[Triode User]

Hello All,

Help Needed !

I have been trying PGGB with the K50 Roon HQP and via MPD with the Bubble App, Antipodes DNLA (library), K50player (renderer) .

Although PGGB MPD does have the edge over Roon HQP neither of options stacked up against the Mscaler with any software playback.

NOTE: PGGB uses USB (Chord Music USB cable) and Mscaler uses BNC (Wave Storm Cables x 3) which may be the difference ?

I did not try USB PGGB vs USB Dave Mscaler, I know the sound of USB Dave Mscaler and clearly prefer the SQ than USB PGGB.
Anyway, I compared my preferred SQ, BNC vs the best I could do with PGGB. I know you can dual BNC with PGGB but the difference was so much perhaps not worth considering.

With PGGB the sound was flat no Bass, lack of detail, narrow sound stage I could go on but basically could not listen, something is wrong.

PGGB was set to Natural-Moderate-Moderate while upscaling. I checked all the settings when paying, all correct and Dave was reporting 705 or 768 depending on the track via USB.

Note: Squeeze, downscales the files so gave up on that quickly.

The difference is NO small margin but gave it a while for brain adjust, played last night and again this morning with still the same result.
I am certain the settings on the PGGB will not be strong enough to change the sound.

Since several of you are having good results I am surprised I am having such poor SQ.

Can anyone send me some files for me to try?

PM me and will send a link where you can upload them to.

Thanks

Clive,

You are not really comparing apples to apples.

By using USB out from the K50 to the Dave for the PGGB you are getting a different sound quality anyway compared to K50 connected by BNC (Wave) to Mscaler which is then connected by dual BNC (Wave) to Dave.

Many of us using PGGB are now using USB from K50 to SRC-DX usb to dual BNC convertor and then connect from that to Dave via dual BNC.

That way you bypass the Amanero usb input chip in the Dave and what is exactly what you are doing in your Mscaler set up (the Mscaler uses the same usb input chip which you are again avoiding by using the BNC input on the Mscaler.

I can send you an SRC-DX to borrow if you like. You would connect it to the Dave using the dual Storm cables that you already have. When you use PGGB with the SRC.DX you need to process them set to 24 bit output bit depth because of course BNC only supports 24bit.

The other thing to suggest waiting for is the 3.1 upgrade to the K50 at the end of this month which will allow you to use the latest versions of Squeezelite which can play the 705 / 768 files so you would be directly comparing with the Squeezelite player that you are using with the Mscaler.

These are the PGGB settings that I use when outputting via the SRC.DX

 

[magnuska]

Hi Am new to this forum but have used Antipodes EX and now S40 so I thought I would chime in with
thoughts.
When I had the EX it was as a roon player only. Using the Innuos ZEN mini mk3 as Roon server. This sounded good but I was thinking if the Aqua linq would not be a better player, doubtfully it was. Maybe a little better than my EX. I then was offered to trade the Linq for the new S40. I had sold my Innuos. So now I used my S40 as Roon server and player all in one with only the supplied Anipodes SMPS. The new Oladra program is so good that my S40 alone beat my prior dual set up. What is typical I think is its great musicality , dynamics and speed.
A fellow at Audiogon sold his CX in favour of the new S30.

 

[cczero17]

Hi Am new to this forum but have used Antipodes EX and now S40 so I thought I would chime in with
thoughts.
When I had the EX it was as a roon player only. Using the Innuos ZEN mini mk3 as Roon server. This sounded good but I was thinking if the Aqua linq would not be a better player, doubtfully it was. Maybe a little better than my EX. I then was offered to trade the Linq for the new S40. I had sold my Innuos. So now I used my S40 as Roon server and player all in one with only the supplied Anipodes SMPS. The new Oladra program is so good that my S40 alone beat my prior dual set up. What is typical I think is its great musicality , dynamics and speed.
A fellow at Audiogon sold his CX in favour of the new S30.

So OLDRA updated CX/EX should sound stellar then

 

[magnuska]

So OLDRA updated CX/EX should sound stellar then

Yes I´m sure they will

 

[Clive101]

Clive,

You are not really comparing apples to apples.

By using USB out from the K50 to the Dave for the PGGB you are getting a different sound quality anyway compared to K50 connected by BNC (Wave) to Mscaler which is then connected by dual BNC (Wave) to Dave.

Many of us using PGGB are now using USB from K50 to SRC-DX usb to dual BNC convertor and then connect from that to Dave via dual BNC.

That way you bypass the Amanero usb input chip in the Dave and what is exactly what you are doing in your Mscaler set up (the Mscaler uses the same usb input chip which you are again avoiding by using the BNC input on the Mscaler.

I can send you an SRC-DX to borrow if you like. You would connect it to the Dave using the dual Storm cables that you already have. When you use PGGB with the SRC.DX you need to process them set to 24 bit output bit depth because of course BNC only supports 24bit.

The other thing to suggest waiting for is the 3.1 upgrade to the K50 at the end of this month which will allow you to use the latest versions of Squeezelite which can play the 705 / 768 files so you would be directly comparing with the Squeezelite player that you are using with the Mscaler.

