[tktran]

Gluegun your logic in reasoning sometimes escapes me.


"...the V6, which is cheaper than the V700, actually works better than the V700 for what they want to do...BECAUSE of the fact that it works for other things as well"

???

Even if they work for other things eg. making toast, putting the cat out etc it does not necessarily work better than the V700DJ "for what they want to do"

(and what is that?)

And I agree with bpm2000 that it's a matter of preference which headphones you use when DJing live... it doesn't make your mix any better- you need a good technique and some skill (PRACTISE, PRACTISE, PRACTISE!)

BT's favourite phones are the MDR 7506, but he admits he couldn't DJ for crap, whilst his buddy A. Coe, a DJ with liquid smooth mixing skills, is one of the world's most highly paid DJs.
And guess what he's been using lately?

Yup V700DJ.

Comfort (one one ear, both ears and hanging on your neck), isolation, portability and durability all take precedance to sound quality. Why? because when DJing in a club you DON'T want to have your headphones at volumes at which you'd normally listen. Trust me on this one... learn to mix at low volumes and your ears will thank you for it 20 years down the track.

I want the lowest volume possible, without compromsing on my mix.

Anyway that's my last reply in this thread, I think I'm starting to repeat myself...

 

[coolvij]

Quote:

making toast, putting the cat out

LOL!

 

[Gluegun]

Even if they work for other things eg. making toast, putting the cat out etc it does not necessarily work better than the V700DJ "for what they want to do"
________________________

Yea, they can, because they have more features that HELP a DJ than the V700's do! Half of the V700's features that you like dont actually help. For example, on the V6's, The midbass is more accurate timewise--it doesnt get as stretched out, so you can beatmatch at insanely fast rates, whereas with the V700's, the midbass (what you beat match with) would blur. Also, especially with the Beyer pads, they block out more sound than the V700.

_______________________

(and what is that?)

And I agree with bpm2000 that it's a matter of preference which headphones you use when DJing live... it doesn't make your mix any better- you need a good technique and some skill (PRACTISE, PRACTISE, PRACTISE!)

BT's favourite phones are the MDR 7506, but he admits he couldn't DJ for crap, whilst his buddy A. Coe, a DJ with liquid smooth mixing skills, is one of the world's most highly paid DJs.
And guess what he's been using lately?

Yup V700DJ.

Comfort (one one ear, both ears and hanging on your neck), isolation, portability and durability all take precedance to sound quality. Why? because when DJing in a club you DON'T want to have your headphones at volumes at which you'd normally listen. Trust me on this one... learn to mix at low volumes and your ears will thank you for it 20 years down the track.

I want the lowest volume possible, without compromsing on my mix.

_______________________

The only reason the big names use the V700 is because sony bought them out to do so. Lets see......features you want that the V6's have...... comfort.....portability.....durability......abilit y to do ones sided ear monitoring and two ear monitoring and hanging wit (much more than the V700's, where the plastic part taht holds onto the drivers is prone to breaking), and they are so clear, so naturally impactful that, hell yes you can monitor beats at low volumes! You don't need exaggerated midbass to do that! The pure CLARITY of the things, the fact that they are easy to power, the fact that they sound good at low volumes, the fact that they have impactful and clear and easy to define bass at low volumes give them this feature, more than the way the V700's do it--sacraficing the rest of the sound range. What I am saying is that these do everything the V700's do, but BETTER. *and* they do other stuff as well! Yes, it is possible to use pure skill to make up for ****ty tools, which is what these big names do....and, if you read some of my earlier posts in this thread (about how trance has gotten so standardized), you will see how they change the music itself to bend to be able to be mixed with these crappy tools!

 

[Eagle_Driver]

I would like to add to this: You do need some mid-bass output from a pair of headphones if you're gonna DJ. (I don't mean peaky overtight mid-bass or sloppy overboosted overall bass response.) After all, hyped-up upper-mids alone can't do the job. What good is an analytical upper-mid range if a pair of cans have no bass response whatsoever - not even the mid-bass? You'd have to crank up the headphone volume REALLY loud just to hear the beats, because they have little or no output below 200Hz! But on the other hand, overboosted mid-bass is also no guarantee of even GOOD trance mixes - many "boomy" headphones have recessed upper mids and squashed detail, thus making it VERY difficult to distinguish REAL beats from muddy thumps! DUH!

