[buzzlulu]

Thanks all. I’m happy with the Bartok as my headphone amp/ dac / streamer.

And you have one of the best DAC's out there. I was so impressed with the Bartok in my headphone system (I owned it for 2 months) that it inspired me to return it and move to a Rossini and Master Clock which has now displaced my Linn in the two channel system. The Linn is now doing headphone DAC duties.

 

[Frankie D]

Jlbrach and Ciggavelli - right on

I come from very high end 2 channel land (Naim,dCs,Linn)
Source first is the universally accepted truth to system building

To those non believers Google Ivor Tieffenbruner and the Linn LP12 turntable.

In a stereo system the most money needs to spent on the source ie the turntable.
The MUSIC is contained in the grooves. If you don't maximize the quality of the turntable which EXTRACTS ALL of the music from the grooves then you are already behind. What good are the best most expensive speakers in the world if your turntable left some of the music behind in the grooves?

A good source might get 75% of the music out of the groove and an uber expensive speaker will only be transducing 75% of the music. The other 25% was left behind and never sees the light of day.
Better to buy the best turntable (source) you can afford which will extract 100% percent of the music first and then worry about amplifying it and then transducing it.

Same goes with amplifiers. What good is amplifying only 75% of the music if your turntable left 25% behind.

It is actually pretty logical.

That is not a rule in 2 Channel Audio. Many, myself included, still feel speakers are the most important piece as there remains greater variability in quality and sound in the transducers. This should be coupled with a balanced approach as incorrect amp speaker matching, as one example, will quickly derail the sound you were seeking.

Old Ivor was proving that the source can also make a big difference as many at the time did not put enough value in it and he produced source components (Linn). This goes back to a balanced sound, but speakers are still recommended as the largest piece of a 2-channel budget. Tks.

 

[chesebert]

I think it depends on the budget and the system. Also, there is generally a pricing sweet spot for different components with required spec. For example, I think the sweet spot for mid-power power amp (less than 250wpc) is somewhere between $5-10k. Same pricing range for 2-way bookshelf.

make sure you upgrade your room acoustics as well. It’s likely the single most important factor in sound reproduction

 

[chesebert]

And you have one of the best DAC's out there. I was so impressed with the Bartok in my headphone system (I owned it for 2 months) that it inspired me to return it and move to a Rossini and Master Clock which has now displaced my Linn in the two channel system. The Linn is now doing headphone DAC duties.

Nice...I haven’t heard a $20k+ dac/streamer from any major brand that sounded bad to me. They all sound freaking amazing Could we get your view on Klimax DS and Rossini?

 

[buzzlulu]

Nice...I haven’t heard a $20k+ dac/streamer from any major brand that sounded bad to me. They all sound freaking amazing Could we get your view on Klimax DS and Rossini?

Let's just say the Rossini/Clock now resides in my Naim 552/500 system and the Klimax DS has been "demoted" to the headphone system.

I compared the Bartok to the Linn in my headphone system and did not use the Bartok's internal headphone amplifier. Both Bartok and Linn were run through the HeadAmp GSX Mini into Utopia's with Kimber Axios cable. So it was strictly a DAC vs. DAC comparison. On a scale of 100 I found the Bartok a 95 vs. the Linn at 100. With the Bartok at $15k vs. Linn at $24k that almost seems to be a giant killer to me. It is what gave me the courage to try out the Rossini.

I have a good friend who has been doing this longer than I have who OWNED a Naim ND555, Linn KDS, Chord DAVE and now Rossini/Clock all at the same time (he is an addict!). Different from the typical punter who only demos and does not own for any length of time. My friend is now starting to prune and sell off. He will be keeping the Rossini/Clock for use in his system. His ranking was Rossini > Naim/Linn (tie) > DAVE

With that said when you get to this Uber level the four mentioned above all sound good

PS dCS, Linn and Naim all have onboard streaming cards and accept Ethernet input. The DAVE does not. For me this has always been the downside of Chord products. Ethernet is acknowledged to be the better transmission protocol over USB, Optical and S/PDIF. Less tomfoolery with different cable quality, requirement for external streamers etc.
Linn ONLY accepts ethernet, Naim and dCS openly state their preference for it as well

 

[Articnoise]

We listen to our records true a system and its always the weakest part of the chain that degrades the sound the most. A balanced audio system is the best.

Also the DAC is not the first or the only important source device. A good server or streamer/renderer is equally important IMO.

 

[chesebert]

Let's just say the Rossini/Clock now resides in my Naim 552/500 system and the Klimax DS has been "demoted" to the headphone system.

I compared the Bartok to the Linn in my headphone system and did not use the Bartok's internal headphone amplifier. Both Bartok and Linn were run through the HeadAmp GSX Mini into Utopia's with Kimber Axios cable. So it was strictly a DAC vs. DAC comparison. On a scale of 100 I found the Bartok a 95 vs. the Linn at 100. With the Bartok at $15k vs. Linn at $24k that almost seems to be a giant killer to me. It is what gave me the courage to try out the Rossini.

