[coinmaster]

Hi, I have a Little Dot MKVI+ which is said to sound as much as 3-4x as good as it's price suggest. Heralded as one of the best if not the best price/performance amps out there. I also have a pair of HD800s, one of the most revealing headphones.
So I'm trying to get a dac to match up to what is effectively a $2-4k "sounding" amp.
I've heard people say all dacs passed $200 sound the same, and I've heard others compare dacs against each other and explain the differences in their sound such as more separation. clarity, etc.
I would benefit in the short term from not having to buy an expensive dac but I do not want to cheap out if there is a difference.
 
Anyone with actual experience comparing dacs taking into account that they all have different output levels want to tell me their opinions?

 

[PurpleAngel]

  Hi, I have a Little Dot MKVI+ which is said to sound as much as 3-4x as good as it's price suggest. Heralded as one of the best if not the best price/performance amps out there. I also have a pair of HD800s, one of the most revealing headphones.
So I'm trying to get a dac to match up to what is effectively a $2-4k "sounding" amp.
I've heard people say all dacs passed $200 sound the same, and I've heard others compare dacs against each other and explain the differences in their sound such as more separation. clarity, etc.
I would benefit in the short term from not having to buy an expensive dac but I do not want to cheap out if there is a difference.
 
Anyone with actual experience comparing dacs taking into account that they all have different output levels want to tell me their opinions?

 
It might help to know what you are currently using as a DAC feature (on-board audio?)?
Did you have a budget range for a new DAC?

 

[money4me247]

  Hi, I have a Little Dot MKVI+ which is said to sound as much as 3-4x as good as it's price suggest. Heralded as one of the best if not the best price/performance amps out there. I also have a pair of HD800s, one of the most revealing headphones.
So I'm trying to get a dac to match up to what is effectively a $2-4k "sounding" amp.
I've heard people say all dacs passed $200 sound the same, and I've heard others compare dacs against each other and explain the differences in their sound such as more separation. clarity, etc.
I would benefit in the short term from not having to buy an expensive dac but I do not want to cheap out if there is a difference.
 
Anyone with actual experience comparing dacs taking into account that they all have different output levels want to tell me their opinions?

honestly all about the same in my experience hahah

 

[StanD]

IMO most folks claiming vast differences have overactive imaginations. Other than bad products, most are pretty close in sound. If you are looking for a big difference in sound, look at headphones.

 

[HPiper]

The main difference is from the actual dac chip used and beyond that the quality of the filters and to a very minor degree the analog stage components. Bottom line is you don't want to go too cheap, but within reason most dacs are going to sound pretty good. Main thing you need to ask yourself is do you want a more warm musical dac or a more analytical sounding unit.

 

[StanD]

  The main difference is from the actual dac chip used and beyond that the quality of the filters and to a very minor degree the analog stage components. Bottom line is you don't want to go too cheap, but within reason most dacs are going to sound pretty good. Main thing you need to ask yourself is do you want a more warm musical dac or a more analytical sounding unit.

One can take a great chip and ruin its performance in a bad design or PCB layout. IMO the musical vs. analytical story is more hype than reality. A bad implementation will stink a good one will sound good. A flat FR, low distortion and good transient response is all you need, all of this is easy to get.

 

[coinmaster]

So between Questyle CAS 192D ($2000) and Yulong D200 ($600) they should sound the same? I noticed the Questyle has a crapload of capacitors compared to the Yulong if that means anything.

 

[cel4145]

One can take a great chip and ruin its performance in a bad design or PCB layout. IMO the musical vs. analytical story is more hype than reality. A bad implementation will stink a good one will sound good. A flat FR, low distortion and good transient response is all you need, all of this is easy to get.

+1

Plus, subjective comparisons of DACs through sighted listening tests (instead of ABX) are so problematic. People tend to bring expectations to the experience that can influence whether they hear more or less difference, when the difference might be marginal.

So what are you connecting your Little Dot MKVI+ to now?

 

[coinmaster]

So what are you connecting your Little Dot MKVI+ to now?

An O2/Odac combo. It sounds truly bad

. loads of feedback and distortion, not to mention I'm amplifying an inferior source. I'm basically just burning in the stock tubes with it at the moment, replacing those soon though anyway.
 
To be honest, I was hoping someone would tell me there is a difference between dacs.
I'm afraid of buying a lower priced dac only to find out later that there is some truth to it all. For example, maybe it takes top end equipment and headphones to hear the difference.

 

[StanD]

+1

Plus, subjective comparisons of DACs through sighted listening tests (instead of ABX) are so problematic. People tend to bring expectations to the experience that can influence whether they hear more or less difference, when the difference might be marginal.

So what are you connecting your Little Dot MKVI+ to now?

I don't have a Little Dot MKVI+. 

 

[cel4145]

An O2/Odac combo. It sounds truly bad . loads of feedback and distortion, not to mention I'm amplifying an inferior source. I'm basically just burning in the stock tubes with it at the moment, replacing those soon though anyway.
To be honest, I was hoping someone would tell me there is a difference between dacs.
I'm afraid of buying a lower priced dac only to find out later that there is some truth to it all. For example, maybe it takes top end equipment and headphones to hear the difference.

You are amplifying the headphone output from the O2? I could see how that might not be a good combination.

 

[billybob_jcv]

I'm also in the camp that believes the differences in good quality DACs is vastly exaggerated. I suspect there's almost always one or more other possible sources of "improvement" from folks who wax poetic about the night & day differences between any two $100-$200 DACs. Expectation bias, differences in output levels, not using the same source material, etc, etc.

 

[coinmaster]

Yeah it sounds far better just listening directly from the o2 itself. through all the horribleness I can hear the increased sound stage, imaging and bass (yes, actual bass on the hd800!). It's clear the amp is greatly superior to the o2 except the the distortion and harshness among other things the o2/odac is causing is destroying the sound.
 
I'm still on the fence about dacs though. I'd hate to be paying for snake oil but I'm of the belief that if enough people hear the same thing, there must be some merit to it. I mean not everyone can dumb enough to let imagination influence their conclusions right? At least not in a review.
 
My personal experience extends between my expensive PC motherboard and the odac. The difference is clear there but I don't know what level of performance a motherboard dac is supposed to have. However a lot of people would claim everything down to an early 90s walkman dac is the same.

 

[cel4145]

Yeah it sounds far better just listening directly from the o2 itself. through all the horribleness I can hear the increased sound stage, imaging and bass (yes, actual bass on the hd800!). It's clear the amp is greatly superior to the o2 except the the distortion and harshness among other things the o2/odac is causing is destroying the sound.

Too bad you don't have the O2/ODAC desktop edition with the analog out for the ODAC that bypasses the O2.

 

[StanD]

  I'm still on the fence about dacs though. I'd hate to be paying for snake oil but I'm of the belief that if enough people hear the same thing, there must be some merit to it. I mean not everyone can dumb enough to let imagination influence their conclusions right? At least not in a review.
 

The chanting of a flash mob is overrated. Too many people are influenced and repeat the storyline. Most people expect to hear something due to this and thus hear things. Since audio memory lasts a few seconds how can one expect correct comparative reviews unless they are conducted properly and within seconds. Too many innocent people get sucked into the storyline.