[rkw]

If you liked the HF5, consider the Ety ER3XR or ER4XR.

My problem with them is the cable. I've had two etys, took care of them like babies and the cables worn down anyway in <18 months. That's why I went with the SE425, so i can change the cable as needed.

The upper Ety models (ER2-ER4) have detachable cables. The HF models do not.

 

[FYFL]

The urge for more is something so... human.

I've decided to keep what I have and make one last upgrde (RME + Audeze) give this combo a go for a couple of months, and if I don't like it, sell it as a bundle for cheap (<30% less of my current paying price). I want to "experience" what it is to have these type of things. I want to have a drink/coffee at 11pm or 5am and have a nice listening session, uninterrupted by kids and life, and see what it feels like.

Good choice. Which Audeze?

 

[NA Blur]

Hi, friends.

I recently got a job that allows me to save money, while enjoying hobbies. I've been in and out of this hobby for many years - mostly because of changes in interest, but more predominantly, because of life (kids, mortgage, bills).

After some rushed purchases through Amazon (DT770, SE425, ES100 MK2, etc), I decided that it was my time to stop playing around and get some sort of endgame. My plan is/was to get an RME ADI-2 DAC FS + headphones (LCD-2 Classic and perhaps some new IEMs) plugged into my computer with Roon/Audirvana. But because I live where I live, I don't have access to listen to some of these equipment. That is why I decided that I wanted to actually "hear" a difference in high end equipment before I went and spend some money on it.

A very nice person invited me to a private showroom here in Mexico City. They had, basically, all of the Focal line up, plus very high end amp DACs and amps (Moon HD230, Chords, etc). They allowed me to enjoy 2+ hours of listening. I listened to Elegias, Elear, Clear, Stellia and Utopia connected to the Moon HD230 and my computer. And while I could listed some differences in the clarity, soundstage, etc. Most of them were very subtle to my ears. To say it mildly, I was very dissapointed.

With this in mind, I am seriously considering not buying more stuff.

Am I doing something something wrong? are my ears trash?

I appreciate any advice

Your honestly is often what is missing in audio these days. Headphone listening is more of an adventure than making a couple of purchases and being done. For me it takes experience with different gear, making a few mistakes along the way, and ultimately learning about audio and what good audio actually is. Throw in some personal preference and you have a difficult task trying to winnow down to just one setup that you'll love for the lifetime of your audio adventures.

You've started things off correctly by being honest and willing to admit your missteps and quandaries. Hopefully you'll find a setup that you really enjoy and learn what questions to ask to get to temporary audio Nirvana. The Focal line doesn't do it for me either. Lack of bass impact, pad materials feel cheap, fit isn't right, and the sound lacked engagement without turning things way too loud. I was working with Tyll Hertsens one day when he had 3 of the Focals at his listening station. He had his definite favourite, but to me none drew me into the music. I was as shocked as you are now!

Moving forward you should look into headphones like the HE-400i, Philips Fidelio X2HR/27, and MrSpeakes Aeon Flow Open. These headphones have great impact, fun bass without being bloated or boomy, and will really draw you into the music. Those should draw you into your music and if they don't we're here to beef up your music collection so you get the most out of your listening experience.

 

[Malevolent]

Hi, friends.

I recently got a job that allows me to save money, while enjoying hobbies. I've been in and out of this hobby for many years - mostly because of changes in interest, but more predominantly, because of life (kids, mortgage, bills).

After some rushed purchases through Amazon (DT770, SE425, ES100 MK2, etc), I decided that it was my time to stop playing around and get some sort of endgame. My plan is/was to get an RME ADI-2 DAC FS + headphones (LCD-2 Classic and perhaps some new IEMs) plugged into my computer with Roon/Audirvana. But because I live where I live, I don't have access to listen to some of these equipment. That is why I decided that I wanted to actually "hear" a difference in high end equipment before I went and spend some money on it.

A very nice person invited me to a private showroom here in Mexico City. They had, basically, all of the Focal line up, plus very high end amp DACs and amps (Moon HD230, Chords, etc). They allowed me to enjoy 2+ hours of listening. I listened to Elegias, Elear, Clear, Stellia and Utopia connected to the Moon HD230 and my computer. And while I could listed some differences in the clarity, soundstage, etc. Most of them were very subtle to my ears. To say it mildly, I was very dissapointed.

With this in mind, I am seriously considering not buying more stuff.

Am I doing something something wrong? are my ears trash?

I appreciate any advice

After years of listening to headphones and IEMs that run the gamut from the budget to the summit, my ears have been trained, or should I say, they have grown accustomed to the variances in myriad products across a variety of price tiers. Some changes are very apparent, and others, subtle.

There is nothing inherently wrong with your assessment, though. A product that is priced twice as high is not twice as good. In fact, there have been (many) occasions where the cheaper product surpasses the more premium one; bear in mind, we are only talking about variations from a technical perspective. Once the subjective element of this hobby comes into play, cheaper headphones may be genuinely more desirable to an audiophile and/or melophile, depending on the sound signature that one is most happy with.

