DENAFRIPS FPGA Firmware Update (12TH Anniv.)

[naka9]

Let's make @alvin1118 help us on getting the previous version, I won't be rolling more tubes or change anything on my system, I want old version asap!

@joseG86 I am willing to give it another full week and see if the sound.
I really believe that Denafrips engineers (the creators of the “original” sound) knows what they do and tested extensively...
If not, if they developed a “new” sound, and that is is, then I certainly want to go back, no questions about it.
In any case I really believe in Denafrips and they will make me happy (again)

 

[szore]

Let's make @alvin1118 help us on getting the previous version, I won't be rolling more tubes or change anything on my system, I want old version asap!

Try the phase button?

 

[joseG86]

Try the phase button?

Nope! what does it do in this case?

 

[PoMarantz]

Let's make @alvin1118 help us on getting the previous version, I won't be rolling more tubes or change anything on my system, I want old version asap!

I have one hope for this version. Tarun, the British Audiophile does a review of the Venus II. In the review when he plays the DAC out of the box he is sort of horrified...describing a sound like this situation (but actually worse, perhaps).. Not deterred he did his regular extensive burn-in by putting the DAC in his young son's room and let him unknowingly burn it in (I love that )…After burning it in for a couple of weeks, he positively LOVES IT! You could not pry it from his hands.. Now I know…all the resistors, caps etc. are getting the treatment there….and the concept of burning in "firmware" reeks of nonsense to me…but I will be open-minded and perhaps there is an outside chance that this will change with extensive burn-in? I wish that we could all have a Zoom Call with Alvin and the Denefrips Engineer and discuss this situation.

 

[PoMarantz]

Try the phase button?

I never have heard any difference in sound using the phase button for two years?

 

[DrCal]

Seems the effect of the latest firmware update is very system and personal taste dependent? Based on my observations majority of users so far have been happy with the result (see links to the following forums).

https://www.stereonet.com/forums/to...ga-firmware-upgrade-for-dacs/page/2/#comments

https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/denafrips-dacs.897934/page-112

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/denafrips-fpga-firmware-update?page=2

Guess one just has to try it...

 

[WorksUnit]

Seems the effect of the latest firmware update is very system and personal taste dependent? Based on my observations majority of users so far have been happy with the result (see links to the following forums).

https://www.stereonet.com/forums/to...ga-firmware-upgrade-for-dacs/page/2/#comments

https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/denafrips-dacs.897934/page-112

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/denafrips-fpga-firmware-update?page=2

Guess one just has to try it...

Well said, live with it for a while.
As @joseG86 replies say it looks like this can be rolled back, and therefore no negatives.

 

[szore]

Nope! what does it do in this case?

See if it sounds better on or off, just a suggestion

 

[naka9]

Well said, live with it for a while.
As @joseG86 replies say it looks like this can be rolled back, and therefore no negatives.

I think so too.
But because the it became so different and not in a good way, there came the shock and my reaction. Because it was performing amazingly also.
I am waiting to the burn in and all the improvements to come together, and if not the chance to go back really tranquilizes me.

A important note: I remember that I wasn’t thrilled with the Pontus II sound right of the box. My previous dac was the Chord Qutest, and I thought “this sure must burn in, because it’s just meh...” So after a month it was really singing.
Perhaps it just need some time.
But some users feedback mention a straight away improvement right after the upgrade, so this is a bit confusing...

 

[joseG86]

I think so too.
But because the it became so different and not in a good way, there came the shock and my reaction. Because it was performing amazingly also.
I am waiting to the burn in and all the improvements to come together, and if not the chance to go back really tranquilizes me.

A important note: I remember that I wasn’t thrilled with the Pontus II sound right of the box. My previous dac was the Chord Qutest, and I thought “this sure must burn in, because it’s just meh...” So after a month it was really singing.
Perhaps it just need some time.
But some users feedback mention a straight away improvement right after the upgrade, so this is a bit confusing...

