[Spyro]

Do they altar the sound too much?  Should they only be used for severe problem fit people?
 
I have UM56 custom tips which fit perfectly.  I notice that they seem to push the sound more forward and things DO seem more vivid and more detailed.   But it also sort of exaggerates the inclusive or already intimate sound of an IEM even more.  With standard tips the soundstage seems larger or more spacious.
 
I think the reason for this is that in the case of custom IEM's the nozzle is already an extension of the housing so the soundstage would seem unaffected or more natural.  If you stick a custom tip on a 1/4" universal nozzle, 2 negative things happen.  1) the total nozzle length becomes twice as long.... and... 2) the much deeper insertion of the custom tip puts the exit hole much closer to the eardrum extremely limiting the "spacious" aspect of the soundstage.  It's a more "tunnelish" sound for lack of a better term and I think it's more fatiguing. 
 
I have been using UM56 tips on my Westone Pro50's and it surely made everything more vivid and detailed but fatiguing too.  I put the silicone "star" tips back on and while a hair less detailed and vivid, the sound is more spacious and relaxed/less fatiguing.
 
I think it is very short-sighted to claim custom tips automatically make any universal IEM better. 
 
Does this make sense or can anyone validate my claims above?    Certainly we are talking tradeoffs and personal preferences here as well.

 

[castleofargh]

it's comfort first. then some people (me me me me me!!!!!!) have a real trouble getting a proper fit with the most common silicon tips. and as we all know, without a proper fit, very few IEMs will sound ok. so in that sense, it can dramatically improve the sound to have a proper fit(by whatever mean necessary).
 
then there are custom tips, and custom tips. as soon as the mold tip will change the distance between the driver and the eardrum, we can expect some changes(good or bad). so a proper custom tip in my mind would be one that doesn't change where the IEM is in your ear.

 

[Flinx]

I would love to see some more input from folks here----I'm struggling with a similar decision.  I bought a pair of Fidue A83s recently and I'm struggling with the fit.  I ended up buying a variety pack of T400s from Comply and have found the Comfort tip to work the best, but it is still a bit uncomfortable at times.  I am debating on custom tips, but would really love to see more feedback, first.  
 
Thanks.

 

[Ari33]

Flinx- I guess its mainly down to the largest two variables.. our own individual ears and our personal taste in sound signiture. We all have different sized and shaped ears and ear canals which to an extent will likely provide different results for different people... not to mention how a custom tip might change the sound sig of a given iem either towards or away from ones own sound sig preference. 
 
I dont think others opinions would offer much help. I think its something you have to try for yourself and see if it improves things for you...

 

[Flinx]

Ari33,
 
Thanks.  I think you're spot on, but this isn't something I can demo.  Impressions (ha, no pun intended), good or bad, give me some idea of what I'm getting into.  I hate to say it, but the most comfortable earphones I've ever been able to find are the cheap Sony ones that cost $15.  That works for me because I use them for exercising and if I trash them with sweat, no harm done.  I have gone through two sets of those and one set of water resistant Phillips.  The Phillips truly sounded horrible, while the Sony's are great entry level earphones, especially for converting someone from stock earphones.  They will either thank you or curse you. : )
 
If most people come out and say the custom tips make them sound like listening through a paper towel roll, I've got a better idea than I have now.  I thought about reshelling, but from what I've read, unless it's a model that has been done many times by a company, the tuning my be hit or miss and you void your warranty on top of it.  The last thing I want to find out if I buy custom tips is that I can her the ocean when I put them in my ears.

 

[Spyro]

Everyone's personal fit aside, my opinion is that with anyone....while custom tips may provide more vivid detail, the soundstage is smaller and midrange is pushed forward making the sound more tunnelish.  Custom tips are NOT an automatic improvement by any means.

 

[castleofargh]

  Everyone's personal fit aside, my opinion is that with anyone....while custom tips may provide more vivid detail, the soundstage is smaller and midrange is pushed forward making the sound more tunnelish.  Custom tips are NOT an automatic improvement by any means.

could also be an after effect of listening at lower volume level from the improved isolation? just a theory, I really don't know. but losing soundstage and getting more mids, it sounds to me like when you lower the volume level. but the tips could also just change the signature and have all those effects. hard to tell.

 

[AstralStorm]

Any tip change can also change:
- insertion depth, moving resonances around, which can also change their height - deeper insertion, ear canal/shell resonances go higher in frequency and flatter, until they disappear completely - due to reduced air volume remaining in ears. There are also interference effects to contend with.
- soundstaging - generally more in-your-head and fuzzy on localization when deeper, but fixed with a stereo-to-binaural effect or even crossfeed. Linked to changes in ear canal resonances - does not happen with earphones designed for deep insertion such as most customs and few other. (all Etymotic, a few IEMs based on Knowles TWFK come to mind)
- exit diameter - narrower causes lowpass and increased acoustic impedance
- horn or reverse horn effect - different behavior usually around 2-4 kHz, 12 dB end to end even
 
The main trouble with custom tips is actually getting them made for anything that's deep fit or that has a special barrel/tip mount - and that they will have undefined insertion depth which cannot be changed. Even targeting something like "reference plane" is not quite possible given only an impression and not an x-ray picture. You can often guess right, but that is not certain.
And in-ears are designed for various insertion depths or rather residual ear canal volumes.
 
Custom tips tend to have neither horn nor reverse horn effect.

 

[Flinx]

Thanks for the insight. The A83s don't see to be meant for deep insertion---I think I will ask an audiologist if it is possible to make custom tip that only goes in as far as a universal tip, just with a perfect seal with no pressure on the inner ear. I love the sound of these but hate the pain.

 

[krismusic]

By all means check with an audiologist but I would think you would need fairly deep insertion to get a deal with a custom tip.
I have used and enjoyed custom tips on my IE8's for years and am about to buy some CIEM's.
It is a very intimate way to listen to music. I embrace that.
I don't know if a UIEM with well fitting standard tips would sound better.
I do know that customs are more enjoyable than badly fitting tips!

 

[Flinx]

I went to an audiologist today and had impressions made.  He checked out my ear canals first and talk about asymmetry-----my left ear canal is much smaller than my right and has a funny bend.  Definitely why I was feeling so much discomfort.  He agreed that a custom tip was really my best option, so I ordered a set.  I'll post my findings once I get them.

 

[Flinx]

I got them and while I haven't worn them for more than an hour at a time, the comfort is great. No pain. Sound is good, but I need to do some more critical listening before I can a more defintive response.

 

[krismusic]

Sounds promising. Let's hope that's the end of the problem and you can get on with enjoying your music.

 

[Flinx]

I am calling this a win. I enjoy the sound and while I may have taken a slight hit in the high end, the lack of pain makes up for it. This still remain outstanding sounding earphones. The tips also for my old UE Super.fi 4s, so I use those for excercise.

 

[krismusic]

Good stuff. Enjoy your music!