Feliks Audio Echo (new budget OTL amp)

[rgrcliffe]

It is hard to comment on this since I bought it without tubes and bought separately what I needed. Anyway, I have in my collection a pair of Svetlana 6H13C which, as far as I know, are provided as stock output tubes and I consider them decent, at let's say 6/10 but other power tubes like for example Tung Sol 5998, Bendix 6080WB or GEC 6AS7G are around 9/10 (of course, every assessment is subjective, a matter of taste, of synergy with the rest of the line and headphones and so on, take it with a grain of salt). For the drivers I have no idea, I do not own a pair of those.

Thank you very much for your reply. I can see now why there might be a reason to have an Elise/Euphoria to have further options for experimentation. The Echo is the first tube amp I have owned, and I have been so impressed with it, that it is exciting yet bewildering to contemplate how it might be improved. I think I need to learn a lot more!

 

[Halam]

Thank you very much for this information. I will have a look at the Schiit Lyr thread as you suggested. It sounds an interesting first path for me to try. Presumably, there is no risk of damaging the amplifier using this family of tubes through an adaptor?

5670 and 12**7 family tubes with adapters are compatible with 6922 family (they all have 6.3 volts on heater) . Guys from Schiit Lyr recommend adapters (as well as socket savers) from Tubemonger as better quality adapters then chinese. And some folks swear that 5670 easily beat 6922, and 12**7 even better. Well this Shiit Lyr thread is inexhaustible source of tube rolling options, and i would like to try one of those 12**7 variants now, bearing in mind they are cheaper then 6922.

 

[Halam]

Thank you very much for your reply. I can see now why there might be a reason to have an Elise/Euphoria to have further options for experimentation. The Echo is the first tube amp I have owned, and I have been so impressed with it, that it is exciting yet bewildering to contemplate how it might be improved. I think I need to learn a lot more!

Echo is also my first OTL amp i bought for my 300 Ohms ZMF Atticus, and it easily beaten my Cavally Liquid Carbon. I think Echo is one of the best price/performance OTL amps, and choice of OTL is not big. And I also tempting to try some better amp, but can easily live with Echo

 

[OctavianH]

This is the same I see it: Echo seems to be a very decent OTL for an entry level budget. Of course, if you want more you can go up the ladder but you need to be warned that not only the price of the amplifier has to be taken into consideration, but also the higher price of the tubes for that amplifier.

 

[rgrcliffe]

Echo is also my first OTL amp i bought for my 300 Ohms ZMF Atticus, and it easily beaten my Cavally Liquid Carbon. I think Echo is one of the best price/performance OTL amps, and choice of OTL is not big. And I also tempting to try some better amp, but can easily live with Echo

I originally bought the Echo to pair with my old Sennheiser HD600 headphones. I then bought a pair of 600 Ohms Beyerdynamic T1.2 phones. I have really enjoyed listening to music with both these headphones with the Echo.

I also have the Beyerdynamic A20 amp. Comparing the Echo to the A20, listening with the T1.2, I much prefer the tube amp. The A20 is not bad, but the Echo is so much better to my ears.

 

[rgrcliffe]

5670 and 12**7 family tubes with adapters are compatible with 6922 family (they all have 6.3 volts on heater) . Guys from Schiit Lyr recommend adapters (as well as socket savers) from Tubemonger as better quality adapters then chinese. And some folks swear that 5670 easily beat 6922, and 12**7 even better. Well this Shiit Lyr thread is inexhaustible source of tube rolling options, and i would like to try one of those 12**7 variants now, bearing in mind they are cheaper then 6922.

Thank you for confirming this. I will certainly follow this up.

 

[OctavianH]

I also have the Beyerdynamic A20 amp. Comparing the Echo to the A20, listening with the T1.2, I much prefer the tube amp. The A20 is not bad, but the Echo is so much better to my ears.

