Contemplation: Shure e500, Justice for Violins, Issue with Highs or my Newb Ears?
Aug 16, 2007 at 10:29 PM Thread Starter Post #1 of 63

D-Boy

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I just recently obtained my e500s from ebay. Very recent. If you want to just see my question go to the last paragraph, else the rest is background information building the base so that those with high experience might be able to troubleshoot for me.

I am not very experienced with amps and headphones but generally appreciate good sound. So in short words you can say I am probably still quite a novice in the head-fi community.

I try to become too influenced by other reviews and biased opinions causing myself to not judge directly with my bodily senses, in this case ears only. However, I'm not even sure what contributes to the so called "highs" that people refer to. To me I only take it as the higher frequencies, and it has become the common jargon when reviewing headphone sound quality. I'm assuming Bass Drums and lower response are the so called "lows", "highs" are vocals, parts of melody and mids are something in between (I'm least experienced with what exactly are the mids).

My music consists of some a lot of Trance, and Classical as well as some game music, Rock, and a little bit of pop.

My main concern right now is that the e500s really do not satisfy the highs for me. My reference is the Sennheiser HD555s through a Cmoy amp with burrbrown OP2134. The first time I listened to Pachebel's Canon in D by Palliard and Andre through my HD555s in lossless format through my Audigy 2 ZS or my iPod Nano Lineout with the Cmoy amp I could only explain that as the big O for my ears.

After getting the e500s, when I first put them on, although the clarity and isolation were noticeably apparently, I did not get the eye opener feeling I expected. I also have heard that the e500s don't really need burn in compared to other headphones/IEMs. I am using the yellow foams for a good fit and isolation. The main concern is this observation that the e500s has lacking highs... although this is the opinion of others and I assume the general idea is that "although the highs are a bit rolled off" it does not mean the highs are bad, they are still well represented. However, for me, compared to value headphones, HD555s, I find the e500s does not do "Justice for the Violins" in something like Pachebel's Canon in D. The bass is well defined and the mids, if i'm stating them correctly, are strong, but the violin which I'll correlate with highs are really lacking. The HD555s made the violins sound so alive and not blocked by anything. On the e500s the violins sound almost shoved into the background or just not as up front, instead, using my reference track, the Harp plucks are sharp, almost painful, the bass is well defined in and I can definitely focus on them and appreciate the smoothness of the bass. However no matter how I try to listen, I can't really feel that the Violins are being brought up front. I have tried putting the settings on Rockbox to add up to 5dBs of treble and it sounds slightly better but it's a bit artificial with equalizer treble input. I continued torture testing my headphones with my ears, and some of my vocal trance didn't give me the impression of "wow her voice is beautiful" or the upfront feeling of trailing high notes in anything including screaming high notes from Toshi on my X-Japan tracks.

Is this the so called result of "rolled off highs"? Any discussion would be welcomed, I don't really have much option to switch but maybe I will get used to it is how I feel. I have bad tendency to expect a fair amount on something that is hyped, and in this case quite expensive.
 
Aug 16, 2007 at 10:33 PM Post #2 of 63
Yes this is because the highs are rolled off. The main reason Etys ER4s are better for this genre.

The E500s are better for rock where half the time you want to hide those nasty highs.
 
Aug 16, 2007 at 10:36 PM Post #4 of 63
E500s have quite rolled off highs, try some EQ'ing, or a bright amp.
 
Aug 16, 2007 at 10:51 PM Post #5 of 63
And I was under the impression that people said the e500s are good out of the box without equalizer while the ER4Ps are very dynamic when you play with the EQ. I guess I will have to play around with the equalizer to get some more up front effect.

I'm surprised and quite shocked though, unless my music or hearing preference is selectively high, how people can say these are nearly perfect in the IEMs world when they clearly do have one weakness. Unmodified, stuff like high vocals and violin really sound a bit muffled out by the mid toned harps and bass.
 
Aug 16, 2007 at 11:13 PM Post #6 of 63
I think you still need to run it in for a while and see what happen.
 
Aug 17, 2007 at 1:17 AM Post #8 of 63
Nope.. its not your ears. I found all the new shures to be on the warmer side of neutral. Not all-together bad sounding, for certain kinds of music a warm presentation is preferable. FWIW, i was using comply tips (black olives or whatever they are referred to as).

