CHORD ELECTRONICS DAVE

[Toolman]

When push comes to shove, Chord will have to make a decision ...this will either serve to lower the retail prices in the US or increase the retail prices in the UK

 

[Mython]

This seems more related to the distributor part of the equation than Chord themselves, Toolman.
 
 
 
Anyway, I'm sure things will pan out OK for all concerned, in the not-too-distant future.

 

[TSAVJason]

This seems more related to the distributor part of the equation than Chord themselves, Toolman.



Anyway, I'm sure things will pan out OK for all concerned, in the not-too-distant future.

Yes sir! It isn't making anyone the bad guy. It's about getting the price here closer or the same as theirs. We definitely don't want Chord in other places to raise the price. We want the NA prices to be the same as theirs. This formula works for all, hurts no one or any market. One thing for sure is there would many more Chord owners I'm sure of that. If you can help it's appreciated otherwise Happy Holidays everyone!

 

[jelt2359]

That makes sense but bear in mind the link sent was specifically for collection in London only. If you have the time and money to go to London, sure. Besides, if you need the DAVE serviced, would you have to drop it off in person too?

Anyway prices seem to vary a lot even in the U.K. This other place sells it for a pretty penny more:
http://hifilounge.co.uk/chord-dave-dac

In another discussion like this I've experienced, the end result was the lower one raising prices- not vice versa. Hopefully that's not how this story is going to end...

 

[TSAVJason]

That makes sense but bear in mind the link sent was specifically for collection in London only. If you have the time and money to go to London, sure. Besides, if you need the DAVE serviced, would you have to drop it off in person too?

Anyway prices seem to vary a lot even in the U.K. This other place sells it for a pretty penny more:
http://hifilounge.co.uk/chord-dave-dac

In another discussion like this I've experienced, the end result was the lower one raising prices- not vice versa. Hopefully that's not how this story is going to end...

Chord doesn't want or allow any authorized dealer to ship into other markets. It stresses the relationship with the distributors in those territories. It happens, we all know it and I for one "get it". So since the distributors get to call their price in their individual territories ....you see the problem. We really want the prices here in NA to be reduced. I for one believe the price elsewhere is more commensurate to the value of the products.

 

[jelt2359]

Chord doesn't want or allow any authorized dealer to ship into other markets. It stresses the relationship with the distributors in those territories. It happens, we all know it and I for one "get it". So since the distributors get to call their price in their individual territories ....you see the problem. We really want the prices here in NA to be reduced. I for one believe the price elsewhere is more commensurate to the value of the products.

All good goals. Not sure about the price to value ratio though- that is really personal.Perhaps the success of the Mojo though has opened Chord's eyes to what is possible with great value products.

 

[Mojo ideas]

Loading Dave at 2.5 V RMS with 33 ohms barely makes any difference at all. THD and noise goes from -127 dB to -124 dB, and the only change is an increase in second harmonic. No other amp on the planet is so load intolerant, and it is due to Dave's unique second order noise shaping analogue amplifier - among other things.

The issue of perceived width is complicated. When depth is degraded, and adding an extra stage is guaranteed to degrade depth - you invariably perceive a wider sound-stage. So a increased width is almost always an indication of poorer transparency. The analogy is like a picture that is out of focus - things look bigger, and an out of focus sound-stage will lack depth but appear wider. But increasing width is not always an indication of poor transparency - there are exceptional circumstances when you can perceive out of the box (that is outside of the speakers - to one's side, or behind you) sounds and this is due to encoding of certain resonances, phasing and complex frequency response. Ever wondered how it is with just two ears you can perceive sounds behind you and above? If you cut off your ear lobes, (do not try this at home!) you lose the ability to perceive rearward sounds and height. Its due to the small reflections and resonances in the ear lobe that gives one the perception of height and rear. Now if the brain can accurately separate the sounds of instruments out, and the timing relationship of transients is accurately maintained, then you can better hear the out of the box effects that are very occasionally encoded in multi track music. So in the instance when out of the box encoding has been put in, then a better DAC will give better width, height and rear perception. If you listen to classical music, this is never encoded, so an increase in width using classical music is always an indication of poorer transparency. So in 99 times out of 100, a report of better width is just due to poorer sound-staging and worse transparency.

Rob

So Rob when do you think that those poor deprived people who quite naturally don't have earlobes will be able to claim social benefits for partial loss of hearing.

 

[Mojo ideas]

When push comes to shove, Chord will have to make a decision ...this will either serve to lower the retail prices in the US or increase the retail prices in the UK

We don't directly control the US price, I'm sorry but we can only make recommendations. It's up to the US distributor to follow our advise or not if he chooses too.

 

[Music Alchemist]

That makes sense but bear in mind the link sent was specifically for collection in London only. If you have the time and money to go to London, sure. Besides, if you need the DAVE serviced, would you have to drop it off in person too?

Anyway prices seem to vary a lot even in the U.K. This other place sells it for a pretty penny more:
http://hifilounge.co.uk/chord-dave-dac

 
Which reminds me...if someone in the US buys a DAVE from the UK, then brings it to the US and pays import tax...and then needs warranty service and has to bring it back to the UK...how does import tax work bringing it back and forth between countries multiple times? (Or even if you just ship it.)
 