 

[tktran]

Hi Gluegun,

I wasn't going to continue with this thread because I can't think of anything more to say without repeating myself.

It seems you keep insisting that the V6 are a better choice than the V700DJ for DJing. What can I say? I'm a DJ, and I use the V700DJ. And it works perfectly fine for me (no complaints yet)

As for your comment/theory on:
[Half of the V700's features that you like dont actually help. For example, on the V6's, The midbass is more accurate timewise--it doesnt get as stretched out, so you can beatmatch at insanely fast rates, whereas with the V700's, the midbass (what you beat match with) would blur.]

I love electronic music and have personal preferences to the styles that I enjoy listening to in private. But I when I have to mix, I can mix electronica in all it's forms. From ambient to breakbeats to chillout to drumnbass to house to techno to any other other style you care to mention. (beats are beats are beats)It's all under the same roof of electronic dance music to me. And if it's under 250 bpm I have no problems with the V700DJs. I can't imagine how "insanely fast" beats have to be before it's too hard to beatmatch with the V700DJs.

I never said the V6/7506 weren't suitable for DJing (search the forums and you'll see), but it seems that you keep arguing with me as if I did. Each time I say 'Yeah, the V700DJs are fine for DJing'... you come back and 'no no here's why they aren't.. and here's why the V6s are better'

I don't have the V6/7506 to compare because they're hard to source in Australia. Besides I also have a pair of HD25, and I don't feel the need for a another pair of headphones purely for DJing. What do you want to me do? Praise a pair of headphones I've never used? Keep posting how fantastic the V6/7506 are? Concede that yes, they are better for DJing, when I haven't heard/used them.

Maybe you've never DJed in a club setting. Or perhaps you dislike the headphones so much it's coloured your view of them as being unsuitable DJ phones. I dunno.

My last comment is that if you're having problems mixing with the V700DJs (skewed inaccurate beats or whatever) then sure try another pair of different phones. To a DJ starting out i would neither recommend the HD25 nor V700DJ, because they're far too expensive. You would be better off saving your money for records and and using them to improve your technique.

Almost all of the today's most respected club DJs started off with crapty low-torque belt-drives without any sort of pitch control and used ol headphones they found lying around the house. It was their passion for the music and determination and desire to spread the message of dance music that made them the great DJs they are today.
I see of a lot of teenagers wanting to jump on the superstar-DJ bandwagon. Saving up a lot of money for killer equipment, but after that initial kick of it, the hype of DJing sizzles out. What a waste...

Killer equipment doesn't make a fantastic DJ that's for sure.

If you feel urged to reply to this, please feel welcome to do so. But I honestly feel I've exhausted what I have to say about the V700DJ or HD25. If I ever get the V6/7506, and find that they improve my live mix by FANTASTIC proportions, you can be sure I'll be jumping on the bandwagon and singing praise about them.

Like I do about the KSC35...

Quote:

Gluegun wrote on 10-22-2001 06:43 AM: Hey man, i made a big reply for you in this post.....could you reply to it? http://www.head-fi.org/forums/showth...5&pagenumber=2

 

[massappeal85]

Well, after reading some of these posts, wiping my ass with "unbias" toilet paper, I'll retract some of what I said before.

I will agree that the v700s are suitable for mixing, as I've learned that a good DJ should equilise to the booth moniters (and I actually heard them recently, not nearly as bad as I thought, though the price is absoloutly rediculous). I still stand by my comments on the low and mid bass. No **** you need some of it, you DON'T need hyped up inaccurate bass. The amount you do need is equal to that of what an accurate headphone, such as the V6, would give you.

So, I've learned that if I found a pair of v700s in a club setup, its ok, I'll do alright. If I assume the only function of a DJ headphone should be to que up the next track, I cannot see the V6 actually improving anybodys mix by a substantiol amount if at all (though, thinking about, the accurateness that is eons beyond the v700, perhaps could). However, in this case, the v700 to me just looks like an even more waste of money.

If those that buy it for the looks and fashion would just admit to it, I'd have no problem. I find nothing wrong with that. The way I see it now, the V6s and v700s are fully capable as DJ headphones, as I've learned most ANY headphone that blocks out a suitable amount of sound is, and I will no longer attack the v700s in that respect. But no matter how I look at it, the V6s are undoubtly superior in pretty much every aspect of DJing, maybe if only by a little bit in what is necessary. Add that the V6s cost a whole lot cheaper, there is no way I can approve of the v700s at any angle on any level.

