[joseph69]

It's my very amateur understanding that XLR are only optimal if you require to run long cables. I think XLR preserves the signal better over longer distances. Or something. But that's like something I read one time ages ago, and it might not be right.

You might want to ask someone else, basically I find it hard to believe there would be a meaningful difference however.

Thank you again. Yes--that is the main reason for using XLR, and as I've mentioned--my DAC is 12" away from my amplifier--both which benefit from XLR input. It's not a question of which interconnect to use--but rather which type of input will benefit the amplifier. The Envy is not fully balanced from end to end--the XLR output is there for convenience--so I'm trying to find out if the Envy does some type of conversion before the output stage if using XLR--because if this is the case, I believe (again) that if RCA did not do any conversion, but rather a straight path, then I could understand RCA being the better choice. As your said: "I find it hard to believe there would be a meaningful difference however." I also believe this--but would like to know for sure.

Thank you again

 

[tameral]

Looking to roll some different driver tubes.
Any Envy owners experienced with these driver tubes paired with WE300b, Elrog 300b, or Electro Harmonix 300b?

I'm currently using Brimar CV1988 and are great. Looking for something a bit different. Brimars seem to me to be very punchy and dynamic with big bass. Stock PSvane drivers sounded reedy in comparison.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/226077862300 (Sylvania 6SN7GT VT-231) £200

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/226082881762 (Ken-Rad 6SN7GT VT-231 Black Glass) £250

Ken-rads can pair well with a lot of different headphones I'm sure - but less so Susvara (sort of decent with ER300b). Sylvania Vt-231 is not my cup of tea and always found them detailed but thin and lacking dynamics.

Thanks for your response. Have you ever tried XLR?
I'm asking this question for a specific reason--which is that I was told that the Envy does not perform its best with XLR inputs because it's a single ended amplifier and benefits from the RCA inputs. I personally don't believe there would be any performance issue--I'm limited to my education on amplifier topology to just "believe" it won't make a difference. I'd really appreciate hearing from those who understand the Envy's topology more than I do to chime in and explain if and why there would be a difference.

I have no idea if this is true or not which is why I've asking again--but it seems no one can shed any light on this, or confirm this--or has tried both, XLR and RCA and found any difference in the Envy's performance. I've also sent Feliks Audio an email regarding this with no response.
Also--I'd need to purchase RCA interconnects because I only have XLR in my system and I'd like to make the purchase if this is the case before my Envy arrives which may be any day now--otherwise I don't want to waste my money being I would need 12" of cables from my DAC to the Envy.

Thank you

Whatever your DAC puts out best is what I would use. Many DACs sound better from the XLR outs. Envy has some really fancy components to handle the balanced conversion - you can read about it in various reviews - that's not a bottleneck whatsoever - focus on which output you prefer.

 

[joseph69]

Ken-rads can pair well with a lot of different headphones I'm sure - but less so Susvara (sort of decent with ER300b). Sylvania Vt-231 is not my cup of tea and always found them detailed but thin and lacking dynamics.



Whatever your DAC puts out best is what I would use. Many DACs sound better from the XLR outs. Envy has some really fancy components to handle the balanced conversion - you can read about it in various reviews - that's not a bottleneck whatsoever - focus on which output you prefer.

Thank you for your response.
I'm using the Spring3 KTE and I've always used XLR out to my GS-Xmk2 and WA33--otherwise using RCA I'd only be using 1/2 of the GS-Xmk2.

 

[DeeT79]

I've tried both XLR and RCA and both sound identical. There was no loss of performance or sound degradation whatsoever. I don't know if there is any conversion being done internally when using XLR cables. If there is, it is not noticeable. I've tried both from a DAC and I now have XLRs connected to a DAC and RCA connected to a phono preamp for my TT and there is no sound quality or performance difference. If you need to use XLR cables due to longer distance from your DAC, I recommend you do so. You could always buy some RCA cables to do the comparison yourself and return the cables if you also don't notice a difference.

 

[joseph69]

I've tried both XLR and RCA and both sound identical. There was no loss of performance or sound degradation whatsoever. I don't know if there is any conversion being done internally when using XLR cables. If there is, it is not noticeable. I've tried both from a DAC and I now have XLRs connected to a DAC and RCA connected to a phono preamp for my TT and there is no sound quality or performance difference. If you need to use XLR cables due to longer distance from your DAC, I recommend you do so. You could always buy some RCA cables to do the comparison yourself and return the cables if you also don't notice a difference.

Thank you very much for your response.
I appreciate you sharing your experience with both inputs and finding no noticeable or ill effect on the sound quality of the Envy.
What I didn't want to do is buy a different cable from my XLR cables--I would only buy the same 12' RCA cables to do a correct comparison and nothing else--and a 12' run of the same cable wold cost me ~$1K. If it was a must, that would've been a different story and I wouldn't hesitate to do so. I really don't know why I was told the Envy doesn't perform correctly with XLR inputs due to it single ended topology, and I must say I'm shocked with this statement due to whom it came from.

Thank you again.

 

[tameral]

Thank you very much for your response.
I appreciate you sharing your experience with both inputs and finding no noticeable or ill effect on the sound quality of the Envy.
What I didn't want to do is buy a different cable from my XLR cables--I would only buy the same 12' RCA cables to do a correct comparison and nothing else--and a 12' run of the same cable wold cost me ~$1K. If it was a must, that would've been a different story and I wouldn't hesitate to do so. I really don't know why I was told the Envy doesn't perform correctly with XLR inputs due to it single ended topology, and I must say I'm shocked with this statement due to whom it came from.

