CHORD ELECTRONICS DAVE

[DaveRedRef-III]

I am all for higher res in recording btw. If you are going to eq or mess with anything you need the highest possible resolution because of the degradation.

 

[rkt31]

vinyl makes sense only for the native analog recordings. for vinyls made from native digital recordings ( I believe after 90s only very few albums were recorded in analog ) you hear the dac and eq curve which converted the digital to make vinyl
Master. I bet a good adc and dac ( like Davina and dave ) will completely obviate the vinyl. vinyl has its own shortcomings like it needs eq for recording and playback and much more low level analog processing/handling. once an adc like Davina ( or other good existing adc) converts the analog master into high resolution digital, you can process it into any resolution. problem lies into mastering of CD quality files. if carefully done rbcd can have so much more dynamic range and details. best example is xrcd of robert Lucas -Luke and the locomotives . I would request everyone to try this blues CD. this CD is a very good example , how CD quality files should be mastered.

 

[ubs28]

The trouble is with SACD,is that it's limited to what you can get,just like hi-Res.☺

That's true unfortunetly. Hopefully that will change with the Hifi community gaining popularity. 

 

[Christer]

Christer we are talking about the end, use not the recording studio. If that were the barometer Vinyl wouldn't exist. I am saying that when we start talking about 1m taps and SotA ADCs in the not too distant future, people will find it harder and harder to distinguish Red Book from higher res audio, if they are indeed they are able to do so blind. We won't have too long to wait. Maybe 5 years max?

But to me the greatest thing about computer audio apart from the instant gratification of fast downloads is that "the end use" if you will, can finally for everyone be and already is, what  I  and many others  who want to playback masterfiles ie basically exact  digital copy of the recording from  the actual concert hall or Opera house where things were recorded at the highest possible resolution and best possible miking and all else that goes into making real SOTA HI FI recordings.And we  can easily do so with excellent results that put rbcd  in the shade of hi res in most cases. For most of my  very active music listening I am not at all interested in compromised digital as 16/44.1 from a superior 24/96 master or whatever the original file format was. I want the masterfile and nothing less than that.Both via headphones and my speakers I have  a system that can reveal and resolve the differences.
I don´t know how many here have actually been to  acoustic music recording sessions or regularly visit live concerts of acoustic music.
But I can assure you that  when you have those things for comparison and reference,  you hear and know what has been lost by downsampling  well recorded,hi res masterfiles to 16/44.1 or worse  MP3 and such crap formats.
Playing low res digital files via a really good system is  a bit like  running a really good sports car on cheap  dirty unrefined  fuel imho.
And as far as vinyl is concerned it was not practical to do so for  the mass market, but there was a time and golden era of vinyl when direct cut LPs  were the master.
Many  of them are now almost worth their weight in gold for obvious reasons.

 

[Music Alchemist]

  I don´t know how many here have actually been to  acoustic music recording sessions or regularly visit live concerts of acoustic music.
But I can assure you that  when you have those things for comparison and reference,  you hear and know what has been lost by downsampling  well recorded,hi res masterfiles to 16/44.1 or worse  MP3 and such crap formats.

 
I'm a lifelong musician (vocals, piano, guitar, trombone) who has played in orchestras, wind ensembles, marching bands, a jazz band, metal band, etc. I take great pride in my hearing and ability to assess sound quality.
 
Most of us already know that many hi-res downloads are derived from different masters than their CD (and vinyl, etc.) counterparts. In these instances, it's easy to hear the difference, but it says nothing of the file resolution itself. So the first thing that needs to be done is to isolate the variables to ensure we are comparing only the two different resolutions.
 
When I convert hi-res PCM files to lossless Red Book using dBpoweramp, I do not hear even the slightest bit of difference between them no matter how good the system is. I would be interested if you could replicate these tests (using the same conversion software) but be able to distinguish between the files under controlled conditions. (Feel free to PM me if you're up for this. I can assist you in the task.)
 
I'm not sure if the premise of this article is entirely correct, but there's some good info there on why some or even all of the benefits of hi-res files may not be audible for playback. (Though it is common knowledge that they are beneficial for recording and editing audio.)
 
Also:
 

  Here's a post by Rob Watts explaining why DSD is technically inferior to PCM. (There are probably more if you look for them.)
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/766517/chord-electronics-dave/300#post_11943807
 
And some more background info:
 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct_Stream_Digital
 
The added fact that seemingly most DSD was originally PCM anyway and that almost no music is available in DSD format in the first place makes it hold little interest for me.

 

[ecwl]

No link. I subscribed to the electronic edition (a subscription that incidentally ends today) and it is not yet on the magazine website. The review basically says there's nothing better, while conceding that some might prefer music to be presented differently.

Thanks for the heads up. I couldn't resist and bought the iPad version of this November 2016 issue of HiFi+ for $3.99. The review was extremely effusive and Alan Sircom the reviewer clearly gets what the DAC is about but seems to struggle a little with defining what makes it great at times. Like a lot of us, the reviewer can understand why some people would choose another DAC over DAVE but it sounds like DAVE is the DAC for him, just like a lot of us on this forum. Very interesting.

 

[miketlse]

Hifi+ review now out - "...gets the strongest recommendation we can muster"

 
It is also reviewed in the HiFiNews yearbook - i think they liked the DAVE, especially for piano.

 

[ecwl]

It is also reviewed in the HiFiNews yearbook - i think they liked the DAVE, especially for piano.

Yes. The PDF version of the Hi-Fi News review you can download if you google Chord DAVE Hi-Fi News Review PDF. The HiFi+ review is too new to find online, short of purchasing the digital issue.

 

[Toolman]

  The HiFi+ review is too new to find online, short of purchasing the digital issue.

Unless you know where to find them 

 

[longbowbbs]

 

  The HiFi+ review is too new to find online, short of purchasing the digital issue.

Unless you know where to find them 

I don't even have that issue and I write for them! I have the PS Audio DSJ review in issue 141. Still have not gotten my digital version yet.

 

[Music Alchemist]

I couldn't resist and bought the iPad version of this November 2016 issue of HiFi+ for $3.99.

 
Do you have to get it via iTunes and an iPad or iPhone? (I have neither.) It would appear the in-app purchases are not available on Windows.

 

[ecwl]

Do you have to get it via iTunes and an iPad or iPhone? (I have neither.) It would appear the in-app purchases are not available on Windows.

Yup. Hi-Fi Plus iOS app in-app purchase of issue 141. Read the whole thing. Including the PS Audio DSJ review. Good stuff.

 

[Music Alchemist]

Yup. Hi-Fi Plus iOS app in-app purchase of issue 141. Read the whole thing. Including the PS Audio DSJ review. Good stuff.

 
I only have Windows. Guess I'll just wait until they publish it on the website. I really enjoy their reviews.

 

[longbowbbs]

 

Do you have to get it via iTunes and an iPad or iPhone? (I have neither.) It would appear the in-app purchases are not available on Windows.

Yup. Hi-Fi Plus iOS app in-app purchase of issue 141. Read the whole thing. Including the PS Audio DSJ review. Good stuff.

Glad you liked it. The DSJ is a great value. Not in the DAVE category but not much is.

 

[Music Alchemist]

Thanks to a kind soul, I was able to read the Hi-Fi+ review. Got a good laugh from the "from What to OMG and then LOL" part. I must say, this review was rather brief for them, and unfortunately, there were no comparisons to other DACs in particular; only the conclusion that it's the best one the author has heard. It provided a moment of entertainment, but there's far more useful information in this thread.