Peace.

 

[Steril]

My personal opinion :
The sound of the headphone isn't really important if you only want to mix electronic music. So the most important factor is isolation. When you're just next to return speakers and you want to ear something else in your headphones, the fidelity of the headphone isn't important, just the isolation to beatmatch.

So I think in this regard, V700DJ may be convenient for mixing.

But, IMO,V700DJ isn't handy at all for mixing cause it is way too bulky. I cant keep it on my head (one ear listening) and it always fall on my shoulders. IMO, it is not ergonomic at all.

I personnaly use the Senn HD 25. Cause it is far more convenient, lighter, smaller, gives me better isolation (my feeling - maybe my ear shape match better).

Anyway, V700DJ is a headphone designed to mix, period. Don't try to do anything else with this headphone (critically listen to music). On the other hand, HD 25 is really a very precise and, IMO, audiophile grade headphone, so you can use it in other circumstances than a simple mix.

 

[massappeal85]

1 more thing:

I can't remember who keeps saying it, but the reversable cups on the V6 does nothing for single sided monitering. What I have found though, is that when wearing it like you normally would, you can fold one of the ear cups in like you were collapsing it to put it in the pleather bag, keep the other one down around you're ear, and just have the other cup folded in with the pad against the top side of you're head. Its comfortable and hands free. If you think it looks too rediculous, you can also just move the headband forward up on your dome, and position one of the ear cups behind your one ear and have it sit there.

 

[Eagle_Driver]

I may sound like a broken record, but I am sick and tired of slamming the ENTIRE Sony MDR-V@#$%DJ line anymore! So the very next MDR-V###DJ review from me will be this message:

My elder brother told me, If you can't say something nice, then don't say anything at all.

This is my one-sentence opinion of the MDR-V###DJ headphones.

Oh, BTW, most trance mixes from some DJs are a piece of crap, regardless of the headphones used.

 

[tktran]

Gluegun; Eagle_Driver

I'm hearing a lot of slander against trance.

What are these producers/albums or dj/mixes that you've disliked?

Most headphones are crap..but if you know where to look for GOOD ones then you'll be happy and complain less about all the crap headphones.

So if you are open-minded about this genre called "trance" perhaps I could interest you in some better listening (and dancing) material....

 

[Gluegun]

Oh, I like the music. I like it a lot. It's just, for the most part, deeply flawed.

I just note that it doesn't have much deep bass, doesn't seem to use any real bass stuff as instruments (mostly using the whump whump to keep time), doesnt seem to have much, if any, thought on soundstaging or more than basic stereo imaging. And, many times, the varieties of emotions expressed in trance isn't all that wide. And you *never* get a sense of being in a trance club if you listen to the stuff through studio monitoring headphones, which is a fatal flaw....

But I still like the music.

 

[bpm2000]

Im really beginning to wonder where these messages are coming from Eagle_driver.

"Oh, BTW, most trance mixes from most DJs are a piece of crap, regardless of the headphones used."

What kind of comment is that? I see you enjoy The Beach Boys, The Beatles, Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd, The Who, whom I don't listen to, but I'm not calling them crap.

How much exactly do you know about trance music? To make a comment saying MOST of it is crap, you better have some damn large voluminous knowledge of it. Comments like that really make your seemingly somewhat relevant statements about headphones less credible.

"I may sound like a broken record, but I am sick and tired of slamming the ENTIRE Sony MDR-V@#$%DJ line anymore!"

And I think its safe to say that we are tired of hearing it too.

 

[Eagle_Driver]

bpm2000: When I said "piece of crap" in referring to most trance mixes from most DJs, I meant that in a "technical" sense, not in a "creativity" or "musical" sense. Sometimes, those beats don't hit quite hard enough, due to the seeming lack of adequate experience - especially among the "younger" DJs.

OOPS, bpm2000 - I changed the phrase "most trance mixes from most DJs are a piece of crap" in that thread you questioned to "most trance mixes from some DJs are a piece of crap".

 

[bpm2000]

Oh, change noted.

 

[Eagle_Driver]

I don't go to enough live dance parties to give you a valid statement - I can't go anywhere at night. It's based on the very few mixes that I heard (I forgot the names of the DJs who did those mixes).

BTW, even the best DJs of any music genre can make crap mixes at times.