[Evshrug]

"Game over man, Game OHver!"
"Well, maybe we can gather up the wreckage and make a fire?"

Vertical sound IS hard. Same thing happened to me many times in CoD4, I pop around the corner with guns blazing, only to see nobody on my floor and I get sniped because I revealed my position on radar. Premature shotgunation, but I thought the way you told your story was funnier. Once you get used to surround and start to rely on it, you get confusing moments and realize the limitations of 7.1 or 5.1 surround.

 

[SaLX]

Found a rather good blog here: http://thewelltemperedcomputer.com/index.html. Pity he's not updated it recently, but it's very informative. Allways like learning new things me

 

 

[Evshrug]

Lol, you posted right after I made an update to the virtual surround post!
Nice source of info, but there was so much stuff that I gravitated to reading the "for fun" stuff like using coat-hangers as interconnect wires and "magic pebbles." It is cool to see someone else making "guides," but what my ideal is that this thread would be different because I invite discussion about my posts (for extra info, corrections, or debates). I don't pretend to know everything, just want stuff to be shared, particularly things that took me a while to figure out.

 

[atoff]

Not sure if you're aware, but the PS4 had an update a few days ago that enabled 7.1 surround.  Sony has also released a new 7.1 headset for the PS4 http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-9020_7-57618236-222/ps4-software-update-adds-support-for-sonys-wireless-7.1-virtual-surround-headsets/.  
 
I'd prefer to stick with higher quality headphones and something like the DSS, but I'm still a bit curious how it sounds. 

 

[Evshrug]

Yeah, we were talking about this on Mad's thread.

The PS4 already supported 5.1 and 7.1 surround through HDMI, or through optical using compression by Dolby Digital Live (used by the DSS or Mixamp) or DTS connect. The PS4 already features AMD's TrueAudio discrete DSP, and I think (Sony's page is light on specs, but a few game magazines confirmed) that the console also has the ability to work with GenAudio's AstoundSound for games that have it encoded (first game to feature AstoundSound will be Thief, we'll see if the PS4 version includes headphone surround as well as the PC version).

I think the firmware update is just so the console can recognize the Sony headset's transmitter dongle. Thanks for bringing it up though! Looks like virtual surround is more widely recognized as a feature now!!

 

[Stillhart]

How do you like the SBX vs the THX?  I was thinking of upgrading my PC to a Z or Omni so I can use optical out to a DAC/Amp.  The Z is one of the cheaper options out there, but you can still get cheap X-Fi's with CMSS-3D as well.  Not sure if it's even worth agonizing over, as I assume Creative got over licensing THX and just ripped it off and changed the name (see Cinemark and IMAX).  They're probably suspiciously similar.
 
Side note:  know any good DAC/Amp combos in the $200 price range that have optical-in and work well with the Q701?

 

[MichaelJames99]

Do any of you use one of the following to watch movies with?
 
~~ ~~ Astro Mixamp Pro (2013 Edition)
~~Astro Mixamp Pro
~~Astro Mixamp 5.8
~~Beyerdynamic Headzone (Base only)
~~Creative Sound Blaster Recon3D USB ~
~Tritton AX 720 ~~Turtle Beach DSS (old version)
~~Victor SU-DH1 A
 
 
I plan on getting a PS4 here shortly to watch Blu Ray from and I am using the Optical out from my Direct TV Genie system to watch 1080p On demand movies.  My thought is to go from the source thnn out to DAC (optional)  and then out to 2-channel amp (my current is Musical Fidelity X-Can v2 headphone amp..its a tube amp) then out to Grado RS1 (my current Open headphones) I can;t decide on the 5.1 decoder to try out or perhaps another solution I have not thought of to get a virtualized 5.1 system

 

[Stillhart]

I had tried when I first got my Recon3D but I was unimpressed.  I think partially this is because the Q701's I was using aren't great for movies.  I think the other reason is that I wasn't testing any really good source material. I don't know what the refrence movies are for testing good surround these days; any suggestions?

 

[AxelCloris]

  I had tried when I first got my Recon3D but I was unimpressed.  I think partially this is because the Q701's I was using aren't great for movies.  I think the other reason is that I wasn't testing any really good source material. I don't know what the refrence movies are for testing good surround these days; any suggestions?

 
There's a clip that I love to use when testing movies. It's the same clip I used when I was selling home Hi-Fi and cinemas. There's a sequence in Transformers where the autobots are falling from space down to earth. Play it from a quality Blu Ray source and listen for the finest details. Specifically little things like debris settling, the light crackle of flames as the ground burns, and even the footsteps over broken glass of the people running. You can also use this test to see if the bass overpowers anything else as there is a lot of thumping impacts and heavy steps from the autobots. I tend to stop the clip after Optimus' transformation sequence on screen. And listen to the people yelling and shouting back and forth; that's a good test to see if you'll lose the vocals to louder musical scores or ambient sounds.
 