 

[gr33nhorn]

The responses here are a lot civil than i have seen in other forums. I had a very similar experience - I am used to headphones in the $50 range, and i tried to go directly to a $500 pair as an endgame strategy, and was significantly disappointed.

I found that
1. As you go up price points, High fidelity really means high fidelity. You are stuck with a flat sound signature whether you like it or not.
To give a bad food analogy - I am told, if you go to italy to an authentic pizza place, you are stuck with 3 choices of pizza. No pineapple - bacon - chicken tikka pizzas there. Same thing for headphones. You won't find find anything with a mass market tuning - I found out that having grown up with sony headphones, i was sort of accustomed to a bass heavy signature - and that is simply not a priority segment at that price point, and consequently nobody bothers
2. The improvements are really subtle. if you try to skip multiple tiers, it is really hard to notice. Unless you are listening to music critically for extended periods, you will not even know the differences to look for.
Again a bad analogy. Once i got my first job, and had money to spend on fancy brews, I started frequenting this fancy coffee place. initially all of their coffees tasted the same to me. I picked one randomly and stuck to it. One day I noticed the coffee tasted different, and I asked the barista about it. He admitted they were out of the correct blend and given me something hoping i wouldn't notice. 6 months ago, I couldn't tell the difference myself, but that day, I could.

At least for audio I am still convinced I have wooden ears. In a way, that is good. I have endgamed myself with a $100 headphone and called it a day. If I could hear the difference between headphones at all the price points, I would have to take some long, hard decisions about the utility of my arms, legs, kidneys etc.

 

[chesebert]

The urge for more is something so... human.

I've decided to keep what I have and make one last upgrde (RME + Audeze) give this combo a go for a couple of months, and if I don't like it, sell it as a bundle for cheap (<30% less of my current paying price). I want to "experience" what it is to have these type of things. I want to have a drink/coffee at 11pm or 5am and have a nice listening session, uninterrupted by kids and life, and see what it feels like.

Audeze has inconsistent build quality. I would find a way to demo the unit that you want to buy and would not buy blind. I love Audeze so not a knock against the quality assuming you find a good unit.

 

[chesebert]

I've been thinking on how to reply to your message for a couple of days, mostly because I'm a bit self aware about what I could describe correctly using head-fi terms I like a bass that is not crazy, but it is there when is needed (I listen to a lot of R&B). I feel that it gets a bit saturared in the highs (cymbals, or certain jazz guitar riffs), which I didn't like. In that sense, I think my K401 makes a better job.

I like something a bit more laid back in sound (I felt that Focals was too clear, to the point of being sterile/flat in sound)

DCA Aeon open, HD650 with DCA tuning pads, HE-1, SR-007 mk1/2, Audeze LCD2/3/4 (unit dependent), Porta Pro, PS1, HP1000. They are all wonderful at their respective prices when sourced and driven properly. One of them should fit your bill and your source/amp capability.

 

[FYFL]

Audeze has inconsistent build quality. I would find a way to demo the unit that you want to buy and would not buy blind. I love Audeze so not a knock against the quality assuming you find a good unit.

Do you think that quality control is still on issue in 2019-2020 models?
I know they had issues in the past but thought they made some improvements in that department.

Aneons in general are good choice for modern music.The ones from Drop are fun and good value. Newer Aeons 2 closed are more serious and you don’t really need to mess around with EQ as they’re fine out of the box. (I would stay clear from Aeon2 open) They still have a bit of a “U” shape frequency response (slightly recessed mid-range and artificially (I guess due to DK tuning) elevated bass response. I’ve tried to EQ them but it’s not really necessary. It’s a very comfortable headphone.

 

[GearMe]

If you liked the HF5, consider the Ety ER3XR or ER4XR.

Yep...my HF5's broke and replaced them with the ER3XRs for $107...solid value if you like the Ety sound

 

[GearMe]

I've been thinking on how to reply to your message for a couple of days, mostly because I'm a bit self aware about what I could describe correctly using head-fi terms I like a bass that is not crazy, but it is there when is needed (I listen to a lot of R&B). I feel that it gets a bit saturared in the highs (cymbals, or certain jazz guitar riffs), which I didn't like. In that sense, I think my K401 makes a better job.

I like something a bit more laid back in sound (I felt that Focals was too clear, to the point of being sterile/flat in sound)

...I've decided to keep what I have and make one last upgrde (RME + Audeze) give this combo a go for a couple of months, and if I don't like it, sell it as a bundle for cheap

Congrats! Hoping your Audeze are what you're looking and that they let you get 'lost in the music'!

 

[JDFlood]

What about the sound? Which one do you prefer?

Hard call. I think LCD overall is a safer bet. The 800’s are better at sound staging. But they are a little trebly in all but the top tier of amps. They are very hard to drive. The LCD I think sound better in the greatest variety of music and source equipment. The LCD are much more flexible. The LCD are a bit more fluid.



