[Mkoll]

From Alvin
DENAFRIPS DAC uses adaptive fifo buffer, and reclocking. This technique yields excellent jitter rejection, however, the variable latency is inevitable.

Can @alvin1118 and other Pontus II owners (e.g. @kyorakun, @FooFighter, @joseG86, @sajunky) comment a bit more on the latency? How much latency are we talking about in terms of milliseconds and how it's perceived in real world use? I'm guessing "variable" latency means the latency varies within a range—what kind of range are we talking about and how does this manifest in real world use? Does setting the ASIO buffer size to 8 samples with ASIO off really affect the latency in non-ASIO applications as joseG86 claimed? Is there anything that can be done to reduce the latency?

I'm interested in this DAC but latency is a dealbreaker for me as I'm quite sensitive to it. I'd be using the DAC for music as well as gaming and TV/movies.

 

[550591]

Can @alvin1118 and other Pontus II owners (e.g. @kyorakun, @FooFighter, @joseG86, @sajunky) comment a bit more on the latency? How much latency are we talking about in terms of milliseconds and how it's perceived in real world use? I'm guessing "variable" latency means the latency varies within a range—what kind of range are we talking about and how does this manifest in real world use? Does setting the ASIO buffer size to 8 samples with ASIO off really affect the latency in non-ASIO applications as joseG86 claimed? Is there anything that can be done to reduce the latency?

I'm interested in this DAC but latency is a dealbreaker for me as I'm quite sensitive to it. I'd be using the DAC for music as well as gaming and TV/movies.

I only remember one review where the guy mentioned that it's noticeable with movies a

 

[joseG86]

Can @alvin1118 and other Pontus II owners (e.g. @kyorakun, @FooFighter, @joseG86, @sajunky) comment a bit more on the latency? How much latency are we talking about in terms of milliseconds and how it's perceived in real world use? I'm guessing "variable" latency means the latency varies within a range—what kind of range are we talking about and how does this manifest in real world use? Does setting the ASIO buffer size to 8 samples with ASIO off really affect the latency in non-ASIO applications as joseG86 claimed? Is there anything that can be done to reduce the latency?

I'm interested in this DAC but latency is a dealbreaker for me as I'm quite sensitive to it. I'd be using the DAC for music as well as gaming and TV/movies.

The DAC is for music and for music alone, you can't play shoot'em ups or watch movies with it unless you have certain knowledge and understanding about editing latency in real time

I usually listen to music and I don't care much about this latency at all but it is noticeable of course, it might be placebo but seems to be reduced when you decrease the ASIO latency...

If you are a professional e-gamer you don't want this, otherwise I prefer Pontus II over D90, X16, Ares 2 and Bifrost 2

 

[sajunky]

How much latency are we talking about in terms of milliseconds and how it's perceived in real world use? I'm guessing "variable" latency means the latency varies within a range—what kind of range are we talking about and how does this manifest in real world use? Does setting the ASIO buffer size to 8 samples with ASIO off really affect the latency in non-ASIO applications as joseG86 claimed? Is there anything that can be done to reduce the latency?

Latency is variable, it depends on a difference of speed between source clock and an internal crystal clock. It can increase over the time or decrease, it may also reset at times. It can be as long as 300ms as seen on measurements which is not acceptable for TV. If it were constant, it would be easy to correct. Latency also depends on the sampling rate. If you want lower latency, chose a higher sampling rate, but it is not always possible. However it is a hint for gamers.

Setting up ASIO buffers only affect devices with direct decoding (without large FIFO buffering). It will have absolutely no influence with Ares/Pontus.

I wonder why Denafrips is using so large buffers on USB port. USB host is synchronised with a receiver clock, it only needs a small buffer which size depends on the USB packet size (which is determined by a host driver).

 

[FooFighter]

Can @alvin1118 and other Pontus II owners (e.g. @kyorakun, @FooFighter, @joseG86, @sajunky) comment a bit more on the latency? How much latency are we talking about in terms of milliseconds and how it's perceived in real world use? I'm guessing "variable" latency means the latency varies within a range—what kind of range are we talking about and how does this manifest in real world use? Does setting the ASIO buffer size to 8 samples with ASIO off really affect the latency in non-ASIO applications as joseG86 claimed? Is there anything that can be done to reduce the latency?

I'm interested in this DAC but latency is a dealbreaker for me as I'm quite sensitive to it. I'd be using the DAC for music as well as gaming and TV/movies.

Don't have the Pontus anymore but I agree with what the others were saying.
I am keeping my use cases separate meanwhile.
That means serious stationary gear for music, serious mobile gear for music and less serious but fun gear (Apple AirPods Max with Apple TV 4k) for movies.

 

[beherit]

wow, I hope denafrips comes up with an update cause it would suck if it inhibits enjoying concerts or music videos with the pontus.

 

[iFi audio]

you can't play shoot'em ups

I remember using HD800 with our own stack in Battlefield 3, and after emulating 7.1 via a software it was great. Just one checkbox turned stereo into 8 channels and I didn't have to do anything else.

 

[joseG86]

I remember using HD800 with our own stack in Battlefield 3, and after emulating 7.1 via a software it was great. Just one checkbox turned stereo into 8 channels and I didn't have to do anything else.

I'd get crazy if I shoot and the sound of the explosion comes 0,5 sec after haha

 

[iFi audio]

I'd get crazy if I shoot and the sound of the explosion comes 0,5 sec after haha

Now I can't receall whether there was any audible lag or not, but here it probably depends on how serious one is into FPS games, and how much attention is given to that lag

 

[550591]

wow, I hope denafrips comes up with an update cause it would suck if it inhibits enjoying concerts or music videos with the pontus.

I think that's normal with r2r DACs?

 

[beherit]

I'd get crazy if I shoot and the sound of the explosion comes 0,5 sec after haha

I guess no need to worry of head shots coming through smooth or rolled off. Counterstrike will turn into a gun scene from the movie Tenet. LOL

 

[sajunky]

I think that's normal with r2r DACs?

Not. It is attibuted to use long FIFO in Denafrips DACs. Others depend on PLL for clock synchronisation, with PLL delays are smaller. My Audio GD R2R-11 has no clock synchronisation, it use a clock directly from the Amanero Combo384 module. The only delays in this case are related to the buffering on the PC and USB packet size.

With FIFO there is a lower jitter than when clock is recovered in PLL. For gaming and TV better use cheaper DACs with asynchronous USB transfers.

 

[McPh1st0]

I didn't experience any latency with my unit (TV optical out to Pontus 2). Watched a couple of tennis matches...i would have noticed...

 

[joseG86]

I wanna go I2S looking for a PI2AES see if the latency goes away, sometimes is noticeable sometimes it is not, its design is perfect as music reproduction is sublime. Nothing bad imo with it

 

[joseG86]

I managed to fix the "issue" with delay on Youtube and any media in Chrome so to speak

Just install the extension "YouTube Audio/Video Sync" and add the value you need

Then, for MP4/MKV simply install K-Lite Codec Pack and enable audio delay in LAV Audio Decoder