These are the PGGB settings that I use when outputting via the SRC.DX

Hello Nick,

Thank you for your input. I will wait for all the upgraded software and PM you for the SRC-DX USB as the new software is about to be released. Very kind of you to offer me a loaner.
Even so there is still a USB in the equation with the SRC-DX USB.

It suggests to me that the K50 to Dave or Dave Mscaler is far better with BNC than USB which is my experience ...so anyone purchasing a K30 try to stretch for a K50
which to me seems better valve as you save on cables etc and a S20. When I demoed both I tried the K50 with the BNC and could not go back to the K30, with the S versions try a S20.

To me the BNC to Dave or Dave Mscaler makes a very big improvement better than PGGB as tested in my earlier post but as you not the same comparison.

"The other thing to suggest waiting for is the 3.1 upgrade to the K50 at the end of this month which will allow you to use the latest versions of Squeezelite which can play the 705 / 768 files so you would be directly comparing with the Squeezelite player that you are using with the Mscaler."

So, K50 Roon (server) to Squeeze (player) PGGB (24 bit 705 / 768 Files) with a single BNC to Dave from the K50 would work ? If so even a closer comparison.

Looking forward to the new Antipodes software and trying the SRC-DX USB loaner

 

[Triode User]

So, K50 Roon (server) to Squeeze (player) PGGB (24 bit 705 / 768 Files) with a single BNC to Dave from the K50 would work ? If so even a closer comparison.

No. For 705 and 768kHz you need the dual BNC, hence where the SRC.DX comes in with its dual bnc output.

 

[Clive101]

No. For 705 and 768kHz you need the dual BNC, hence where the SRC.DX comes in with its dual bnc output.

Oh I see, shame but Squeeze will do it on USB which helps but not exactly as my Dave Mscaler set up

No wonder why I prefer the K50 BNC vs the SGM Taiko Extreme USB

 

[kennyb123]

The new Oladra program is so good that my S40 alone beat my prior dual set up. What is typical I think is its great musicality , dynamics and speed.
A fellow at Audiogon sold his CX in favour of the new S30.

Welcome and thanks for sharing these interesting insights.

 

[cczero17]

Welcome and thanks for sharing these interesting insights.

Wouldn't it have been cheaper to upgrade a CX, which would also outperform an S40? Seems a step backwards to me

 

[magnuska]

Wouldn't it have been cheaper to upgrade a CX, which would also outperform an S40? Seems a step backwards to me

Yes maybe, this is the big Q. CX( upgraded)and S40 should be quite similar apart from the built in powersupply in the CX. An S40 with added powersupply either S60 or another brand is in a newer smaller case if one likes that. I think the hybrid S60 powersupply beats the inbuilt one in the CX for example. This is tough descision and I guess Antipodes have given upgrade prices a lot of thought before.

 

[atya35mm]

I had mentioned waiting to hear about the Mk3 upgrade from Innuos. I grew impatient so just purchased a Mk3 and then sold the Mk2. I mentioned this because the main difference between the two is the power supply. It was a significant upgrade so that makes me think the power supply plays a big part in a server’s sound quality. So I’d be inclined to go with S30 + S60 over S40 alone. But best to confirm with Antipodes.

Where the S40 would have the edge might be if you wanted to ditch the Nucleus. Low noise matters a lot on the server side too - as do power supplies. Since you aren’t doing DSP, the S30 might be powerful enough to run Roon core. A little extra horsepower there might help though especially if you have a large music library.

I have found Mark Cole of Antipodes to be an awesome resource. That’s another advantage one gets with Antipodes over the other two brands you mentioned. Mark is helpful both before and after the sale, so definitely run it by him.

Have you heard of PGGB yet? This does offline upsampling using a similar philosophy to MScaler. Hearing this was a big reason I moved to Antipodes as it gave me a few different playback options. I think you might be stunned by the improvement PGGB brings providing you run your server directly into your DAVE. More here: https://www.remastero.com/

I actually sold my MScaler to help fund the purchase of my K30. The lift from doing that was worth every penny and then some. When streaming I will use HQPlayer to scale. While it alone doesn’t bring as great a lift as MScaler, the lift from a better music server left me not missing MScaler at all. Just some food for thought.

Well thanks to your input and others here, I have an incoming used K30/S20! Looking forward to trying all the server / player app possibilities in the antipodes line. Should be a huge jump in SQ from using the Roon Nucleus direct to DAC.

From all the reading, I'll connect from S20 to m-scaler via single BNC cable. Looks to be the best option from Clive and Triode User's testing.

 

[Clive101]

Well thanks to your input and others here, I have an incoming used K30/S20! Looking forward to trying all the server / player app possibilities in the antipodes line. Should be a huge jump in SQ from using the Roon Nucleus direct to DAC.

From all the reading, I'll connect from S20 to m-scaler via single BNC cable. Looks to be the best option from Clive and Triode User's testing.

ASK for a demo K 50 and beg for a discount you might get lucky

 

[atya35mm]

ASK for a demo K 50 and beg for a discount you might get lucky

I tried! no luck!

 

[kennyb123]

I tried! no luck!

I have a feeling that those demo K50s rarely, if ever, make it back to them.

 

[Bling23]

I thought I would start a thread were Antipodes owners could discuss tips and tricks.

Great Idea