does DIY save money?
Sep 26, 2005 at 1:15 PM Post #31 of 54
Oh, and if you really get bitten badly, you have to worry about three upgrade paths:

Your audio gear.
Your tools.
Your test equipment.

Ever dream of spending $50 on a pair of cutters when you can get them for $5? It happens. Spend $250 on a soldering iron when RS has one for $7? Uh-huh. It can be a horror show, or it can be enjoyable; it depends how masochistic you are.
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Sep 26, 2005 at 1:31 PM Post #32 of 54
To me tools arent really an issue. I use what i have.

God knows my soldering iron needs a new tip! And that my wire strippers wont cut teflon, so i have to use a scalpal... but i strive on! :p

Rob.
 
Sep 26, 2005 at 1:34 PM Post #33 of 54
Quote:

Originally Posted by robzy
To me tools arent really an issue. I use what i have.


That's great... count your blessings! It is commendable.
 
Sep 26, 2005 at 1:39 PM Post #34 of 54
Quote:

Originally Posted by Voodoochile
That's great... count your blessings! It is commendable.


I should point out that another interpretation of what i said could be "I have no more money to upgrade tools".

All spare money is going into Dynalo and CDs :p

I really should consider a new meter to. One has issues turning on (will only turn on if the selector is set to Temperature, but then i can use anything i want). And the other one is crappy and gives voltage readings off a couple of volts :p

Rob.
 
Sep 26, 2005 at 2:42 PM Post #35 of 54
Quote:

Originally Posted by Voodoochile
6: You might end up with a hi-tech looking paperweight (don't walk away, RUN).



Sounds a bit like my DAC at the moment, $500 paperweight at the moment, though I'm in too deep to get out of this one just yet
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Sep 26, 2005 at 2:55 PM Post #36 of 54
No, though that is the most common reason for starting this hobby.
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Sorry, for your wallet, if you are dragged to Head-Fi.

Sorry, for the rest of your assets, if you additionally are dragged in to DIY.
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Sep 27, 2005 at 10:12 AM Post #37 of 54
I just have to weigh in here. I have been thinking the same thoughts privately this week. It is a curious balance.

I just finished a PPA and STEPS. I'm listening to it with my HD650s as I type. Frank Zappa, The Yellow Shark. Lovely
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But the effort that has gone into it has been enormous. Living in Oz makes it all that bit harder - I'm almost tempted to write up a guide for building in Oz.

So, does it save money. Yes and No. I've been at DIY audio for over 25 years. Over time I have accumulated just about every tool and toy. And there have been a number of occasions when I have been able to fix some household item for myself or someone else with trivial effort and cost, when a professional fix would have cost serious money. So there are useful trade-offs when you get into the hobby.

I think the big savings come if you strive for the high end. You simply can't compete with commodity grade products that are mass assembled on robotic production lines. But once you look at most high end gear the prices are quite out of proportion with the cost of components. I'm not really sure what commercial offering could be compared to a PPA, but I'm sure it would be far from cheap. Same goes with most other items you might build. Loudspeakers are an exception, you can often do very well even at the cheaper end, so much of the cost is in the box and the cost of shipping a lot of air about. But some of us hope to compete with the $10,000 speakers - and even get close.

The high end of HiFi gets to unreasonable prices quickly because the costs and margins are so much greater. Cable costs so much because the single largest cost the manufacturer faces is marketing, and then the margins on cables and other accessories are usually at least 100%. Only a very small fraction of the purchase price is actually going into the object.

But, we never count our time. The time it has taken me just running about, finding the bits, and all the other messing about - I could easily have earned far more money than the cost of paying one of the guys out there that earns some extra cash assembling these things. But, it was fun. Humans enjoy the creative process, and for many of us, just taking the time out from life's stresses to sit down and enjoy just building something is worth far more to our general well being than any metric based upon how much our time is potentially worth.

If you take the attitude that we actually need to spend some amount of time in such solo creative pursuits, then the answer is that if you build up a serious hobby that has the side effect of supporting other joys in life - like being able to listen to music to best effect - then it easily pays for itself. And over time you can be in the position of owning equipment that you could not reasonably ever have expected to have otherwise. But you do need some element of patience. Woodworking is a similar (and complementary) pursuit. One can spend a fortune on tools, but once you have got to the point that you have built a few items of furniture, you are way way ahead. Priced a nice dining room table lately?
 
Sep 30, 2005 at 9:40 AM Post #38 of 54
I'm a tools freak, so it's very expensive. Let's see...
oscilloscope $200
dual power supply $100
oscillators & function generators $300
Assorted Tektronix 500 stuff $400
distortion analyzer $400
Fluke 5 digit DMM $50
scope & other test leads $300
solder station & tips $250
basic parts assortment plus a few starter projects $600
breadboards, circuit boards, wire, terminals, etc. $100
Misc. tools $200

You do the math.
 
Sep 30, 2005 at 11:02 AM Post #39 of 54
Quote:

Originally Posted by SiBurning
I'm a tools freak.


Me too!
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It's almost like a fetish.
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Four scopes- not counting the parts one I have for sale, five DMMs, distortion analyzer, LCR/ESR bench meter, freqency counter, two generators, four bench PSUs, tube tester, variac, and half dozen different soldering irons. Plus some networking gear, but that's a seperate collection. /embarrased
I don't wish to discuss parts, though. /ashamed

Sometimes, I also like to listen to music through headphones.
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What I don't have, and would like very much: more spare time.
 
Sep 30, 2005 at 12:01 PM Post #41 of 54
Quote:

Originally Posted by 1UP
My name's VC and I'm a toolaholic! [applause]


Thnks for adding the '-aholic' to the end of that, I appreciate it.

Where does the support group meet? Oh yeah, right here.
 
Sep 30, 2005 at 6:02 PM Post #42 of 54
I've only built a few cmoys, but here's my $.02:

No, I don't think it's a money-saver overall. However, there are some other ways to think about it:

1) If you're patient (yeah, right
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), you can purchase parts and tools over time, so that you're not laying out a tremendous amount right away.

2) Amps make great gifts. So that $20.00 cmoy can take the place of a $50 gift (at least for some people).

Finally, the satisfation of building something that really makes a difference in your listening experience is enormous.
 
Sep 30, 2005 at 6:33 PM Post #43 of 54
In my case, I saved a bunch of money by building my own amp, but only because I build electronics for a living. (I work in an Engineering lab, and a large part of my job is building prototypes and doing PWB reworks). Virtually everything I needed to build an amp was in our stockroom, and I have just about any tool or test instrument I could ever need or want freely available. I also request samples frequently for work related projects, so one or two more sample requests isn't a big deal, for instance if I want to try another op-amp.

YMMV.

Cheers,

bg
 
Sep 30, 2005 at 6:47 PM Post #44 of 54
The only thing it saves are your ears (from listening to that retail slag). But I suppose in some respects it saves money because you spend say $200.00 in parts on something that would easily cost $700.00
 
Oct 1, 2005 at 1:47 AM Post #45 of 54
Yeah,

Remember GainCard? Few thousand dollars for an opamp. (Yep ONE opamp chip in that shibang.) ... I am ashamed I have the same nationality as the company which sell that.
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Tomo

P.S. As for saving money, you make up the saved money for your effort and time. ...
 

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