[mbyrnes]

Emotiva makes some good low cost speakers. Direct to buyer so no middle man. The Chane speakers are great as well. If you like building things, check out diysoundgroup.com. I've built speakers from here and they are a ridiculous deal. You pay for the cost of the parts per kit. A designer created the speaker and gave the crossovers out for free.

No better way to spend money on an insane pair of speakers.

 

[VeerK]

Did you ever get around to doing that Momby v X7 showdown?

 

[mbyrnes]

Within the next few weeks. Just had major back surgery and waiting for the pain to calm down. Then I'll have nothing better to do with my time but Head-fi stuff, lol. It's coming soon.

 

[Guest12345]

Then I would recommend you look into the following speakers

Passive speakers - if you intend to power speakers from the X7 5 way binding posts, preferably using banana plugs.

Klipsch RP150M - the RP160Ms smaller brother. i'm talking 2" smaller in every dimension, even then they are still big.
Monitor Audio Bronze 1&2
Chane A1rx-c [ now referred to as the A-1.4]
Wharfdale Diamond 220 the Diamond 10.1 are worth a look too.
JBL Studio 230
JBL Studio 530

Active powered speakers, these have a built in amp, so the amp of the X7 won't be doing any heavy lifting.
Vanatoo Transparent one - the transparent zero is worth a look too from what I hear.
Yamaha HS5 or 7 -[ FYI these are studio monitors].
Emotiva Airmotiv 6

Thanks for the suggestions, @Digitalis. It's given me some speakers to look at and start reading up on. Hopefully I'll be able to put together a shortlist of speakers including the Klipsch you suggested to demo in the future (and hopefully be happy with one of them). Thank you as well @mbyrnes.

The first thing I need to do is to understand how speaker amplification works - I'm getting a bit confused reading what's out there. I know that the standard Creative X7 provides 27W per channel @ 8 ohms. A little bit more with the upgraded power supply, I know that.

A question regarding the amplification requirements - for example, in the Monitor Audio line, the Bronze 2 amplification requirements are 30-100W, 8ohm speakers (sensitivity 90dB 1W @ 1M). The Silver 2 amplification requirements are 40-120W, 8ohm speakers (sensitivity 88dB 1W @ 1M). Will the X7 be able to power these passive speakers adequately? Or will it be a borderline experience with regards to volume?

Alternatively, the Dynaudio emit M10 and M20 look pretty nice as well... do you reckon that the X7 will be able to run these?

So many questions, so much to read up on!

Thanks in advance,
Ed

 

[mbyrnes]

If you're looking at speakers that nice, look at Emotiva for a stereo amp. The X7 has RCA outs for an amp. Emotiva carries some low entry cost 100W/channel amps. Can't recommend them enough. Don't waste your time with the better power supply for the X7. It's really for extreme close listening and with basic speakers.

I love Dynaudio and they need real power to shine. You'll spend less on an amp then I did my X7 op amp upgrade.

 

[Guest12345]

If you're looking at speakers that nice, look at Emotiva for a stereo amp. The X7 has RCA outs for an amp. Emotiva carries some low entry cost 100W/channel amps. Can't recommend them enough. Don't waste your time with the better power supply for the X7. It's really for extreme close listening and with basic speakers.

I love Dynaudio and they need real power to shine. You'll spend less on an amp then I did my X7 op amp upgrade.

Cheers, appreciate the advice!

Unfortunately, for my situation, there are two factors at play for me:
1) Desk space. I'm hoping to have as few components on my desk as possible, and free up desk space.
2) Cost of amps in Australia. We're a pretty small market here, so brand new items are expensive, and also comparatively fewer of these amps come onto the second hand market. I also live quite far away from the big cities of Melbourne and Sydney, so the scope for buying second hand stuff is even more reduced. I'll keep an eye out though, that's for sure.