I noticed as I zeroed in on my final electronics the different headphones started to sound more and more alike. With the equipment I am using now,

 

[JDFlood]

The responses here are a lot civil than i have seen in other forums. I had a very similar experience - I am used to headphones in the $50 range, and i tried to go directly to a $500 pair as an endgame strategy, and was significantly disappointed.

I found that
1. As you go up price points, High fidelity really means high fidelity. You are stuck with a flat sound signature whether you like it or not.
To give a bad food analogy - I am told, if you go to italy to an authentic pizza place, you are stuck with 3 choices of pizza. No pineapple - bacon - chicken tikka pizzas there. Same thing for headphones. You won't find find anything with a mass market tuning - I found out that having grown up with sony headphones, i was sort of accustomed to a bass heavy signature - and that is simply not a priority segment at that price point, and consequently nobody bothers
2. The improvements are really subtle. if you try to skip multiple tiers, it is really hard to notice. Unless you are listening to music critically for extended periods, you will not even know the differences to look for.
Again a bad analogy. Once i got my first job, and had money to spend on fancy brews, I started frequenting this fancy coffee place. initially all of their coffees tasted the same to me. I picked one randomly and stuck to it. One day I noticed the coffee tasted different, and I asked the barista about it. He admitted they were out of the correct blend and given me something hoping i wouldn't notice. 6 months ago, I couldn't tell the difference myself, but that day, I could.

At least for audio I am still convinced I have wooden ears. In a way, that is good. I have endgamed myself with a $100 headphone and called it a day. If I could hear the difference between headphones at all the price points, I would have to take some long, hard decisions about the utility of my arms, legs, kidneys etc.

Excellent comments. For each of us the journey is different. It is not only finding out about about the equipment but also about our values. This is from two points of view, value of money and of sound quality (as in the characteristics you value). Being happy with $100 headphones is a great thing. What is ultimately important is enjoying the music... well for most of us. Some like the pursuit of new equipment. I spent 50 years spending a couple years fanatically researching and upgading, then four or five years enjoying my equipment... Then another upgrade cycle. I enjoy the music appreciation segments far more than the necessary upgrade cycles. But I really like where I am.

I like the coffee story. Yeah, suddenly you notice a difference... then you realize what the characteristic is... put a name on it. Then you discover another one. Over time you suss out a whole constellation of characteristics and prioritize them.

For me rhythm and pace was one of the most allusive and important. The thing that makes your foot start following the beat... the musicality. To me probably the most importan.

 

[gimmeheadroom]

You comment and some research made me change my mind about Schiit products. I got a great deal on a used V1 RME, which should be here by tuesday next week.

The RME is a fantastic DAC. The V1 will sound just as good as V2. Congrats, send some pics when it arrives

 

[gimmeheadroom]

What about the sound? Which one do you prefer?

I know this was not directed at me but unless you listen to big-room music like classical orchestral, or big band, the 800/800S are not an everyday headphone for most people. The LCD-2C is much better at more things and more pleasant to listen to. And your new RME will make it sing.

I love the 800s but they're a special purpose tool to have in the arsenal. If you have only one pair of headphones the LCD-2C is much more flexible and pleasant. The 800 is for checking recordings and letting you pick out every instrument in an orchestra. They're analytical and cold and they make bad recordings sound truly bad

 

[JDFlood]

I found that
1. As you go up price points, High fidelity really means high fidelity. You are stuck with a flat sound signature whether you like it or not.
To give a bad food analogy - I am told, if you go to italy to an authentic pizza place, you are stuck with 3 choices of pizza. No pineapple - bacon - chicken tikka pizzas there. Same thing for headphones. You won't find find anything with a mass market tuning - I found out that having grown up with sony headphones, i was sort of accustomed to a bass heavy signature - and that is simply not a priority segment at that price point, and consequently nobody bothers

I am really glad you brought this up. Good observation. But the caveat is IF, your electronics are not up to the task. In general, inexpensive electronics are thin, tinny, indistinct and really high quality electronics are rich, deep, highly separated notes, with very deep substantial bass. So powering high fidelity headphones with inadequate refined and powerful electronics and it sounds flat and thin. This is why I have learned to upgrade my electronics first... but there is no right way. My current electronics produce such deep rich and fully fleshed out sounds it make me blush and smile from ear to ear. Listening to headphones or speakers is listening to a system. It is the sum of the parts, and a weak part shows. Now having said this about the electronics. Some headphones are made to sound good with inexpensive electronics.. some good ones, like Ultrasone Edition headphones. They are made to sound good driven by and iPhone and they do to a point. I used these for years at work and travel. But in general, audiophile headphones must be matched with appropriate electronics. My current system has a 75 pound (yes, weight matters almost always) amp can drive any set of headphones to euphoric sound.

Your right about the pizza in Italy. But OMG the high end pizza with sausage is to die for... I mean absolutely incredible. On the other hand they have pizza places for the "common" person that are truly terrible... like a loaf of bread with a few drops of tomato sauce and a flake or two of cheese. But no pineapple.