Yes, when something sounds like new it tends to be received and perceived in a very good way, in my case I'm sure I am not enjoying it at all, I'm very very delicate with female voices and this firmware version produces a slight sibilance on the edges of many female singers (like I used to experience with DS Dacs) which I hate and didn't have before, I prefer smooth, warm, relaxed sound as my HPs are already very revealing and resolutive so I'm going back 99% when Vinshine sends old firmware : p

 

[BelaLugosi]

My experience so far:

I dig the saying; if it ain't broke, don't fix it. Don't know why but I keep ignoring it, I guess I'm too curious.

I updated the firmware three weeks ago, at first I didn't like it at all, all the magic the Ares II was capable of was gone, it used to make music and then it made surgery. As suggested I waited and tried different settings. OS slow, my usual setting, was now really harsh to listen, I tried NOS and things got better, to the point that I thought " that's it, I'm happy with it", but I wasn't. After two NOS weeks something was still off, the music was not there, yes, lots of detail, more separation, more clarity, more intelegibility, but where is the music? I was a bit worried, although we can go back to the original firmware, as someone suggested, where's the guarantee that we are going to get exactly what we had before?

300Bs and my unforgiving ZU speakers don't help masking changes.

Two or three days ago I decided to give a try to the OS Slow setting before asking Alvin again for the "old" firmware. So far I think the music is back plus the benefits formentioned before.

For those in doubt, from my experience, I suggest you give the updates some time (many hours) to settle, after that take your favorite tracks that you really enjoy and know, then listen to them in different days and occasions to get the final veredict. I can't state that I'm a hundred percent convinced that I like it better now, I would need another Ares II with the old sound to make a direct comparision to make things clearer.

I'll keep listening to those familiar tracks to see what's what.

The Blue Nile - A Walk Across The Rooftops playing right now, an album I know very well, sounding great!

Every system is different, every person is different, trust your ears.

 

[naka9]

With the generous offer of this new firmware Denafrips should have announced and underline with bolt capital letters, the need for an extended burn in period before getting the improved results. And that the sound would get bad before it turns good. I think that this would balanced all users expectations.
Once again, a big thanks to Denafrips for supporting and keep improving the products free of charge

Note: I still dislike my Pontus II with the new firmware, but I can see some small improvements now that 8 days have passed. The glassiness is almost gone...

 

[PoMarantz]

With the generous offer of this new firmware Denafrips should have announced and underline with bolt capital letters, the need for an extended burn in period before getting the improved results. And that the sound would get bad before it turns good. I think that this would balanced all users expectations.
Once again, a big thanks to Denafrips for supporting and keep improving the products free of charge

Note: I still dislike my Pontus II with the new firmware, but I can see some small improvements now that 8 days have passed. The glassiness is almost gone...

Hmmm…I agree with you. I am letting my system run 24/7 (as much as possible) @low-volume.
I will do this all week and not listen…until next weekend. Then I will decide. Thanks for the report!

 

[Nada]

Note: I still dislike my Pontus II with the new firmware, but I can see some small improvements now that 8 days have passed. The glassiness is almost gone...

Thank goodness for neuroplasticity. That and a handy expectation bias, i.e. an update = must be an upgrade.

From an engineering viewpoint, a DAC that's been played for hundreds of hours does not have an easily conceivable way to "burn in further". The capacitors will be fully formed and dubious other factors like resistor burn in, if it's a thing, will have happened. As for the notion a FPGA can "burn in” with new firmware, well that's just unbelievable.

Installing the new firmware without a guaranteed rollback is very brave. Good luck with that.

 

[PoMarantz]

Thank goodness for neuroplasticity. That and a handy expectation bias, i.e. an update = must be an upgrade.

From an engineering viewpoint, a DAC that's been played for hundreds of hours does not have an easily conceivable way to "burn in further". The capacitors will be fully formed and dubious other factors like resistor burn in, if it's a thing, will have happened. As for the notion a FPGA can "burn in” with new firmware, well that's just unbelievable.

Installing the new firmware without a guaranteed rollback is very brave. Good luck with that.

I am not an engineer and will not play “expert". I will put that time in. It’s a luxury problem.
If there is no change by next week…I will request the old firmware for my chip and reload. I am lucky that I was not having any of the tech issues that others were. So..it will be a "no loss" situation if I roll back.
I think José will be doing it sooner than later, so maybe he can give us a report on the reload.