Alright, so there are three choices ahead of me that I can see.
1) Go demo the recommendations both yourself and Digitalis gave to me. I'm sure I will find something I'll like that can be powered by the X7. Also, I'll keep my eyes open for other speakers at an affordable price.
2) Shift my focus and look for active speakers. Any suggestions of powered speakers pretty much in the same ballpark as the speakers that have been suggested?
3) Wait until something nice comes onto the market, that can be powered by the X7.

Any thoughts on great (active) speakers that I could consider looking at?

 

[Digitalis]

I did a bit of reading on the Dynaudio M10's and I nearly spat out my coffee when I read this line..."mated to a 1st order crossover utilizing high-quality components." At that price point these speakers sell for, they could at least go for a second order crossover [-6dB per-octave slope]. What the crossover controls is where the tweeter overtakes the larger woofer driver - woofers have a limited capacity for producing high frequencies. Depending on their size, construction material and design. Also crossovers prevent the tweeter from distortion and over excursion by shunting low frequencies away from it and directing them to the woofer. It is a matter of academic debate on how high and cleanly a 14cm driver can go before its response becomes non-lnear or where cone break up becomes audible however, the general consensus is around 1.5~2.5Khz.

Also I'm an Aussie - I can give you some pointers to reputable Australian based suppliers, with decent prices.

 

[Digitalis]

Any thoughts on great (active) speakers that I could consider looking at?

JBL LSR 305 are very popular powered monitors, however being cheap means there is a lot of plastic used in the construction of their cabinets and visually, the cabinets are butt ugly. But they are said to be good sounding and affordable for what they are. Average price here in Australia is circa $450AUD for a pair.

A better looking competitor to the JBL are the Yamaha HS5 monitors, which fit in a similar price bracket and have cabinets which are made of sturdier materials. The Yamaha HS5 sell for around $500AUD for a pair.

 

[Guest12345]

I did a bit of reading on the Dynaudio M10's and I nearly spat out my coffee when I read this line..."mated to a 1st order crossover utilizing high-quality components." At that price point these speakers sell for, they could at least go for a second order crossover [-6dB per-octave slope]. What the crossover controls is where the tweeter overtakes the larger woofer driver - woofers have a limited capacity for producing high frequencies. Depending on their size, construction material and design. Also crossovers prevent the tweeter from distortion and over excursion by shunting low frequencies away from it and directing them to the woofer. It is a matter of academic debate on how high and cleanly a 14cm driver can go before its response becomes non-lnear or where cone break up becomes audible however, the general consensus is around 1.5~2.5Khz.

Also I'm an Aussie - I can give you some pointers to reputable Australian based suppliers, with decent prices.

Oooh, that's great, thank you! So you know where I'm coming from - what limitations there are in our market.

It's good you talked about the crossovers, I would have just gone with whatever sounded good to my ears without knowing any better...

The Klipsch speakers you have, the 160M - are they speakers that need a lot of space around them to sound their best? I estimate about 20-30 centimeters between the rear of where the speakers are going to sit and the wall behind them.

Thanks for the extra suggestions - if the budget was to extend to say, $1000 - $1200, which active speakers would you suggest I have a look at? A little bit of me is wondering if I should save up for say half a year more and then buy a pair of passive KEF LS50s second hand.

Thanks, from Canberra

 

[Povell42]

Just got my LCD2's yesterday and have them hooked up straight to the X7 - no complaints at all.

That said - I haven't tried the LCD2's on any of the other amps yet so don't have a comparison.

The great thing about the X7 is the passthrough - if I ever find the X7 amp lacking with any of the headphones the SBX etc can be passed straight through to another amp or amp/dac combo (I run the HD800's this way)

Am almost ready to change out the OpAmps in the X7 to see if the gains are as good as mentioned too.

Overall I find the X7 an awesome bit of kit - only "annoyance" is the need to use the app to change any settings rather than onboard or a remote - with that though, I'm usually at the PC/desk where the unit is so it's only a slight one.

