[shinew]

I just received a pair of DT880 03 edition today. I've been listening to Mahler symphonies & Glenn Gould's Goldberg Variations. So far it's impression has been positive, neutral mids, extended & airy highs, and well balanced & deep bass, there is a possibility that the higher mids & lower highs are slightly exaggerated, but I'll have to do more lisetning & tests on it to be sure. Over all, it's a very positive first impression

 

[GreatDane]

I'll be holding on to mine. They are my first choice for classical. If I compare them to HD 650 the mids are lacking a bit but I can live with that...those airy highs more than make up for it.

 

[b0dhi]

You listen to Mahler symphonies & Glenn Gould's Goldberg Variations. The title is somewhat misleading

 

[shinew]

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreatDane /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'll be holding on to mine. They are my first choice for classical. If I compare them to HD 650 the mids are lacking a bit but I can live with that...those airy highs more than make up for it.

Have you tried EQ it? If you're OK with the idea of EQ i meant...
based on my memory, I didn't like hd650 that much, the hd600 was more neutral to me(had it for about 6months, then sold it, but I've reordered it and it should be coming in few days)

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0dhi You listen to Mahler symphonies & Glenn Gould's Goldberg Variations. The title is somewhat misleading

not at all. I'm into realistic bass from actual non-electric instrument. And that's something I know very well how they sound. Double bass goes down to 30hz or so & piano covers the complete audible spectrum. It's very easy for me to tell if the bass is lacking or exaggerated.

 

[MD1032]

Piano doesn't cover the complete audible spectrum. Organists know this.

 

[Rednamalas1]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MD1032 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Piano doesn't cover the complete audible spectrum. Organists know this.

Yup,
It's not very often that we need to hear bass below 40hz in acoustic music (someone correct me if I'm wrong) Electronica often uses extremely low bass that tests lower limits of our audible spectrum.

 

[b0dhi]

Quote:

Originally Posted by shinew /img/forum/go_quote.gif not at all. I'm into realistic bass from actual non-electric instrument. And that's something I know very well how they sound. Double bass goes down to 30hz or so & piano covers the complete audible spectrum. It's very easy for me to tell if the bass is lacking or exaggerated.

That's fine, but realistic, balanced bass for a bunch of other genres (trance, hip-hop, other bass-drum oriented music) is something else entirely, and I assume the people who your thread title is intended for (those who think the DT-880 doesn't have bass), would be listening to those types of genres mostly.

 

[shinew]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MD1032 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Piano doesn't cover the complete audible spectrum. Organists know this.

haa... actually it does.
Organs are louder so it can produce more volume at given frequency, I'll give you that. I've never figured out how you guys manage to know which pedals to press...

 

[shinew]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rednamalas1 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yup, It's not very often that we need to hear bass below 40hz in acoustic music (someone correct me if I'm wrong) Electronica often uses extremely low bass that tests lower limits of our audible spectrum.

that's true for the piano. But double bass are frequently used in orchestral music, but perhaps not as dominant as in some other genre(R&B, electronica, etc...)

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0dhi hat's fine, but realistic, balanced bass for a bunch of other genres (trance, hip-hop, other bass-drum oriented music) is something else entirely, and I assume the people who your thread title is intended for (those who think the DT-880 doesn't have bass), would be listening to those types of genres mostly.

that's the thing that has always puzzled me. How would someone know if the bass is accurately presented when listening to music from pop, trance, hip-hop or any songs/pieces that don't have a real life "standard", where how much bass/treble/mids can be hugely amplified/dimished based on the artists' preference? I always feel that to those genre, whether the headphones/speakers have sufficient bass or not has largely become a personal taste. This is not an attack to the people who love those genres, i just really don't know what standard it's being measured against. Btw I myself enjoy listening to pop & heavy metal sometimes.

 

[Shahrose]

i find classical music is a less than optimal genre for testing headphones, especially when considering the polar extremes of the frequency response. classical music is good for testing tonality and relative levels of bass/midrange/treble as well as timbre but not good for stressing a headphone. with electronic music you can, for example, test the decay of bass (tightness) down to 25 hz or so with some songs that use such beats, as well as various kinds of unusual textures and sounds in the upper and lower frequencies that aren't really possible with real instruments, among other things.

that being said, i love classical, but i don't think it's a good stress test for any headphone compared to other genres.

 

[Uncle Erik]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MD1032 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Piano doesn't cover the complete audible spectrum. Organists know this.

There's an old moviehouse nearby with a Mighty Wurlitzer inside. I'll go over to catch an old silent film with accompaniment and they give 15-20 minute concerts with classic films, too.

That thing hits (I think) 16Hz on the low end. Holy crap. Always an excellent reminder of the limitations of recorded music and reproduction.

Not to threadjack - I love my '03 DT880, as well!

 

[V-DiV]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shahrose /img/forum/go_quote.gif i find classical music is a less than optimal genre for testing headphones, especially when considering the polar extremes of the frequency response. classical music is good for testing tonality and relative levels of bass/midrange/treble as well as timbre but not good for stressing a headphone. with electronic music you can, for example, test the decay of bass (tightness) down to 25 hz or so with some songs that use such beats, as well as various kinds of unusual textures and sounds in the upper and lower frequencies that aren't really possible with real instruments, among other things. that being said, i love classical, but i don't think it's a good stress test for any headphone compared to other genres.

