[Chairman]

Hi everyone,
 
I'm kind of new to the whole headphone scene, and I've been reading a lot of threads and trying out different options.  I've decided on a pair of Beyerdynamic DT 880 Pros (250 ohm), but I've got a bunch of questions regarding DACs and amps that hopefully someone can shed some light on.
 
I'll be using the headphones mostly at a desktop computer, primarily for listening to music (mostly rock, classical, jazz, etc...not much hip hop or electronic), but also a little bit for gaming and for mixing.  I'll occasionally use them with an iPod, so something with a portable option like the FiiO E17 would be gravy, but not necessary since the headphones shouldn't be too hard to drive without one.  I'm having some issues picking the right hardware to get the job done.  My budget is around $250 for everything (except the cans).
 
So for the DAC, since I'll be doing a bit of gaming, would it be better to get a PCI soundcard that also does music well (if so, any recommendations?), and then get a dedicated headphone amp, or would something external like the Audioengine D1 or FiiO E9/E17 combo be better?
 
I've also got a set of Logitech Z5500 5.1 speakers that I'd like to use which can be connected via digital optical, coaxial, or direct via 3 3.5mm plugs, so it would be an added bonus if the DAC could support and improve the sound of the speakers as well.
 
As for the amp, I'd like something reliable that would complement the DT 880s well.  I don't know if tube might be better to add a bit of darkness and warmth to balance the brightness of the headphones, but then I hear there are lots of good solid state options...throw some recommendations at me please!
 
The last thing, I'm also looking to buy a USB audio interface for recording.  I've settled on the Focusrite Scarlett series, either the 2i2 or the 8i6.  I'm not great with the technical jargon, but from what I understand, these are ADCs but also have headphone amps intended for monitoring.  Would the Scarlett combined with a DAC bypass the need for a headphone amp completely, since I could just output my PC's audio through the Scarlett's headphone out? Or is that just a bad idea as far as audio quality goes? I think the headphone amp impedance is rated at <10 ohm, so should be fine with the 250 ohm DT 880s.
 
I'd really appreciate any help or suggestions with this...I really don't want to spend a bunch of money on something that doesn't make a noticeable difference in sound quality (though I'm sure any option is better than plugging directly into the sound on my motherboard).
 
Thanks!

 

[PurpleAngel]

Quote:

I'm kind of new to the whole headphone scene, and I've been reading a lot of threads and trying out different options.  I've decided on a pair of Beyerdynamic DT 880 Pros (250 ohm), but I've got a bunch of questions regarding DACs and amps that hopefully someone can shed some light on.
I'll be using the headphones mostly at a desktop computer, primarily for listening to music (mostly rock, classical, jazz, etc...not much hip hop or electronic), but also a little bit for gaming and for mixing.  I'll occasionally use them with an iPod, so something with a portable option like the FiiO E17 would be gravy, but not necessary since the headphones shouldn't be too hard to drive without one.  I'm having some issues picking the right hardware to get the job done.  My budget is around $250 for everything (except the cans).
So for the DAC, since I'll be doing a bit of gaming, would it be better to get a PCI soundcard that also does music well (if so, any recommendations?), and then get a dedicated headphone amp, or would something external like the Audioengine D1 or FiiO E9/E17 combo be better?
I've also got a set of Logitech Z5500 5.1 speakers that I'd like to use which can be connected via digital optical, coaxial, or direct via 3 3.5mm plugs, so it would be an added bonus if the DAC could support and improve the sound of the speakers as well.
As for the amp, I'd like something reliable that would complement the DT 880s well.  I don't know if tube might be better to add a bit of darkness and warmth to balance the brightness of the headphones, but then I hear there are lots of good solid state options...throw some recommendations at me please!
The last thing, I'm also looking to buy a USB audio interface for recording.  I've settled on the Focusrite Scarlett series, either the 2i2 or the 8i6.  I'm not great with the technical jargon, but from what I understand, these are ADCs but also have headphone amps intended for monitoring.  Would the Scarlett combined with a DAC bypass the need for a headphone amp completely, since I could just output my PC's audio through the Scarlett's headphone out? Or is that just a bad idea as far as audio quality goes? I think the headphone amp impedance is rated at <10 ohm, so should be fine with the 250 ohm DT 880s.
I'd really appreciate any help or suggestions with this...I really don't want to spend a bunch of money on something that doesn't make a noticeable difference in sound quality (though I'm sure any option is better than plugging directly into the sound on my motherboard).

Asus Xonar DX (PCI-E) or D1 (PCI) sound card, used $67 (comes with CS4398 DAC chip) and get the Fiio E17 ($140) portable headphone amplifier.
Run three 3.5mm analog audio cables from the Xonar to the Z5500, I believe the Z5500 came with those cables.
And connect the E17 to the Xonar with optical
you can run headphone surround sound thru the Xonar's optical output.
The Xonar's also come with an analog microphone input.
 