I have also the T1 second gen and it cannot be compared on tubes with any solid state amplifier. I tried them with A2 and also the TT2 and you cannot match a tube amp

 

[rgrcliffe]

This is the same I see it: Echo seems to be a very decent OTL for an entry level budget. Of course, if you want more you can go up the ladder but you need to be warned that not only the price of the amplifier has to be taken into consideration, but also the higher price of the tubes for that amplifier.

I take your point. These things can get very expensive!

 

[rgrcliffe]

I have also the T1 second gen and it cannot be compared on tubes with any solid state amplifier. I tried them with A2 and also the TT2 and you cannot match a tube amp

Interesting. Thank you.

 

[Halam]

I take your point. These things can get very expensive!

There is one very interesting option for upgrade in OTL amp territory and to not rob a bank. It's Glenn OTL, some head-fiers say this is a killer amp for adequate money, but it can be tricky to get one.

 

[1slyB]

Hmmm, bought the Echo about a month ago and love it so far. Having to use as a preamp into my SMSL SP200 just so I can use my XLR cable as my single ended is terrible and ruins the experience till my new cable comes in. Thinking about rolling tube but I like the sound atm and don't know better so leaving it haha. I was going to buy a SS amp being a V281 but the sale fell through so considering a second Feliks Audio amp.

So was going to move the Echo to the PC and get either a Elise or Euforia, which would you guys recommend to complement the Echo. I was thinking the Elise as it seems more popular in the community?

 

[Dailydrive]

Newbie here to this forum and only my 2nd post after self intro

Come to this thread out of curiosity if Echo can be used as part of my Stax setup, having recently outbid & missed out of a SRM-600, which is a Stax energiser with ECC99 tubes.

So was wondering if OTL Echo (with its RCA output) be substitute for tube-warm sound on my Stax instead of exploring a very expensive tube route of BHSE amp for Stax ear speaker

i.e.
Tidal master (source) - >
Audio-gd NFB-11.38 (DAC) - >
FA Echo (still Exploring, via RCA In&Out)
- > Airbow SRM-222P (Stax driver) - >
SR-SC1 (earspeaker)

Many many thanks in advance for your advise. At work currently, so may only visit this thread again after 9pm.

 

[qboogie]

I've been doing some research about tube rolling. I like the stock tubes just fine: they are abundant in warmth, bass texture (which I love) and spaciousness. This is my first tube amp and I bought it to try with the ZMF Verite open, since so many VO owners swear by OTLs with them. I have been looking for a tube that improves the clarity in the vocal midrange. Compared to the M-scaled Hugo TT2, which conveys such a sharpened, vivid image that I can practically see the singer's mouth as they form the words, the stock Echo tubes present this mid-range in a sort of "blocky" wall of sound, without much vocal texturing, however I do like that the stock Echo presents more up-front vocals, which IMO corrects the VO's sole flaw of slightly recessed upper midrange.

I spoke with another head-fier who recommended a few tubes:

1. Siemens 7308: The user commented "those selections will have a richer and fuller bottom half compared to the stock tubes." On Upscaleaudio, a reviewer said this about the Siemens 7308: "Unlike most 7308 tubes that usually have a somewhat relaxed top end, this tube has a clean top end that maintains extension without being bright, neutral mids, and wonderful tight bass." $48- 58 each, depending on grade, from upscaleaudio's site

2. Gold Lions 6922 "If you enjoy your stock Echo tube sound, then you could try going for Gold Lions 6922 for a similar sound signature, but with more holographic imaging." I am not sure if this means tonal balance is the same but better clarity, or just better instrument separation. These go for $50-60 each on Upscaleaudio. I did purchase a pair and will report back with impressions.

3. Mullard 6922: Reviews often mentioned a rich, liquid midrange, which were typical to this British-made tube.The description on Upscaleaudio is they "Will give you that famous, liquid smooth Mullard midrange, with a smidge more energy on top. Great tube if your system is a little relaxed, as they will give you more sparkle in the highs." Not really the solution to the clarity issue I am having.

