[Satellite_6]

I guess my post was kind of ******-y, but the point of it was not to offend, but that DAC's can't make a difference as big a headphone upgrade. If you weren't happy with a headphone upgrade like that, you won't be happy with a DAC upgrade either. Don't bother. I like my sound card. It sounds a bit cleaner and more expansive than my laptop's sound, but it's not night and day. 
 
EDIT: That was censored? Really Head-Fi? 

 

[Head Injury]

Quote:

Still, I'm not convinced that something like an Essence STX is significantly better then something like a Realtek chip or a Xonar DG if you already have a separate amp. That's another thing I'm worried about when reading reviews on these things. People are probably comparing an un-amped sound card to one that has an amp and they are blown away because it gets loud now, so they write a review praising the sound card on how it completely changed their life and they worship the sound card daily.
 

It is significantly better objectively, but it may not always be audibly better. It depends on your specific motherboard, other components in the computer, the distortion and noise already inherent in your source files and the recording, and the listening conditions in your room.
 
This is unlike headphone upgrades, which often have differences magnitudes greater than the difference between good DACs. You'll usually hear the differences immediately there, whether you like them or not.

 

[holden4th]

Title. Is there REALLY a significant difference between onboard sound (Realtek ALC889) and a discrete sound card. Has anybody out there felt they got burned when they bought a $100+ sound card and heard it and compared it to onboard? I bought into the Sennheiser HD650 hype, bought it, compared it to my PX100 and felt burned (Yes it was amped properly). I don't want it to happen again with another audio component.
 
I'm using Denon D2000's and M-Audio AV40 speakers. 
 
 

I wonder if this poster's favourite piece of music is Grieg from Peer Gynt "In the Hall of the Mountain King"?

 

[Vladco]

 
Hi I would like to bring my 2 cents. People don't understand what you listen to system starting from music and ending you ears and brain. If something isn't up to speed you listen the weakest link.
I share my experience. I got monsoon computer speakers what some people raving about. I got them from ebay to listen to internet radio. It was nothing to be exited about. Plain junk. So a week ago I get cheap chinese wm8740 dac ($45) and reuse 9vac adapter laying around. It make major difference in my case. No fancy staff like cables, caps etc. I actually enjoy listen to radio now. In no way it's hi end equipment.
With HD650 or HD600 you really cut yourself short. It's a wonderful set of phones. With decent music and source I had to change IC cables to receive satisfactory results. It's not one size fit all. Actually some people prefer colored sound.
I share my experience to make you life more enjoyable. If you got bad experience take a lesson from from it.
Vlad
 

 

[ROBSCIX]

Your systems starts with your media and source component. If that is lacking then your entire system will also be lacking.
That is true of any link in the chain though

 

[firev1]

Quote:

None of my music is compressed either, I spend hours trying to find at least FLAC. (MFSL, DCC, or the like if available).
 

 
I assume that ^ is using bit-perfect playback at the least cus I found peeps with auzentech fortes not using bit perfect playback solutions. BTW why the hell you need to find FLAC if you can already rip it from your cd? =3

 

[LauZaIM]

Quote:

 
I assume that ^ is using bit-perfect playback at the least cus I found peeps with auzentech fortes not using bit perfect playback solutions. BTW why the hell you need to find FLAC if you can already rip it from your cd? =3

Oh I thought you were going to bring up that FLAC is compressed and rip me for that or something. Reason I need FLAC? I don't have, cough, time to rip 2400 CD's so I just download them.
 

 

[Modo]

Some downloads are actually lossless files recompressed to FLAC. Remember, it's the Internet. You're only really certain with your own rips.

I also don't get why you would be using vinyl rips for gear comparison. (You mentioned them in an earlier post.) Yeah, the dynamic range is great for listening, but the high inherent noise floor will mask many differences between DACs.

Two cents from here: The Realtek 887 on my motherboard is probably good enough for most people. The difference when switching down from the Essence ST is pretty obvious (mostly small details disappearing), but everything still is detailed enough, and there is no audible noise at any sane listening level.

 

[LauZaIM]

I don't know. The Pink Floyd DSOTM MFSL master 24/96 Vinyl rip by Dr. Robert sounds pretty good. You can hear that it's a vinyl in a song like Us and Them, but I know what that sounds like..It's also not the only thing I used for comparisons for the headphones. I used EVERYTHING for that. Even different remasters of the same album.