That higher price is with VAT included, for UK residents...which does not apply to those in the US. If you select UK as the country in the options on that other link, it will show the same higher price.

 

[PhilW]

Their is no import tax for repairs. It's a specific harmonisation code for repairs.

 

[TSAVJason]

Their is no import tax for repairs. It's a specific harmonisation code for repairs.

Correct just the SHIPPING COST, insurance cost and worse TIME, a LONG TIME.

 

[Articnoise]

   
Here are the power requirements of both headphones.
 

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

Abyss AB-1266

 
Audeze LCD-4

 
As you can see, the Abyss is far harder to drive, primarily due to its much lower sensitivity.

 

Different manufactures measure efficiency differently. The efficiency/sensitivity from different companies are therefore not directly comparable. 

 

LCD-4 need 482mVrms to reach 90dBspl

 

Abyss, need 320mVrms and 2.14mW to achieve 90dBspl

 

http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/technologically-impressive-lcd-4-planar-magnetic-headphone-measurements#4espkOLEI8pI2TCh.97

 

http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/jps-labs-abyss-ab-1266-planar-magnetic-headphones-measurements#gGzKxKyZvuVZTAWs.97

 

[Mython]

 

When push comes to shove, Chord will have to make a decision ...this will either serve to lower the retail prices in the US or increase the retail prices in the UK

We don't directly control the US price, I'm sorry but we can only make recommendations. It's up to the US distributor to follow our advise or not if he chooses too.

 
 
From the Mojo thread, 6 weeks ago:
 

 

.... we've been pushing our distributor in the USA for weeks to bring his prices more into line with the UKs new financial reality.

 
So, it's clearly not that Chord don't care; it's just that they can't, realistically, force the issue.
 
Something else to consider is that although DAVE is manufactured in the UK, many of the components utilised within are purchased from outside the UK, so the cost of manufacture will go up, before long, and thus, the cost of the product may do, too, so the current USA vs UK price differential may not necessarily remain quite the same, anyway.
 
 

---

 
 
Back to DAVE... I know I've asked this before, but nobody (that I can recall) directly responded, so I'll ask one more time:
 
Is there anyone, here, who owns DAVE and who uses dipole loudspeakers?
 
Given that this is a headphone-centric forum, I realise that the chances of the above are rather slim, but it doesn't stop me being curious about it.
 
.

 

[Sonic77]

What about the Mass Drop sale that was supposed to happen? Why weren't they allowed to lower the prices?

 

[Mython]

  What about the Mass Drop sale that was supposed to happen? Why weren't they allowed to lower the prices?

 
 
 
 

Spoiler: JF has occasionally touched on this topic, in the Mojo thread

  From John Franks managing Director of Chord. We are currently looking into how or where Mass drop have obtained the unit in their photo or other units resold to them without our knowledge. I can confirm that we at Chord Electronics ltd have had no discussions with this retail company. Therefore I doubt they can supply any numbers of units unless we wish them too do so . As far as I'm concerned, we don't! I hope that is clear enough for everyone.

 

 

Massdrop makes their deals with the manufacturer directly so it should not be a problem.

No that is not correct they have managed to persuade a retailer from some where to sell them a few units. Although we do respect their business model as it quite cheeky really. They are opertunisitic and damage an existing network of retailers and distributors that are promoting and selling our units. I'm sorry but as they are not an authorised retailer therefore unfortunately we cannot honour any warrentee on units sold by them as they are out of region. John Franks founder Chord Electronics

 

   

I just saw this. I'd love to know if this time around it's "in agreement/collaboration/endorsed by" Chord.

Because didn't Massdrop try this once before...but Chord claimed it was without their permission (and warranties wouldn't be honored or something)...and the drop was eventually pulled?

I may not have the story straight -- I just want to be sure this one is on the up and up.

thanks for the Heads up ....No I'm afraid it isn't on the up and up we have not given them any distribution rights. We will check this out

 

 

To be honest, having you hate on Massdrop doesn't help me want to buy your product.  I'm loving my M9XX and my K7XX, and other things I've bought from Massdrop.  I wish I had gotten in on those Fostex headphones.  

. JF I'm sorry but we believe in proper distribution channels that protect our retailers and our customers interests. There is no Hate as you put it, just we care for the guys that have been working with for years in some cases.

 

 

Yes, I agree. It appears Chord wants one of us to check their Mojo-purchased-via-Massdrop and give them the serial number, so they (Chord) can find out what distributor/reseller supplied to Massdrop.

I was just pointing out that none of us could conceivably have one in hand to even give that serial number for another month or so.

We must always do what we can to protect the 99% of good retailers that don't ship out of their area so it's not being too sneaky

 

 
 
In addition to the above-discussed factors, one should consider that if hundreds of people buy a Chord product from Massdrop, they may unfairly blame Chord, at some point in the future, if they suddenly come to the realisation that they have to ship their product internationally, just to get a warranty issue processed, because their contract is with the retailer, not with Chord themselves, but Massdrop might not make this explicitly clear, at the point of sale.
 
 
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