So total around $207

 

[Chairman]

Quote:

Asus Xonar DX (PCI-E) or D1 (PCI) sound card, used $67 (comes with CS4398 DAC chip) and get the Fiio E17 ($140) portable headphone amplifier.
Run three 3.5mm analog audio cables from the Xonar to the Z5500, I believe the Z5500 came with those cables.
And connect the E17 to the Xonar with optical
you can run headphone surround sound thru the Xonar's optical output.
The Xonar's also come with an analog microphone input.
 
So total around $207

 


Thanks for the response, PurpleAngel.  I think I see what you're onto, but I just want to confirm.  Basically, for PC use I would be switching between the two DACs depending on my needs.  So to force headphone surround or output to the 5.1 speakers, I would be using the Xonar as the DAC and setting the output to the optical or analog out, respectively.  For listening to music in stereo, I would use the E17 as the DAC and output via the E17.  Does that make sense?
 
Also, am I right in assuming that the Xonar is a better DAC for movies/games, while the E17 is a better DAC for music?
 
Thanks again.

 

[PurpleAngel]

Quote:

 


Thanks for the response, PurpleAngel.  I think I see what you're onto, but I just want to confirm.  Basically, for PC use I would be switching between the two DACs depending on my needs.  So to force headphone surround or output to the 5.1 speakers, I would be using the Xonar as the DAC and setting the output to the optical or analog out, respectively.  For listening to music in stereo, I would use the E17 as the DAC and output via the E17.  Does that make sense?
 
Also, am I right in assuming that the Xonar is a better DAC for movies/games, while the E17 is a better DAC for music?

The Xonar DX is a great sound card with a nice CS4398 DAC (Digital to Analog Converter) chip, the Xonar's DAC is better then the DAC in the Z5500, so for better sound quality, you want to run analog from the Xonar DX to the Z5500.
If you use optical from the Xonar DX to the Z5500, your using the Z5500 DAC chip, the Z5500 DAC chip is not as good as the Xonar DX's, so connecting with analog is better.
The one negative for the Xoner DX is it not great for driving headphones and will only drive 250-Ohms (DT880) just a little louder then a whisper.
So you need a headphone amplifier to use with the Xonar DX  and you had talked about the E17 (need something to also use as portable amp. for use with iPod)
As the Xonar DX's headphone jack (front speaker jack) is being used by the Z5500 and the E17 has an optical input.
The E17 can be connected to the Xonar DX's optical output jack, which is not being used.
 
So it's not that one DAC is better then the other, they are both good DACs, equally good for movies, games, and music,
It just happens the setup I've talked about just works out that way.
 
One option you could do, is not get the Fiio E17 and just get the Fiio E11 ($65) and plug it into the computer's cases front headphone jack.
You would be using the Xonar DX's DAC and driving the headphones with the E11.
The Xonar DX can output Dolby Headphone 5.1 surround sound thru the computer's front headphone jack.
 
As the cable that runs inside the computer from the Xonar DX "internal" headphone connector to the front headphone jack, it might pick up the computer internal electrical noise (maybe).
 
Hope this explains it better my idea for your setup.

 

[Chairman]

Quote:

The Xonar DX is a great sound card with a nice CS4398 DAC (Digital to Analog Converter) chip, the Xonar's DAC is better then the DAC in the Z5500, so for better sound quality, you want to run analog from the Xonar DX to the Z5500.
If you use optical from the Xonar DX to the Z5500, your using the Z5500 DAC chip, the Z5500 DAC chip is not as good as the Xonar DX's, so connecting with analog is better.
The one negative for the Xoner DX is it not great for driving headphones and will only drive 250-Ohms (DT880) just a little louder then a whisper.
So you need a headphone amplifier to use with the Xonar DX  and you had talked about the E17 (need something to also use as portable amp. for use with iPod)
As the Xonar DX's headphone jack (front speaker jack) is being used by the Z5500 and the E17 has an optical input.
The E17 can be connected to the Xonar DX's optical output jack, which is not being used.
 
So it's not that one DAC is better then the other, they are both good DACs, equally good for movies, games, and music,
It just happens the setup I've talked about just works out that way.
 
One option you could do, is not get the Fiio E17 and just get the Fiio E11 ($65) and plug it into the computer's cases front headphone jack.
You would be using the Xonar DX's DAC and driving the headphones with the E11.
The Xonar DX can output Dolby Headphone 5.1 surround sound thru the computer's front headphone jack.
 
As the cable that runs inside the computer from the Xonar DX "internal" headphone connector to the front headphone jack, it might pick up the computer internal electrical noise (maybe).
 
Hope this explains it better my idea for your setup.

Thanks again for all the help.  I think I'm going to stick with the Xonar DX/E17 combo.  My last question is, if I'm using the optical out of the Xonar into the E17, and then listening through the E17 with headphones, is it the Xonar or the E17 that's doing the DAC work?

 

[PurpleAngel]

Quote:

Thanks again for all the help.  I think I'm going to stick with the Xonar DX/E17 combo.  My last question is, if I'm using the optical out of the Xonar into the E17, and then listening through the E17 with headphones, is it the Xonar or the E17 that's doing the DAC work?

You would be using the E17 WM8740 DAC chip
optical carries a digital audio signal
So, a digital analog signal is pre-DAC, an analog audio signal is post DAC.