[StanD]

  Can you even measure things like sound separation?

You must mean channel separation, It's called crosstalk, no problem, one could have done that decades ago.

 

[tomb]

  Can you even measure things like sound separation?

Well, yes.  Channel separation is one of the oldest specs used for audio equipment.  It was really important in turntable cartridges and FM tuners because the signals were so close to each other (in a manner of speaking).  Digitally, this is usually a slam-dunk, but remember - everything has to be analog in order to get to our ear.  So, channel separation is still a very valid spec.
 
EDIT: I see Stan and I are on the same page with this one, although crosstalk is a tiny bit different.

 

[coinmaster]

Well I was referring to instrument separation and "space".

 

[tomb]

  Well I was referring to instrument separation and "space".

Those are usually considered two different things around here.  Instrument separation can indeed be thought of as channel separation (in reverse, crosstalk).  However, "space" is usually discussed as "soundstage."

 

[money4me247]

  There's also the possibility that perhaps only high level equipment can hear the differences. I notice quite a lot of people say a lot of stuff against "snake oil" subjects when their profile suggests they own low-mid-fi gear that probably wouldn't hear it anyway.
 
I wouldn't expect an HD650 to hear the difference between a $600 dac and a $2000 dac for example. Especially without a good amp. But a HD800 might.

i have some high end headphones & I still think the differences between dacs are marginal. though I do not own any uber luxury dacs, i have demoed dacs up to the $2k price point. ...and concluded that i don't need to waste the money hahah.
 
ymmv of course

 

[coinmaster]

  i have some high end gear & I still think the differences between dacs are marginal. though I do not own any uber luxury dacs, i have demoed dacs up to the $2k price point. ...and concluded that i don't need to waste the money hahah.
 
ymmv of course

Marginal means there's still a difference!!

 

[money4me247]

Marginal means there's still a difference!!

marginal enough that it can be do to placebo effect
 
hard to say either way a lot of times. esp after you do a lot of blind abx comparisons.

 

[coinmaster]

  marginal enough that it can be do to placebo effect
 
hard to say either way a lot of times. esp after you do a lot of blind abx comparisons.

Aww

 

[tomb]

 

Marginal means there's still a difference!!

marginal enough that it can be do to placebo effect
 
hard to say either way a lot of times. esp after you do a lot of blind abx comparisons.

I can see why you are confused if you've been doing blind abx comparisons.

http://www.head-fi.org/t/759098/exspensive-dac-vs-cheap-dac/15#post_11414612

 

[Shaffer]

I've had DACs in my system ranging from ~$9,000 to $69. Some sounded similar, some didn't. I never felt any of them offered a degree of improvement that matched by analog setup, so I used a decent CDP to play recordings that weren't available on LP. Not that it was used that much. All that changed when I heard, and subsequently bought, an Oppo105. Prior to that, if anyone were to assert a similar notion regarding the 105, I would not have believed them based on prior experience. YMMV

 

[StanD]

Just keep in mind that us "Meat Popsicles" are the weak link both perceptually as well as by suggestion. If anyone believes that they can hear anywhere as good as lab equipment, well I have some choice swampland to sell them. I'd say there are many highwaymen that will be glad to take your money.

 

[Shaffer]

Just keep in mind that us "Meat Popsicles" are the weak link both perceptually as well as by suggestion. If anyone believes that they can hear anywhere as good as lab equipment, well I have some choice swampland to sell them. I'd say there are many highwaymen that will be glad to take your money.

What kind of music does lab equipment prefer?

 

[StanD]

What kind of music does lab equipment prefer?

Can we hear .01% THD or .01% IMD? Us humans can't even get close to that, Can we hear an FR difference of 0.1 dB, no way. I'll bet that you aren't interested in that "choice swampland" that I mentioned. Then why go for the marketing hype, myths and expectation bias? If you insist upon it, I will not stop you from blowing a few grand on a DAC and another few grand on an amp. I'd put some money into a good set of cans.

 

[joseph69]

 

FWIW, I've just started comparing my Meridian/Rega DAC's (by listening/spending sufficient amount of time with both).
I've owned used my Meridian-203 since 1991 with my stereo system, which I've sold and since have been using the Meridian with my main Hp system for about 3-4 years now since getting into HP's. I purchased the Rega DAC about 6 months ago, but tried it for 1 night, then never tried it again until about 2 weeks ago. I can tell you that I can clearly hear the differences between both DAC's. In short...the Meridians mid-range is more forward with less sound-stage and instrument separation and is harder to hear the micro details but I still can hear everything nicely. The Rega on (filter # 1) which is the only filter I've experimented with so far has a less forward mid-range ( a bit recessed) with a bigger sound-stage and wider instrument separation, and is easier to hear the micro details with. Both are very different sounding too  me…for sure! [size=x-small]I am still listening to both DAC's[/size]…[size=x-small](currently the Meridians turn) each one for 1 week at a time with (ALAC Files) through my MBP>DAC>GS-1 listening to the Jazz group "Fourplay" which are recorded extremely well, with both my RS1i/PS1K's and hear the same differences that I described between the DAC's with both HP's. [/size]All I'm saying is that I definitely do hear the differences between the both DAC's…their sound differences are very apparent too me.

 

[StanD]

Good luck guys, I'm done for the night. Spend plenty of money, it's good for the economy.