Your OPA2104 is one of the warmest/sloppiest cmoy OP amps I have heard. Might want to try some OP amp rolling, although that may not be a huge / night day difference. Are you using R5 resistors in your cmoy? If so, ditch them and set your amp to a lower gain to reduce noise. IMHO one of the worst things to do to a cmoy is set the gain higher than necessary, and then wire resistors in the output. Just kills the dynamics of the OP amp...IMHO. What are your input filter cap values? I am not a fan of DC input filter caps, if you your amp/source does not need them. (IMHO this is the biggest flaw with the RA1, but thats for another discussion
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The point being, I don't think you should over-look amp/source synnergy. The human ear is VERY sensitive to higher frequencies, so seemingly minor amp tweeks might help.
 
Aug 17, 2007 at 1:41 AM Post #9 of 63
Quote:

Originally Posted by robm321 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
The E500s are better for rock where half the time you want to hide those nasty highs.


Aaah, so that explains why the Denon AH-C700 I've ordered is apparently 'painful' at louder volumes:
"Fans of very heavy rock and metal, who enjoy loud music, may want to try a pair before buying as the superb clarity can on occasion negatively impact on listening pleasure"
I guess that means shrieking treble does it? Wouldn't that be EQable or not?
 
Aug 20, 2007 at 9:35 PM Post #10 of 63
Well I think I may try a separate amp before fully analyzing the e500s. I noticed something weird, it sounds as if my 1st gen ipod nano's integrated headphone jack sounds better then putting it through line out and amping with the cmoy. For those that commented on the cmoy I took the parts from an existing penguin amp, the only info I have is:

Burr Brown OPA2134 OpAmp
Two low ESR power capacitors (FM series by Panasonic) with 680µF capacity
1% metal resistors, 5% ceramic capacitors in the audio line

I gotta turn it over to figure out the actual resistors. I was thinking of building a new amp myself, but I'll probably be lacking time....

Anyways, I was thinking of trying a different amp, although my budget is now pretty low after dishing out 300+ on the e500s, can anyone suggest a good porta-amp for my selection of music... I think it might cover all though. I enjoy Classical, violin, while I listen to heavy metal Jrock on occasion, while my mainstream "whatever" music consists of trance and techno lol.... sounds like pretty much everything but yeah any discussion on amps for the e500s would be good... it's more of "an amp to balance sound" then actual requirement for an amp.
 
Aug 20, 2007 at 11:26 PM Post #11 of 63
My main annoyance now is I constantly find myself putting the volume on my e500s higher than I would normally to get the complete sound set I want... maybe it's my hearing or maybe this amp doesn't work fully at low levels.
 
Aug 21, 2007 at 2:06 AM Post #12 of 63
D-Boy -

I posted a similar complaint this weekend. I received my e500's and was disappointed by the rolled off highs. I am hoping that burn in will help a little.

If you end up getting an amp, you may want to put the Yuin PK1's on your wish list. To my ears, they sound much better than the e500's. Of course, they do not provide any isolation and would not be good for travel. However, they are terrific if you are really looking for small size and convenience.
 
Aug 22, 2007 at 12:09 AM Post #13 of 63
i dont really find my se530 too rolled off but more enjoy the sound because there is less harshness and more smoothness to the highs i do love the sound of the se530 to my ears its the perfect balancing but a bit of decent EQing can make any sound signature you like really
 
Aug 22, 2007 at 12:21 AM Post #14 of 63
Quote:

Originally Posted by jinx20001 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
i dont really find my se530 too rolled off but more enjoy the sound because there is less harshness and more smoothness to the highs i do love the sound of the se530 to my ears its the perfect balancing but a bit of decent EQing can make any sound signature you like really


Not so. EQ'ing can introduce artifacts into your music. When needed, it works, but in excess it backfires.
 
Aug 22, 2007 at 12:25 AM Post #15 of 63
I had the Shure E4c. I find the tri-flanges (in my case, cut down to bi-flanges) sound the brightest (relatively to the other tips) and thus sound best for violin pieces. Give it a try (and of course remember to shove it in a lot).
 

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