The Echo manual states “Stock preamp tubes are 6922….Tubes can be changed by the user, to the following: Driver tubes: E88CC, 6N23P, 6DJ8, 6922." I also asked a rep at upscale if the stock 6N1P tube can be swapped out for the above tubes, and he confirmed yes.

My gear stream is
Hugo M Scaler -> Snake River Boomslang BNC -> Hugo TT2 on filter 1 -> Forza Clair interconnects -> Feliks Echo -> Norne Silvergarde S3 -> ZMF Verite Open

 

[JM1979]

I've been doing some research about tube rolling. I like the stock tubes just fine: they are abundant in warmth, bass texture (which I love) and spaciousness. This is my first tube amp and I bought it to try with the ZMF Verite open, since so many VO owners swear by OTLs with them. I have been looking for a tube that improves the clarity in the vocal midrange. Compared to the M-scaled Hugo TT2, which conveys such a sharpened, vivid image that I can practically see the singer's mouth as they form the words, the stock Echo tubes present this mid-range in a sort of "blocky" wall of sound, without much vocal texturing, however I do like that the stock Echo presents more up-front vocals, which IMO corrects the VO's sole flaw of slightly recessed upper midrange.

I spoke with another head-fier who recommended a few tubes:

1. Siemens 7308: The user commented "those selections will have a richer and fuller bottom half compared to the stock tubes." On Upscaleaudio, a reviewer said this about the Siemens 7308: "Unlike most 7308 tubes that usually have a somewhat relaxed top end, this tube has a clean top end that maintains extension without being bright, neutral mids, and wonderful tight bass." $48- 58 each, depending on grade, from upscaleaudio's site

2. Gold Lions 6922 "If you enjoy your stock Echo tube sound, then you could try going for Gold Lions 6922 for a similar sound signature, but with more holographic imaging." I am not sure if this means tonal balance is the same but better clarity, or just better instrument separation. These go for $50-60 each on Upscaleaudio. I did purchase a pair and will report back with impressions.

3. Mullard 6922: Reviews often mentioned a rich, liquid midrange, which were typical to this British-made tube.The description on Upscaleaudio is they "Will give you that famous, liquid smooth Mullard midrange, with a smidge more energy on top. Great tube if your system is a little relaxed, as they will give you more sparkle in the highs." Not really the solution to the clarity issue I am having.

The Echo manual states “Stock preamp tubes are 6922….Tubes can be changed by the user, to the following: Driver tubes: E88CC, 6N23P, 6DJ8, 6922." I also asked a rep at upscale if the stock 6N1P tube can be swapped out for the above tubes, and he confirmed yes.

My gear stream is
Hugo M Scaler -> Snake River Boomslang BNC -> Hugo TT2 on filter 1 -> Forza Clair interconnects -> Feliks Echo -> Norne Silvergarde S3 -> ZMF Verite Open

So I thought I was the only person on the planet with a MScaler, TT2 and Echo, I guess not.

It’s a fantastic chain with some nice ability to tweak given the TT2 filters and tubes.

They are expensive but I love the Amperex USA 7308s that I have. I feel like they also add a nice holographic element to the music. I use those and some gold plate Russian tubes and absolutely love it. I wouldn’t change a thing.

I got the Amperex from this site if you’re interested.http://www.vacuumtubes.com/6dj8.html

 

[qboogie]

So I thought I was the only person on the planet with a MScaler, TT2 and Echo, I guess not.

It’s a fantastic chain with some nice ability to tweak given the TT2 filters and tubes.

They are expensive but I love the Amperex USA 7308s that I have. I feel like they also add a nice holographic element to the music. I use those and some gold plate Russian tubes and absolutely love it. I wouldn’t change a thing.

I got the Amperex from this site if you’re interested.http://www.vacuumtubes.com/6dj8.html

I am reading more about those amperex 7308s, and have my eye out for the early US 1960s vintage, white-lettering. There are so many slight variants that it's a little confusing. Add to that the possibility of Chinese counterfeit versions. Can you share a photo of yours?