CHORD ELECTRONICS DAVE

[musickid]

Stay quiet don't tell your wives and they won't find out!!! If tomorrow you end up lonely you'll be okay. Mscaler will save the day. Check my avatar for sure.


Listening to god's project Aventura//roon

 

[tunes]

Yes, you can. I am running that set up with the same sub and Rethm Maarga speakers.

How does your system sound with and without the Blu2 Mscaler? Have you compared your set up to the Voxativ 9.87 System??

 

[AndrewOld]

What inputs/outputs would you want to see? USB and s/pdif.

Do you want eq tweaks? NO

Would use of cheap connecting cables be preferred? The MScaler to DAVE cabling should be defined and supplied by Chord. They make both products, they should define the ideal interface and not leave it to customers to mess around.

Are you willing to be patient to get the ideal? Yes, but I don’t see why I have to be patient. The M Scaler has been designed. Just release it.

Can the firmware be updated? Don’t know. Would prefer it to be right in the first place.

Would you be willing to participate in the alpha/beta? Sure.

Is streaming a necessity? Absolutely not. Chord have demonstrated with the Poly that they are unable to deliver robust, competent streaming software/hardware in a timely fashion.

Would control via phone be preferred to dials and switches? No, but a proper remote that allows you to select inputs should be provided. And the controls on the product should be identified, as should the connections. How on earth do Chord expect a casual user - my wife for example - to walk up to a DAVE and use it when there is no indication of what any of the buttons or dials do? Very poor ergonomics.

 

[TheAttorney]

I am thinking to create a poll thread about what actual and potential DAVE owners (and other Chord DAC users, or anybody else for that matters) think about a standalone M-Scaler.

My preference is for the simplest, smallest M scaler, with minimal buttons and options, with at least a USB and toslink input, maybe some other digital inputs (RCA/XLR/BNC) to mimic what DAVE provides.
It would be a low height, flat topped base for DAVE to sit elegantly on top of. If that's too hard, then my second preference would be a small footprint black cube that can be hidden round the back. At this is level, why would anyone use anything other than the full 1M taps? Other than to maybe tinker around for the first couple of hours. A single button to toggle inputs, and optionally another button to toggle taps. Maybe some LEDs to show status.

A networking option would be interesting, but ONLY if that includes Roon Ready and has a SQ at least as good as current rendering champs, such as SoTM 200 Ultra or UltraRendu. If the networking function can't handle both these points, then stop wasting our time and money and leave it out (or have it as a chargeable option).

Edit: If M-Scaler had auto input selection, it wouldn't need any buttons at all

 

[musickid]

A modular upgrade path whereby if new technological advances occur the m-scaler can just be sent to chord for the replacement slot in module. This ensures the initial investment remains valid and is future proofed. Not everyone has the money to swap and change large components at the drop of a hat. A reasonable fee for any upgrade would be ok. The future of audio is approaching.

 

[ZappaMan]

A modular upgrade path whereby if new technological advances occur the m-scaler can just be sent to chord for the replacement slot in module. This ensures the initial investment remains valid and is future proofed. Not everyone has the money to swap and change large components at the drop of a hat. A reasonable fee for any upgrade would be ok. The future of audio is approaching.

following on from that, those who take part in the beta could use a basic unfashionable black box, then get it reboxed after the casing is ready. Remove the barriers for early release, involve the community, get feedback, then replace the alpha\beta customers casings\v1 electronics as they become production ready.

 

[Triode User]

My preference is for the simplest, smallest M scaler, with minimal buttons and options, with at least a USB and toslink input, maybe some other digital inputs (RCA/XLR/BNC) to mimic what DAVE provides.
It would be a low height, flat topped base for DAVE to sit elegantly on top of. If that's too hard, then my second preference would be a small footprint black cube that can be hidden round the back. At this is level, why would anyone use anything other than the full 1M taps? Other than to maybe tinker around for the first couple of hours. A single button to toggle inputs, and optionally another button to toggle taps. Maybe some LEDs to show status.

A networking option would be interesting, but ONLY if that includes Roon Ready and has a SQ at least as good as current rendering champs, such as SoTM 200 Ultra or UltraRendu. If the networking function can't handle both these points, then stop wasting our time and money and leave it out (or have it as a chargeable option).

Certainly Sir.

And the price is . . . . . . Oh, dear. It is nearly the same as Blu2 with the extra bits you have added to a stand alone MScaler.

Just think this through. When Hugo 2 was near to being launched everyone thought they were going to be getting a Dave on the cheap but of course we know that Dave is not threatened by H2 and still retains it's premier slot in the Chord line up. Chord would have been signing Dave's death warrant if H2 had been as good for only a quarter of the price.

At the moment Blu2 is selling very nicely at a premium price. We know that there is an MScaler in the pipeline that will be suitable for H2 and Qutest but I think Chord will be very careful not let this new MScaler kill the goose that is laying the golden eggs ie Blu2. I therefore anticipate a cut down MScaler of some form that does not threaten Blu2 and is somewhat cheaper or a stand alone MScaler that has the same performance as Blu2 but maybe with extra inputs and functionality in which case it's price may end up closer to Blu2.

 

[musickid]

Here here Zappa, and as long as it enhances one's musical enjoyment with the benefits that 1M taps bring with respect to timing, pace, rhythm etc Chord can dress it up in a little black dress and ship it to me quite happily.