This weekend I was able to compare my Sound Blaster X7 vs. the Audeze Deckard (DAC/Amp combo) with my LCD-3. I was very surprised to find hardly any discernible difference. I tried several different songs with A/B testing on the two, and my ears could not tell a difference. Bass impact, detail, and sonic signature sounded practically identical to me.

So comparing the X7 to a $700 Audeze product... the X7 holds it's own pretty nicely. I was running the X7 in direct mode, no op amp upgrade or power brick upgrade either. I got my X7 used from amazon warehouse for $300. Less than half the price for very equivalent performance to a tailor made Audeze product. I was actually hoping to be blown away by the Deckard, yet came out feeling more confident in my X7.

I also have an Aune X7s amp and I sometime use it with my SB-X7 pre-out and it sounds even better. I now feel the DAC is very good in the SB-X7 and you would need to spend significantly more to get a DAC for noticeable upgrade (diminishing returns). Adding a class A amp with balanced output will be better than the amp inside the SB-X7. The Aune retails for $250, but its hard to find it for that price. I got mine for $290 on ebay (still under the price of the Audeze Deckard together)

Again, this may be specific to the LCD-3, but I think the LCD-2 would follow suit.

 

[Povell42]

Also, if I were to upgrade X7's op-amps.... would the change reflect in left/right output to a separate amp?

 

[mbyrnes]

Also, if I were to upgrade X7's op-amps.... would the change reflect in left/right output to a separate amp?

The op amp swap will have a universal effect on all outputs. It's what makes the op amp swap great.

 

[Digitalis]

Oooh, that's great, thank you! So you know where I'm coming from - what limitations there are in our market.

It's good you talked about the crossovers, I would have just gone with whatever sounded good to my ears without knowing any better...

If properly designed, a first order crossover on low powered speakers isn't inherently a bad thing - but it is a cheap wuss out move no matter how you slice it.

The Klipsch speakers you have, the 160M - are they speakers that need a lot of space around them to sound their best? I estimate about 20-30 centimeters between the rear of where the speakers are going to sit and the wall behind them.

Yes the RP-160M's need a fair amount of breathing room - i'm fortunate to be able to supply that. To be completely honest, the RP160s are a bit of overkill for the X7 amp..it is like hunting bunnies with claymore mines.

Thanks for the extra suggestions - if the budget was to extend to say, $1000 - $1200, which active speakers would you suggest I have a look at? A little bit of me is wondering if I should save up for say half a year more and then buy a pair of passive KEF LS50s second hand.

Thanks, from Canberra

The KEF LS50's are a coaxial speaker design - meaning the tweeter is set in the center of the woofer, this kind of set up introduces a litany of issues: basically putting a tweeter in the middle of a woofer like that is an inherently terrible place to put it. The biggest issue is that the woofer cone itself acts like a waveguide, the problem is that it is a moving waveguide: This can have negative effects upon the tweeters response when the woofer is approaching the limits of excursion.

If you budget is able to extend that far I'd point out what many audiophiles have said to me : spare no expense when getting your front right and left speakers, because you will be listening to them a lot hopefully. There is a greater variety of passive speakers out there, Active speakers tend to be more expensive due to the built in amplifiers.

* From what I have read KEF claim to have mitigated the worst of these issues, but I remain skeptical.

 

[EdgeOfDarkness]

Hello I'm new here. I was thinking about getting the X7 to use on my ps4. For the chat to work with it you need the BT-W2 bluetooth adapter? Does anyone know if it sends all audio over or could you still use the optical for game audio and just send chat over the bluetooth adapter?

 

[Yethal]

Hello I'm new here. I was thinking about getting the X7 to use on my ps4. For the chat to work with it you need the BT-W2 bluetooth adapter? Does anyone know if it sends all audio over or could you still use the optical for game audio and just send chat over the bluetooth adapter?

That's the way it's intended to be used. Chat over Bluetooth, game over optical.