Why would you want to "stress" headphones. The best headphones, and the type I'm looking for, are those that faithfully reproduce the recorded music, which also hopefully does a good job of faithfully reproducing the performance.

On the other hand, in pop genres a lot is done in the studio to modify/enhance the recorded tracks. But if you listen to headphones that over-emphasize the bottom end aren't you piling headphone bass boost on top of studio bass boost on top of the sound of the original instrument/vocal sound?

Classical music is excellent for testing headphones, if you know what live acoustical instruments sound like. You can test the sound of the instruments on the headphones to the sound of the real thing. It is a lot harder to do that with electronically modified music.

 

[GreatDane]

Quote:

Originally Posted by shinew /img/forum/go_quote.gif Have you tried EQ it? If you're OK with the idea of EQ i meant... **How would someone know if the bass is accurately presented when listening to music from pop, trance, hip-hop or any songs/pieces that don't have a real life "standard", where how much bass/treble/mids can be hugely amplified/dimished based on the artists' preference? I always feel that to those genre, whether the headphones/speakers have sufficient bass or not has largely become a personal taste.

**I have those same feelings re electronic music although I am somewhat of a bass head at times.

I don't currently use a 15/31 band EQ but I do use an Aphex 204 which has worked better for me. It really packs in a nice punch starting around 40 Hz.

I'm not too much into organ music but I do have a copy of a CD known as the "Soundhound Organ CD" recorded by a professional. It has strong bass that dips below 15 Hz IIRC. It is a true subwoofer tester and makes headphones beg for mercy.

 

[shinew]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shahrose i find classical music is a less than optimal genre for testing headphones, especially when considering the polar extremes of the frequency response. classical music is good for testing tonality and relative levels of bass/midrange/treble as well as timbre but not good for stressing a headphone. with electronic music you can, for example, test the decay of bass (tightness) down to 25 hz or so with some songs that use such beats, as well as various kinds of unusual textures and sounds in the upper and lower frequencies that aren't really possible with real instruments, among other things. that being said, i love classical, but i don't think it's a good stress test for any headphone compared to other genres.

I find it the opposite. To be able to identify whether the headphones are faithfully producing the original sound or not, one needs to know what the original instruments sound like. Music played by non-electronic instruments have a much more consistent sound signature than their electronic counterparts. It doesn't matter if you find the "decay of bass" are more to your liking on one pair of headphones than another or vice versa, if you don't know what the original instruments sound like, you're just looking for headphones that fits your personal sound preference(which there is nothing wrong with!). But one can not say other headphones "lacking" or "excessive" in bass, mids or highs without really knowing what the original instruments sound like.

Quote:

Originally Posted by V-DiV Why would you want to "stress" headphones. The best headphones, and the type I'm looking for, are those that faithfully reproduce the recorded music, which also hopefully does a good job of faithfully reproducing the performance. On the other hand, in pop genres a lot is done in the studio to modify/enhance the recorded tracks. But if you listen to headphones that over-emphasize the bottom end aren't you piling headphone bass boost on top of studio bass boost on top of the sound of the original instrument/vocal sound? Classical music is excellent for testing headphones, if you know what live acoustical instruments sound like. You can test the sound of the instruments on the headphones to the sound of the real thing. It is a lot harder to do that with electronically modified music.

x2

 

[Shahrose]

Quote:

Originally Posted by V-DiV /img/forum/go_quote.gif Why would you want to "stress" headphones. The best headphones, and the type I'm looking for, are those that faithfully reproduce the recorded music, which also hopefully does a good job of faithfully reproducing the performance.

i guess i wasn't clear enough in my last post, however, that's what i meant when i said classical music was good for testing timbre and tonality. it's good for testing how accurate something sounds since actual instruments have distinct timbres so you have a reference sound to compare to. BUT, if you want to stress test a headphone to gauge its technical abilities then other genres, for example, electronic, are better to use.

you asked why i would want to stress the headphone? well simply because i want to know how good its drivers are...how good is it at reproducing complex difficult music. a lot of my music, as you may expect, is electronic, and so i need to be sure that the headphone can infact faithfully reproduce these sounds without struggling. Otherwise i wouldn't be able to enjoy my music since i'd be missing parts of it or parts of it would be distorted.

shinew also repeated what you said (as a result of perhaps my confusing last post) and i have the same response for him. classical music is good for testing the accuracy of a headphone but not its technical prowess (compared to other genres out there). i used the low hz bass beats in electronic music as an example to present something that would rarely be found in classical music. if you were only using classical music as a test, you'd never know how well the headphones could reproduce something like that.

now, if the only genre you listen to is classical, then it's a non-issue for you, since it likely won't matter to you how well your headphones can reproduce tight 25 hz beats as they would rarely, if ever, be encountered in your music. but for me, one who listens to a variety of genres, including classical and electronic music, it's important for my headphones to be able to reproduce these sounds effortlessly without distortion or cutoffs.