Thank you again.

XLR is generally the way to go as many DACs were optimized for their balanced output - few DACs are SE anymore but sure an SE Wavedream would be great

Lundahl balanced input transformers on Envy:

https://www.headfonia.com/feliks-audio-envy-review/

https://www.stereophile.com/content/gramophone-dreams-81-feliks-envy-headphone-amplifier

 

[joseph69]

XLR is generally the way to go as many DACs were optimized for their balanced output - few DACs are SE anymore but sure an SE Wavedream would be great

Lundahl balanced input transformers on Envy:

https://www.headfonia.com/feliks-audio-envy-review/

https://www.stereophile.com/content/gramophone-dreams-81-feliks-envy-headphone-amplifier

Thank you very much for your response as well, I appreciate it--as well as the links provided

 

[joseph69]

XLR is generally the way to go as many DACs were optimized for their balanced output - few DACs are SE anymore but sure an SE Wavedream would be great

Lundahl balanced input transformers on Envy:

https://www.headfonia.com/feliks-audio-envy-review/

https://www.stereophile.com/content/gramophone-dreams-81-feliks-envy-headphone-amplifier

I've been using XLR since early 2017 which is when I received my original Spring KTE and GS-Xmk2, both which benefit from XLR output/inout.

 

[JTbbb]

I've tried both XLR and RCA and both sound identical. There was no loss of performance or sound degradation whatsoever. I don't know if there is any conversion being done internally when using XLR cables. If there is, it is not noticeable. I've tried both from a DAC and I now have XLRs connected to a DAC and RCA connected to a phono preamp for my TT and there is no sound quality or performance difference. If you need to use XLR cables due to longer distance from your DAC, I recommend you do so. You could always buy some RCA cables to do the comparison yourself and return the cables if you also don't notice a difference.

I’ve used both to, and concur.

 

[JTbbb]

Looking to roll some different driver tubes.
Any Envy owners experienced with these driver tubes paired with WE300b, Elrog 300b, or Electro Harmonix 300b?

I'm currently using Brimar CV1988 and are great. Looking for something a bit different. Brimars seem to me to be very punchy and dynamic with big bass. Stock PSvane drivers sounded reedy in comparison.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/226077862300 (Sylvania 6SN7GT VT-231) £200

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/226082881762 (Ken-Rad 6SN7GT VT-231 Black Glass) £250

Sylvania 6sn7w black base go nice with WE.

 

[walterboss]

Sylvania 6sn7w black base go nice with WE.

Any comparison to Brimar CV1988?

 

[tameral]

Everyone has different ears and I had a nice pair of Brimars from the 50s - military, from the right plant and everything - and wasn't that impressed or at least with my set up it lacked synergy - these had halo getters. I've gathered that the D getters may indicate something superior - a better production series or something magical going on and that those are the ones to really look for. I've owned Sylvania 6sn7w, Sylvania 6sn7 VT-231, Sylvania 6sn7gt, Brimar CV1988, RCA VT-231, Ken Rad VT 231, Tung Sol BGRP, Melz 1578, RCA 5692 and maybe a few others I can't recall - the two that stood heads and tails above the rest are the Tung Sol BGRP and the Melz 1578. I still own Ken Rad and RCA VT 231 too along I think the Ken Rads fall behind the rest but they are holographic and fairly neutral with decent bass.

 

[jlbrach]

Susvara on Envy with WE and especially Elrogs with good powerconditioner (or just good power if you are lucky) has very high levels of midbass and beautiful sub. It slams.

As a tip for those who are considering Caldera with Envy. To be honest, Caldera doesnt scale very well or sound much different from Envy with May than from a good r2r / tube dap.

If you want a fast detailed punchy ZMF - Verite Open might be a much better option. It scalaes incredibly well with Envy, has dynamic driver analog timbre (unlike Caldera) and comes with very similar tuning with more expansive stage. To me it sounds more resolving and natural of Envy than Caldera (while Caldera will outperform it with simpler amplification). Considering you can have Verite Open sub 1.5k nowdays, its a no brainer imho.

I disagree, I used my recent addition caldera with my chord dave and liked it but like it a lot more with my envy in fact on the envy it has become one of my favorites HP's

 

[JTbbb]

Any comparison to Brimar CV1988?

Am not too good with descriptions. I also have the CV1988 and would say the 6sn7W has more clarity, which to my ears goes well with the WE’s.

 

[JTbbb]

Everyone has different ears and I had a nice pair of Brimars from the 50s - military, from the right plant and everything - and wasn't that impressed or at least with my set up it lacked synergy - these had halo getters. I've gathered that the D getters may indicate something superior - a better production series or something magical going on and that those are the ones to really look for. I've owned Sylvania 6sn7w, Sylvania 6sn7 VT-231, Sylvania 6sn7gt, Brimar CV1988, RCA VT-231, Ken Rad VT 231, Tung Sol BGRP, Melz 1578, RCA 5692 and maybe a few others I can't recall - the two that stood heads and tails above the rest are the Tung Sol BGRP and the Melz 1578. I still own Ken Rad and RCA VT 231 too along I think the Ken Rads fall behind the rest but they are holographic and fairly neutral with decent bass.

I would agree with this, and didn’t mention them as they are expensive.