 

[leeperry]

DAC's can't make a difference as big a headphone upgrade. If you weren't happy with a headphone upgrade like that, you won't be happy with a DAC upgrade either

Well, yes and no...ages ago, moonboy told me that he'd prefer a crappy phone off a killer source than the opposite....now that I own serious sources, I tend to understand and somewhat agree. A killer source will project an astounding 3D soundstage that even a cheapie will benefit from, OTOH a crappy source will never allow an expensive phone to blossom(HD800 off a Realtek for instance ).

 

[Satellite_6]

Quote:

Well, yes and no...ages ago, moonboy told me that he'd prefer a crappy phone off a killer source than the opposite....now that I own serious sources, I tend to understand and somewhat agree. A killer source will project an astounding 3D soundstage that even a cheapie will benefit from, OTOH a crappy source will never allow an expensive phone to blossom(HD800 off a Realtek for instance

).

I think you do need something good for a high end headphone, but really, source first is crazy. 
 

 

[LauZaIM]

Quote:

I guess my post was kind of ******-y, but the point of it was not to offend, but that DAC's can't make a difference as big a headphone upgrade. If you weren't happy with a headphone upgrade like that, you won't be happy with a DAC upgrade either. Don't bother. I like my sound card. It sounds a bit cleaner and more expansive than my laptop's sound, but it's not night and day. 
 
EDIT: That was censored? Really Head-Fi? 

That's funny because I really enjoy my Denon D2000's and like them a lot more then my PX100's. I don't think some people here grasp the idea that the HD650's aren't really all that different from a PX100. You can bash me all you like, make up stuff that you think I listen too, or whatever, but I have actually sat down and listened to them and the HD650's are a complete ripoff. If I had not owned the PX100 generation 1's or ever heard them before then I might also think the HD650's were the best things since sliced bread. BUT I HAVE. They SOUND nearly identical and they MEASURE nearly identical on a graph. The HD650's just require a ridiculous amp setup and cost $250 more.

 

[Satellite_6]

At the risk of sounding like typical audiophile - you need to spend a lot of time with them to appreciate the HD 650's. They are an acquired taste and require a bit of "brain burn-in" at least.
 
Beats and Bose are ripoffs, Sennheisers are not. Don't go bashing a high end headphone you listened to once because you didn't like them. 
 
"You can bash me all you like, make up stuff that you think I listen too, or whatever" 
 
^what does this mean? 
 
 

 

[TheGomdoRi]

Quote:

Still, I'm not convinced that something like an Essence STX is significantly better then something like a Realtek chip or a Xonar DG if you already have a separate amp. That's another thing I'm worried about when reading reviews on these things. People are probably comparing an un-amped sound card to one that has an amp and they are blown away because it gets loud now, so they write a review praising the sound card on how it completely changed their life and they worship the sound card daily.
 

 
It's true on my HTPC rig I compared my motherboard vs. the STX.
Most of my headphones are easily driven under 100 ohms - it gets way too loud just with the motherboard.
 
It's pretty brash of you to say people are blown away because it gets loud lol - you clearly do not give enough credit to the people here.
I didn't write any reviews on the STX. I'm just personally happy with the product and I do not feel the need to try to justify myself nor try to influence others because I am happy with it.
You wanted advice so I gave you my opinion.

If you are really that paranoid and skeptical of gear - just stop reading and actually listen to them before you buy or else every post - you can fall back on that "oh you just think it's good but it may still be crap" attitude.

 

[astro]

 
Quote:

People with **** ears and **** audio equipment really shouldn't be allowed to make posts.
All placebo :s
Hah.. I feel sorry for you if you think an STX sounds the same as onboard.

 
I'll straight up admit that my ears are pretty bad. All those years with the etymotics and being in the marching band took a toll on my ability to hear high frequencies.
However, I've tried/owned several headphones, Shure SE530, DT770, HD650, HD555, HD280, MDR-V6. The differences between each of the brands and models are ENORMOUS. Even between two incredibly high end headphones there is a massive difference. You would think that there would be some kind of a reference sound, given how much focus is put on getting the source perfect. But it's all sound signature. So even if the soundcard does provide some difference, it's minimal. Whereas if that money spent on the soundcard was spent on the headphones, the difference would far outweigh any advantages a soundcard would provide. 

I agree with the 1/10 or 1/5 soundcard to headphone budget ratio often stated.