Note: This method isn't great for seeing how well headphones handle music playback. But it'll give you a great test for movies, television and sometimes gaming. These are almost 100% man made sound effects and are not true to music at all.

 

[Stillhart]

That's... really good detailed advice, thanks!  Unfortunately, I have this thing -- I loathe Michael Bay and Jerry Bruckheimer.  I can't bring myself to buy the Transformers movie, even to test the surround. 

  Maybe it's time to finally buy the Pacific Rim blu-ray.

 

[AxelCloris]

  That's... really good detailed advice, thanks!  Unfortunately, I have this thing -- I loathe Michael Bay and Jerry Bruckheimer.  I can't bring myself to buy the Transformers movie, even to test the surround. 

  Maybe it's time to finally buy the Pacific Rim blu-ray.

 
It's certainly not the end-all be-all in demonstrations, but it was one that could really show off a nice pair of Vienna Acoustics or Martin Logan speakers and prove why they're worth 5x the price of Klipsch towers (non-ICON series). Another great clip for demonstrations/testing is the drum dance from Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon. Pop in the disc, turn on your DSP, hit play, and close your eyes.Keep playing beyond the dance into the assassination attempt.

 

[Evshrug]

SBX was an easy transition from THX. They do sound slightly different, maybe SBX is technically better but that also could be an improvement in DAC for the Z which is the one I tested more extensively side-by-side. I'd be fine with either, though I like the Mac compatibility of the Omni so I went with that.

 

[Evshrug]

Micheal James,
I got my PS4 last night, and I'll be testing it out extensively tonight!

One thing I want to make sure you understand, using one of these processors will be the DAC in your audio chain... none of them just process virtual surround and then pass the digital signal along to a separate DAC. The tube amp you mention sounds like a good one

I have used the original DSS and Recon3D USB with movies, I also have a Mixamp 5.8 that I only recently acquired so I've only used that with gaming so far. I'm a little less picky about positioning with movies, it's nice but the DSS and Recon3D perform basically at equal quality.

That said, the Recon3D will let you tweak a few more sound characteristics. I actually really like a moderate amount of dialogue boost for movies, sometimes I bump up da bass , and when I'm tired I like smart volume to compress the range of volume to not be too loud or quiet, but around the same predictable volume... however in gaming I mostly just use dialogue boost and minimize other options that can decrease the soundstage effect.

The DSS has fewer tweak options, just a sub-bass boost. However, you don't have to plug it into a computer to "reprogram" it, just turn a dial on the side of the box. That bass boost is pretty good, it is "aimed" at lower bass frequencies that add atmosphere and just sounds nice, and for gaming you can actually slightly reduce bass by turning the dial all the way down. It may seem like a small thing but I love that it has an on/off switch.

The Mixamp 5.8 has the same Dolby Headphone processing as the DSS, but it also has the added compromise feature of wireless (no wires between TV and couch, but soft soft hiss added in the background).



-----
Pacific Rim from the iTunes Store on an AppleTV (with optical out) sounds amazing!!! Too many great audio moments to count off the top of my head. I also can't wait to rewatch Inception on my new rig.

 

[Stillhart]

   
It's certainly not the end-all be-all in demonstrations, but it was one that could really show off a nice pair of Vienna Acoustics or Martin Logan speakers and prove why they're worth 5x the price of Klipsch towers (non-ICON series). Another great clip for demonstrations/testing is the drum dance from Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon. Pop in the disc, turn on your DSP, hit play, and close your eyes.Keep playing beyond the dance into the assassination attempt.

 
I'm pretty sure I have that on DVD somewhere.  I'll have to dig it out, thanks!
 
I have a few great action flicks on Blu-Ray (Inception, Watchmen, Hell Boy 2, Dark Knight, Iron Man, etc) that should probably work well.  This should give me a good excuse to rewatch some.  :-D

 

[MichaelJames99]

EVshrug, thank you for giving me your opinion.  Its great to hear people using these for movies as well.
 
Is there going to be any difference for me in my specific setup between the processors below?  The Beyerdynamic seems on paper to be closest to a movie intended piece but is obnoxiously expensive.  My Grado RS-1 and amp combo sound great together but I am not experiencing a 3d surround/audio environment.
 
 Have you tried the Astro mixAmp Pro or 2013 editions with movies?
 
I actually have in my possession a Victor SU-DH1 with power supply.  I am waiting until tomorrow to get the adapter for the digital coax cable to try it out.  I got it probably 10 years ago and I remember a lot of hiss.
 
 
~~~~ ~~ Astro Mixamp Pro (2013 Edition)
~~Astro Mixamp Pro
~~Astro Mixamp 5.8
~~Beyerdynamic Headzone (Base only)
~~Creative Sound Blaster Recon3D USB ~
~Tritton AX 720 ~
~Turtle Beach DSS (old version) ~
~Victor SU-DH1 A
 
Just trying to decide which processor to go to.....  I am not opposed to gong to new headphones but wondering if it is worth it for movies.