.
 
Apr 22, 2024 at 2:24 PM Post #119 of 120
Very nice impressions! Interesting you mentioned the treble "hash" - It's something I especially notice with Focal Utopia or Stellia (less so with LCD-5). This slightly grainy, dry effect in the upper mids and treble. It's smooth, but with a weird grainy texture that shouldn't be there. Glad Erco 2 fixes that.

I personally use Hypsos with Erco (and Ferrum Link cable, which is essential). I found Erco very disappointing without the Power Link. But I haven't tried other cables. I also use it as both amp + DAC.
I don't think the Erco 2 will fix all hashiness. Some hashiness comes with the headphone's tuning. In particular, my experience is that Harman-tuned upper mids and treble result in a hashy sound regardless of DAC or amp. The Erco 2 will only remove any hash that comes from the upper treble. So you'd hear the hash or graininess that comes from either the source material or your headphone's tuning, and not from aliasing/pre-ringing effects in the upper treble.

Maybe I should have used "shimmer" instead of "hash" regarding the upper treble noise that the Erco 2 cleans up, but going from the Erco 2 to another DAC sounds like a layer of "hash" like "sshsshssh" has been added to the sound whenever there's significant content in the upper treble.

I'll need to reevaluate the Hypsos. When I first demoed the Erco, my dealer gave me the Erco, Hypsos, and the Shunyata Venom NR power cable (cheaper than the Delta and the Hypsos by a significant margin). I couldn't tell any difference between the stock PSU/cable and the Hypsos, but I noticed a slight improvement in bass punch and impact with the Venom. And when I put the stock cable back, I noticed the punch was missing while I didn't miss anything about the Hypsos when I swapped from it back to stock. When the dealer offered me a discount on the Delta, I went for it and still saved money vs the Hypsos. More recently, the dealer insisted that I try out the Hypsos again, so I went and played around with the voltage settings when feeding a Gen 1 Erco at the store. I think the voltage settings made a small, but noticeable difference in how sharp transients were, with lower voltage being slightly softer and higher voltage being slightly sharper. Similar to what the Shunyata cables did with the stock PSU. Not convinced yet, but I'm willing to try it out again, especially with the Gen 2 upgrade.

I've found that the qualities of the Erco are apparent on both the headphone outputs and the line outputs. Plus the Gen 2 upgrade did not affect the headphone amp portion of the unit. Perhaps the Hypsos makes more of a difference when driving the amp due to the variable load, but most of my normal headphones don't require much power. The Aeon 2 Noire is the most power-hungry of my normal headphones, but I don't really like that one anyways and I still didn't notice a difference with the Hypsos. And the Noire was where I noticed the improvement from the Shunyata. I'll try it with the Gen 2 to see if I like it more now.
 
Apr 22, 2024 at 10:05 PM Post #120 of 120
Was listening to the Erco 2 with the Sony MDR-Z1R. The Z1R also wasn't the best on the Erco 1, at least with the Shunyata cable. I liked the Erco well enough with the Z1R, but once I added the cable, the treble peak in the Z1R became unbearable. For example, on Adele's "Rolling in the Deep", the sibilants in the vocals were piercing. On the Erco 2 with Shunyata cable, they are not piercing - they're still sharp due to the Z1R's 10K peak, but not piercing and zingy like they were before. I recall that the Z1R has a whole bunch of resonances and the cleaner treble output of the Erco 2 means those resonances aren't excited as much. In fact, I'd consider the Erco 2 + cable to be slightly less piercing than the K9 Pro which is impressive considering its added dynamics (which generally exacerbate sharpness in the treble). The increased punch of the Erco 2 is immediately apparent when the drums come in on "Rolling in the Deep" at 0:23; there's more impact and drive to the beat. And the background claps at 2:31 have more definition on the Erco 2; the K9 Pro renders them as this two-beat note (a bit like "ch-k") while the Erco 2 renders them more like a rolling note with more intermediate sounds ("ch-rr-k").

This is a funny case because the K9 Pro makes them sound crisper but here - unlike with hi-hats - the crisper rendering gives the sense of less definition rather than more. I suppose the Erco 2's rendering of the claps is more realistic to me; most clapping won't have every part of the hand make contact at the exact same time, like when I clap naturally, my pinky and ring fingers make contact before my index fingers, and before my palms, so there's this natural rolling sound with the clap, and the Erco 2's dynamics make each clap stand out more and each individual contact sound in that clap more pronounced.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top