[AdamP88]

An interesting read:

http://www.snopes2.com/music/info/greening.htm

 

[Todd R]

Did you notice who wrote that article? He's the editor of Sound & Vision (formerly Stereo Review).

Besides the fact that they only review mass market crap, and they never hear significant differences between components, they also are non believers in cables, footers, tweaks, etc.........
If there was a difference in sound they would have never admitted it, they are very anti high end.

Also take into account that this article is 13 years old. Jitter was an unknown term back then so of course that was not something he attempted to measure. Jitter, or timing errors are what green pen treatments improve.
You can't take anything this guy says seriously anyway.

 

[chych]

Quote:

Originally posted by Todd R You can't take anything this guy says seriously anyway.

And I suppose if the guy said something on the lines of: "The most obvious difference is that everything sounded smoother. There was simply more air and ambiance. Harmonic/unharmonic overtones are definitely more complete. Images are clearer and more solid and more dimensional. Bass is deeper and more controlled. " (taken from an actual review of a green pen), that can be taken seriously?

He even has a quantitative measurement for the green marker test, I do not see why you can discard his findings so easily.

 

[Budgie]

He must have used the wrong color of green pen.

 

[qwerty870]

I agree with Chych that a lot of the "tweaks" in the high end should be taken with a metric ton of salt.

However Sound and Vision is the worst audio/video magazine I have ever read. I truly believe that there is a direct correlation between advertising revenues and positive reviews. You would have to pay me to get me to even open another copy of Sound and Vision.

I have not tried the green pen trick and therefore will not pass judgement, but I did use a black pen (designed to be used the same way as the green) that came with an auric illuminator kit. I could not consistently identify any positive results.

What really pisses me off about this article though is that he did not even use the product in question. "I used paint instead: Pactra Acrylic Enamel A46" and "the color I chose was not green, but flat black." This is like writing a review for a Honda Civic but driving an Accord.

 

[chych]

Quote:

Originally posted by qwerty870 What really pisses me off about this article though is that he did not even use the product in question. "I used paint instead: Pactra Acrylic Enamel A46" and "the color I chose was not green, but flat black." This is like writing a review for a Honda Civic but driving an Accord.

Hmm that's enough to make it so that you can't take him seriously. Maybe I should have read the (dense) article a little more carefully, heh.

 

[aeberbach]

Why would black not work as well as green? Green looks green because it reflects green wavelengths of light more than other colors. The fact that green is the opposite of red (plants evolved green leaves because they absorb reddish sunlight well) just adds to the voodoo. Black looks black because it reflect all wavelengths equally (to our eyes), but none of them well. White looks white because it also reflects all wavelengths equally but better. Green does not magically absorb red laser better than black!

Sound and Vision may be the audio equivalent of IGN for gamers, but green pens are still pretty ridiculous. If laser reflectivity of the edge of the CD is a problem, why do some CDs have beautifully smooth edges and some have rough edges? Why aren't we rubbing the outside of our CDs with some 200 grit abrasive instead? I have two pairs of glasses. Both are frameless but one pair has polished edges to the lenses while one pair has matte edges. Guess which ones I can't wear in direct sunlight?

Think about a prism. A smooth face has a reflective inner surface while a rough face doesn't. If you shine a light into a prism it will reflect from the internal face (depending on angle of incidence) no matter what the color of the outside because it doesn't even reach the outside - the component of the light reflected stays inside the solid, any light passing through the wall of the prism can't come back and the color it passes through at that point doesn't matter.

Does anyone have a link to that great site that sells different colored cable ties for $40 each? The ones that magically improve your power cables when you place them around the cord? They also had reflective stickers to add to the top of your CDs... and they had links to reviewers who could "clearly" hear "audible differences".

 

[Todd R]

Well, instead of scoffing you guys could try it for yourself. It's cheap enough.

Get 2 identical disks, treat one and leave the other alone. Have some one play the disks for you with out letting you see which one they put in. Simple enough.

Green or black? Both seem to work well as far as I can tell. I use the black because it came with the Auric Illuminator kit (Which works wonders!).
Besideds it makin a small improvement in the sound, it also reminds you which disks you treated with the Auric Illuminator.

 

[Sean H]

To whatever degree it is, I hear an undeniable difference when I apply Auric Illuminator and the black pen to CD's. So it must be placebo or in my head you say? Please, don't insult me.

 

[chych]

Quote:

Originally posted by Sean H To whatever degree it is, I hear an undeniable difference when I apply Auric Illuminator and the black pen to CD's. So it must be placebo or in my head you say? Please, don't insult me.

It's placebo and in your head

 

[aeberbach]

Why do you have to feel insulted? I'm not calling you an idiot for wasting your money or anything.

Why couldn't the results you hear be due to the Auric Illuminator and not to the pen?

(and why is an audible difference due to a placebo worse than another kind? As long as you're a believer, you may enjoy music more while wearing a tinfoil hat. I can't tell you that you don't enjoy it more, just that I think it's ridiculous.)

Anyone want to try sandpapering the edges of a CD and see if it sounds better? I really think that could do something to combat internal reflection while the green pen doing the same is very doubtful.

 

[Sean H]

Quote:

Originally posted by aeberbach Why do you have to feel insulted? I'm not calling you an idiot for wasting your money or anything. Why couldn't the results you hear be due to the Auric Illuminator and not to the pen?

No, no, aeberbach, I wasn't referring to your post or directing my comment toward you at all. Yes, it could definitely be the Auric solution that could be causing the results more than the pen. My comment was just a rant statement because I've been through arguments about at audio Asylum and you always get those people who try to convince others that it's just in their head. I find that a bit insulting is all as I can clearly hear some audible difference with auric Illuminator (pen and solution) and trying to tell me I'm hearing otherwise simply is insulting. I hear what I hear, as you said even if music sounded better to me while wearing a tinfoil hat.

Funny by the way!!!

 

[aeberbach]

My position is always that even if it is just an imaginaryeffect, a tweak works as long as the music sounds better to the listener. You can think of it as being like the difference between listening to music when you're in a very happy frame of mind vs. the opposite. Maybe a tweak just helps people get into the right mood to hear good music?

 

[princeclassic]

the "all in your head" thing works both ways

i'm pretty much a skeptic with most tweaks and most cables...

even if a tweak or cable made a noticeable difference, i might not notice it because i'm thinking in my head that i shouldn't be hearing anything...

at least it keeps me from spending money though

 

[qwerty870]

I cannot hear a difference with the auric illuminator pen. But I was almost sure I could identify a difference with the pen and solution. If I had more copies of the same disc I could do a more scientific test, but alas I do not or the time to do an extensive test.