I have a good friend who has been doing this longer than I have who OWNED a Naim ND555, Linn KDS, Chord DAVE and now Rossini/Clock all at the same time (he is an addict!). Different from the typical punter who only demos and does not own for any length of time. My friend is now starting to prune and sell off. He will be keeping the Rossini/Clock for use in his system. His ranking was Rossini > Naim/Linn (tie) > DAVE

With that said when you get to this Uber level the four mentioned above all sound good

PS dCS, Linn and Naim all have onboard streaming cards and accept Ethernet input. The DAVE does not. For me this has always been the downside of Chord products. Ethernet is acknowledged to be the better transmission protocol over USB, Optical and S/PDIF. Less tomfoolery with different cable quality, requirement for external streamers etc.
Linn ONLY accepts ethernet, Naim and dCS openly state their preference for it as well

Nice! Thanks. I think Akurate DS (2018) for around $10k is probably the deal among Linn streamers. I have heard Naim ND555 and liked it quite a bit, but haven't had a chance to hear the newer dCS streamers.

 

[Jon773]

To audition with the Bartok I would recommend:

Hifiman HE1000 SE
Focal Stellia
Focal Utopia

I own the first two and have borrowed the Utopia's to use in my Bartok.

They all sound fantastic.

 

[Jon773]

Also, just to remind folks this is a dCS Bartok thread and not a high end DAC comparison thread, unless its a comparison to the Bartok of course

 

[CreditingKarma]

Also, just to remind folks this is a dCS Bartok thread and not a high end DAC comparison thread, unless its a comparison to the Bartok of course

Well you must know about my posts in the Chord thread comparing the Bartok to the Dave and TT2. Mr. Watts did not like that too much.

 

[Frankie D]

Well you must know about my posts in the Chord thread comparing the Bartok to the Dave and TT2. Mr. Watts did not like that too much.

Which was your favorite?

 

[CreditingKarma]

Which was your favorite?

I think the fact that I own the Bartok speaks for it self.

 

[FangJoker]

If anyone is looking to buy the Bartok new, I'd advise them to check Audiogon or other sites that have used high end audio gear for sale because sometimes you'll find outstanding deals by sellers who are motivated to sell quickly. I was allowed to cancel my Bartok order because I had also purchased a pair of Wilson Sasha DAW from the store for my listening room in my new home so they still made a lot of money on my speaker purchase.

I had found a used dCS Vivaldi for sale for 15k on audiogon while I was waiting for the Bartok to arrive so I pulled the trigger on it an hour later after I called the shop and asked them if it was ok to cancel the bartok order that they had to order as they did not have it on stock and they understood that I had gotten a once in a lifetime steal. I was sure that I might have to pay a restocking fee if I wasn't buying the speakers or anything else from them.I'm just glad it worked out and they were able to sell the Bartok not too long after they got it. I felt bad having to cancel a product that they had to order, but that Vivaldi was way under the MSRP {$36k) and it wasn't that much more than the price of a new Bartok so I had to take advantage of the seller wanting a fast sale because his prices were lower than half of the MSRP price. He was selling his whole Vivaldi stack for way under MSRP price, but I only wanted the dac and he sold the rest of the Vivaldi stack in two days as they were also priced at insanely low prices.

So I'd advise to check the used market if you're ok with buying used. Most of the used audio gear on audiogon are higher end equipment that cost a lot new so they are well treated. It doesn't hurt to check other sites for people selling high end audio equipment for much lower than the new price. Most prices are still too high for barely used gear, but there are always people who need money and price it to move quickly so there are really good deals to be had. I was the second person that inquired about purchasing the DAC, but the first person who contacted him wanted a week to come up with the money and I was ready to send money via a wire transfer right away so the seller sold it to me. I never imagined I could afford the Vivaldi DAC which is why I was ok buying the Bartok so yeah I was excited about getting the Vivaldi. I just wish I had the money to also buy the the Vivaldi upsampler which reviews say is a must buy especially if you have a great DAC. I'll get it for sure after i close a few more real estate transactions this year.

 

[Jon773]

Question for our Bartok owners on the forum...

Which of you are using a music server/library with your Bartok and did you find there to be any improvement in sound quality over say just using a NAS via an ethernet switch?

I had a nice improvement in sound from using an EE 8Switch, but was wondering if an Innuos or Melco unit brings anything else to the setup.

 

[pauljenkins]

Question for our Bartok owners on the forum...

Which of you are using a music server/library with your Bartok and did you find there to be any improvement in sound quality over say just using a NAS via an ethernet switch?

I had a nice improvement in sound from using an EE 8Switch, but was wondering if an Innuos or Melco unit brings anything else to the setup.

I too was interested in the melco switch to go with my bartok so I contacted dcs and this was their reply

James Cook (dCS)

1 Feb 2021, 11:36 CET

Good morning Paul,

Thank you for contacting dCS. I am pleased to hear you are enjoying your Bartók so far!

When it comes to your network, the key point to consider is that you are striving for your network to be stable and reliable, not for it to sound good. Sound quality does not come into networking - only when the data arrives at the Bartók and has been through the final buffer stage does it become relevant. Audiophile network switches often introduce connectivity problems as they try to carry out network traffic management, blocking the traffic that your Bartók uses to communicate with your control device, such as an iPad - without introducing the sound quality improvements they claim to.

I would recommend a basic unmanaged network switch if you are looking to add one - the Netgear GS108 is a good example. The extra investment in your system would be much better spent elsewhere, such as on upgrading the cables in your system (with the exception of Ethernet) - or of course put towards a Rossini Clock to use with the Bartók, which would bring a significant jump in audio performance.

So I've ordered the Rossini Clock.......