[audioengr]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ciphercomplete /img/forum/go_quote.gif OK thats fine not to "believe" it. I can switch immediately between a 2.5 foot optical cable and a 2.5 coax cable on my DAC and I hear added noise on the coax. With no CD playing, no signal, I hear added noise. I hear the difference, I don't have to buy into anything. My system is very low noise and my speakers are quite good so I hear added noise if its present. My DAC is tube based so it is more sensitive than its SS counterparts but that doesn't change the fact the fact that the interference is there.

Quite typical. It's a ground-loop with the coax cable.

Steve N.
Empirical Audio

 

[MacedonianHero]

Quote:

Originally Posted by m1abrams /img/forum/go_quote.gif Only thing I think that a transport can effect is jitter, and it really does not take much to get the jitter to a ridiculously low point that it is non-trivial to measure never mind hear the effects.

If your DAC though has de-jitter capabilities and buffers/re-clocks the data, then even this shouldn't be an issue either...theoretically speaking of course.

 

[estreeter]

Quote:

Originally Posted by audioengr /img/forum/go_quote.gif Quite typical. It's a ground-loop with the coax cable. Steve N. Empirical Audio

Thanks Steve - that coax issue is well documented, but here on Head-Fi we prefer to have pretty much the same arguments ad infinitum.

To the OP - if you can find a DAC which makes any source sound good, be it from USB/Toslink/coax or line-out, then go for it. Even if you subsequently upgrade your source at a later date, you will still have a very good DAC. One of the more interesting aspects of the debate is that many on Head-Fi will disavow options such as the DACMagic, V-DAC and uDAC in favour of more exotic (and expensive) DACs - to my mind, that largely negates any overall savings you may have made by buying a cheap source.

 

[googleborg]

the difference between the two forms of error correction that data/redbook cds have is that data cds don't extrapolate (cos it would still be a fatal error and screw the code) where-as whatever is reading an audio cd will send whatever 'seems right' if it can't recover from an error? because the occasional 'guesssed' bit sounds...well like nothing i guess, opposed to an raw error bit which might sound like death.

if so, then even if a transport is getting a lot of unrecoverable errors, it must be the CDs fault, else the transport is being affected by something odd.

as for jitter, i still don't know what it sounds like! it's infuriating to be plagued by this ghost in the machine and to not even know what it sounds like, if you have any ways to increase jitter massivley i'd love to hear it (literally).

honestly all this circ and jitter and vibration issues and whatever else malarky just mades me wonder why people don't just use hard disk playback

Quote:

Originally Posted by m1abrams /img/forum/go_quote.gif CD Audio and CD Data are 2 completely different beasts and you really can not compare them like that. CD Audio (Redbook) does not have the error correction builtin that data has, therefore your example is invalid comparison. That said my stand is the transport can only effect the sound via jitter and if you have jitter under control then it should have no effect.

 

[project86]

People who have expensive vibration reduction gear and such will in fact probably own hard disk based playback at some point.... when a suitably expensive/exotic/rare option presents itself. They already have to an extent with the Nova Physics Memory Player.

 

[t/sound]

I dont know if it would be ok to look at the OP's original question from a different angle?
There are currently any number of formats delivering a digital signal to your dac, leaving it to do its thing.
1)If we want to compare apples with apples, then we should ask, is a stand alone cd player with the same digital coax better as transport for your dac if one is a cheapy and one is expensive/ state of the art/fancy?/ dedicated transports.
2)Repeat the last question but substitute an optical transfer.
3)Then repeat for computor as source, qualify the variables as in transfer to dac, modes. Cheap / expensive / modded / straight off the shelf.
4)Then dap / ipods/ wadia/ onkyo coax or optical to dac.
5)Then any of the streaming devices duet/ transporter etc and how you you connect them to your dac.

The desired endpoint is the best quality music reproduction eminating from your dac.

So does price, modding, interconnect format, digital format(CD DVD SACD HD ), and source format per category make a difference.
More so, what is the best source( fancy or not) that you can currently use to send bit perfect data to your dac making it sing ?

This much I have heard, the dac per se makes the most difference, the transport, ipod doc digital coax improves on most disk spinning transports ( have not heard fancy dedicated disc spinning transport ) Unmodded Duet streaming solution better than most disk spinner transports but not better than Wadia doc.

I have read vast numbers of posts, reviews and heard for myself major differences in sound from many formats sending bits to the same dac, why?

The more I experience myself the less I have to know and thankfully the less I have to believe, I have to please only myself.

I dont think that I have by any means experienced the closest I can get to the real deal but that only makes discovering improvements special.

Good shade, and John, hopefully no fires this season.