[ckoffend]

First - I am very new to headphone systems but am fairly well experienced in "outloud" audio systems.

I am trying to determine whether it makes sense to go with a DAC/Headphone amp (with volume control) one-piece device makes sense. The background is based on:
#1: I would use a Cambridge Audio Azur hard drive based system (this I already own) and would want to know whether the DAC in the aforementioned, requested devices would be better the the mediocre DAC in the Cambridge?
#2: I would use a Slim Devices Duet server based system (this I would have to buy, but am planning to do anyway for my main stereo system) and again would inquire about the DAC of the DAC/Amp combo in comparison to the Slim Devices?
#3: Wadia 170I to the DAC/Amp device

I have owned or own several DACs for my audio system ranging from okay to pretty darn good, including the following: Cal Audio Alpha, Kora Hermes (love this DAC), EMM Labs DAC 6e (love this DAC) and a couple others and am considering also the following: Musical Fidelity TriVista 21 and/or a DCS. While I suspect the DAC/Amp combo will not be as good as the Trivista/DCS/EMM Labs, I am interested in knowing how good they are?

Thanks to anybody for their first hand experienced feedback and comparisons of the DAC/amp options for headphones.

 

[nd4speed]

Keep in mind that in contrast to speakers, headphones are like microscopes looking into your system; you will hear differences in component selection much more readily in a headphone setup. The DACs you've mentioned won't hold a candle to a DCS IMO. You have to decide whether the simplicity and cost savings will outweigh the improved sound quality.

 

[HeadphoneAddict]

It depends on your price range. You can get a nice Headroom headphone amp with integrated DAC at www.headphone.com and not need a separate DAC, but if you want this DAC to feed your speaker system you will have to use the headphone out as a "pre-amp" out.

I would recommend their separate DACs like the Micro DAC or Ultra Micro DAC - and then you can feed it USB, Optical or Coax digital (like from the Squeezebox or Wadia), and feed the line out into any amp or home audio receiver.

 

[iNiGFx]

DAC1 or DA10

 

[DARKHAVEN]

Quote:

Originally Posted by iNiGFx /img/forum/go_quote.gif DAC1 or DA10

x2. Without a doubt, Benchmark makes one of the better DACs on the market, completely worth while. Some believe the amp is not up to pair with their incredible DAC, but I think its pretty darn good. For an all-in-one solution, I think you'll be happy with a DAC1.

 

[ckoffend]

What about something like the Grace M902, anybody familiar with this? This seems like it is a good product, but have not found too many personal opinions and comparisons.

My concern with the Benchmark is that it seems a bit dry/analytical/almost bright and I think based on the rest of my system being highly resolving, this may be too much for it. Initially, my thoughts were the Benchmark (I do admit I have not listened to one yet), but I have seen a lot of comments about it lean nature and felt that this may not be a good fit in my system.

 

[FallenAngel]

You will always get better value and performance by going separate.

 

[Sherwood]

Quote:

Originally Posted by FallenAngel /img/forum/go_quote.gif You will always get better value and performance by going separate.

Performance, maybe, but certainly NOT value. A certain portion of every product is overhead, casing, shipping, etc. Combined products do away with all of these extras.

Considering the DACs you've had to date, I have to recommend top-tier products like the DAC1 and the Grace m902 at a bare minimum. Having heard both (at meets) I really recommend the grace over the Dac1. One of our most prolific members uses it exclusively, and it's a mint.

 

[FallenAngel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sherwood /img/forum/go_quote.gif Performance, maybe, but certainly NOT value. A certain portion of every product is overhead, casing, shipping, etc. Combined products do away with all of these extras. Considering the DACs you've had to date, I have to recommend top-tier products like the DAC1 and the Grace m902 at a bare minimum. Having heard both (at meets) I really recommend the grace over the Dac1. One of our most prolific users members it exclusively, and it's a mint.

Most certainly value. There are a few good DACs with terrible headphone amps (which I would recommend as a nice standalone DAC) and there are lots of headphone amps with integrated cheap DACs (no better than a $50 AlienDAC). I haven't seen any DAC+Amp combinations that weren't either a cheap DAC and OK/good headphone amp or good DAC with cheap amp.

 

[Sherwood]

Quote:

Originally Posted by FallenAngel /img/forum/go_quote.gif Most certainly value. There are a few good DACs with terrible headphone amps (which I would recommend as a nice standalone DAC) and there are lots of headphone amps with integrated cheap DACs (no better than a $50 AlienDAC). I haven't seen any DAC+Amp combinations that weren't either a cheap DAC and OK/good headphone amp or good DAC with cheap amp.

You don't seem to make any differentiation between "value" and "performance" here.

I don't categorically agree with your claim that there are no good DAC/AMP combos. I think the abovementioned grace m902 and the DAC1, the Apogee minidac, the Meier Opera, the HeadRoom Desktop, and perhaps others that don't come to mind all serve both purposes very well, and none of them have a DAC or amp that would generally be described as "cheap". That's not even mentioning the whole slew of portable DAC/amps that are totally unserved by the separates market, save the microdac, which is hardly a "value" considering that it can only pair to a handful of harddisc DAPs.

So where, exactly, is the value in separates. The argument for their performance is valid, but separates are necessarily redundant in many ways, and redundancy never equals value.

Those five up there are good choices, OP, but the Grace is my favorite.