 

[musickid]

The golden egg would be compromised but the sheer demand for an mscaler and the volume with which any new product could be sold, would very quickly break even the books and soon become not just a golden egg but a large indian diamond imho. Following this prediction the reduced unit's lower saleable cost as compared to blu2 is a non issue taking into account partially lower manufacturing costs of course. Simple economies of scale and the fact that demand rules above all else.

 

[TheAttorney]

Certainly Sir.

And the price is . . . . . . Oh, dear. It is nearly the same as Blu2 with the extra bits you have added to a stand alone MScaler.

..... but I think Chord will be very careful not let this new MScaler kill the goose that is laying the golden eggs ie Blu2. I therefore anticipate a cut down MScaler of some form that does not threaten Blu2 and is somewhat cheaper or a stand alone MScaler that has the same performance as Blu2 but maybe with extra inputs and functionality in which case it's price may end up closer to Blu2.

No, my 1st preference is for the simplest version (i.e. one that could partner H2/Qutest). If it's got auto standby, then it can even drop the on/off switch.
If a full networking version ends up much the same price as the Blu2, then it's possibly justified - but only if that networking includes the two key points I mentioned.

The goose with the golden eggs is ultimately the loyal-ish customer base. And customers stay loyal when they get what they want at a fair price.
Blu2 customers knew what was possible in the future when they made their decision, whereas DAVE customers didn't.
It may seem a problem to please all the people all of the time, but what a high class problem to have in this case!

 

[simorag]

Are you willing to be patient to get the ideal? Yes, but I don’t see why I have to be patient. The M Scaler has been designed. Just release it.

I totally agree. The whole point of my post is to encourage Chord to give high priority to releasing ASAP a device which incorporates the M-Scaler of the Blu2 without the CD transport. Simplistically speaking, that would mean a repackaging / simplification of the current design of the Blu2. Perhaps also a good business for Chord since it would provide some scale economy to their already developed cutting edge technology and design.

Would use of cheap connecting cables be preferred? The MScaler to DAVE cabling should be defined and supplied by Chord. They make both products, they should define the ideal interface and not leave it to customers to mess around.

+1. Honestly the fact that >50% of the recent posts on the DAVE and Blu2 threads ere related to ferrites on USB and BNC cables is a bit odd. Of course, our audiophiles community is full of obsessive perfectionists, but hopefully Chord can leverage on all the experiments that have been done and further increase FPGA noise isolation in the next M-scaler iteration, or provide guidance about BNC + ferrites.

My preference is for the simplest, smallest M scaler, with minimal buttons and options, with at least a USB and toslink input, maybe some other digital inputs (RCA/XLR/BNC) to mimic what DAVE provides.

+1. This is exactly what I would be looking for, because I would expect this as the fastest development and the minimum cost one. What about half of the Blu2? Seems fair?

 

[AndrewOld]

A modular upgrade path whereby if new technological advances occur the m-scaler can just be sent to chord for the replacement slot in module. This ensures the initial investment remains valid and is future proofed. Not everyone has the money to swap and change large components at the drop of a hat. A reasonable fee for any upgrade would be ok. The future of audio is approaching.

Linn Products have been doing this very successfully for years. They even give you the option of your old board back in a simple folded metal case. No waste. Very decent.

 

[Triode User]

Linn Products have been doing this very successfully for years. They even give you the option of your old board back in a simple folded metal case. No waste. Very decent.

Few would be able to argue against what is being said about upgrades however I used to have a Bricasti M1 DAC. That received various upgrades throughout its life which could be retro fitted to the existing model including firmware upgrades. On the other hand, even with the upgrades it still never sounded as good as Dave!

You had better buy a Linn then.

 

[AndrewOld]

Few would be able to argue against what is being said about upgrades however I used to have a Bricasti M1 DAC. That received various upgrades throughout its life which could be retro fitted to the existing model including firmware upgrades. On the other hand, even with the upgrades it still never sounded as good as Dave!

You had better buy a Linn then.

I don’t want to buy a Linn, as I am more than happy with my DAVE. I was just using their products to illustrate what is possible for a company who wants to look after its customers and behave in an environmentally responsible manner. Linns high end products are big thousands, just like the DAVE, and come in fancy machined boxes, just like the DAVE. But they have been upgradeable for many years, which makes buying in very attractive - you know you are not going to lose out when a product inevitably gets improved on. Otoh, Chord promised Blu owners their product would be upgradeable then didn’t deliver. Certainly if Chord ever get round to something as simple as sorting out the UI of the DAVE I would expect a fairly priced upgrade option for that too.

 

[Triode User]

I don’t want to buy a Linn, as I am more than happy with my DAVE. I was just using their products to illustrate what is possible for a company who wants to look after its customers and behave in an environmentally responsible manner. Linns high end products are big thousands, just like the DAVE, and come in fancy machined boxes, just like the DAVE. But they have been upgradeable for many years, which makes buying in very attractive - you know you are not going to lose out when a product inevitably gets improved on. Otoh, Chord promised Blu owners their product would be upgradeable then didn’t deliver. Certainly if Chord ever get round to something as simple as sorting out the UI of the DAVE I would expect a fairly priced upgrade option for that too.

Yeah, that was a bit shabby about the promised upgrade path on the Blu but I admit I haven’t seen any first hand info about what was actually promised.