[AndrewOld]

A cursory search on the net makes me think that Roon Ready and Roon Certified are not the same thing.

It seems that Roon Ready means that the device is designed to support the Roon architecture and nothing more.

Certified means that a Roon Ready device has undergone testing at Roon and has passed their tests, whatever they might be.

Given that Chord has designed the 2go to be compatible with the Roon model of music playback then it seems to me that they can legitimately advertise it as Roon Ready while it is yet to be finally certified by Roon and the certification process is still ongoing.

If it eventually transpires that the 2go is such a disaster that it will never be certified by Roon and has been finally rejected by them as a total design failure as far as Roon compatibility is concerned then Chord would have to reconsider their marketing puff.

Given that Chord has successfully achieved Roon certification for the Poly I think this latter is a very unlikely outcome.

I’m not sure you are right. “Roon Ready” means that Roon have tested a device, and it passes their standards. The 2Go has not been certified by Roon. Recently Roon have tightened up their procedures and since September 21st Roon will no longer work with a device that claims to be Roon Ready that has not actually been certified by Roon. There is a workround for such devices if they have been in use since before September 21st. But as it stands now, if you buy a 2Go it will not work with Roon. It is unequivocally wrong of Chord to claim the 2Go is Roon Ready when it is not, and as I say this claim is arguably illegal in the UK. Full details of Roons position here: https://community.roonlabs.com/t/a-fix-for-uncertified-roon-ready-devices/120426

 

[SteveHulk]

I’m not sure you are right. “Roon Ready” means that Roon have tested a device, and it passes their standards. The 2Go has not been certified by Roon. Recently Roon have tightened up their procedures and since September 21st Roon will no longer work with a device that claims to be Roon Ready that has not actually been certified by Roon. There is a workround for such devices if they have been in use since before September 21st. But as it stands now, if you buy a 2Go it will not work with Roon. It is unequivocally wrong of Chord to claim the 2Go is Roon Ready when it is not, and as I say this claim is arguably illegal in the UK. Full details of Roons position here: https://community.roonlabs.com/t/a-fix-for-uncertified-roon-ready-devices/120426

I still don't think you have it here... I refer you to the following link: https://darko.audio/2016/01/what-the-gosh-darn-heck-is-roon-ready/

The head honchos of Roon tell us in that video what Roon Ready and Roon Certified are.

Having watched that video it still seems to me that Roon Ready means essentially that the device has the appropriate support for the Roon architecture whether it be a Core, Endpoint, or Control Point.

They say that certification means that in their testing the device in question works seamlessly with the other devices in the audio network.

I do think my summary above is reasonable.

Moving on to the recent changes made by Roon I see legal issues.

For a manufacturer a product is not just the individual units sold but the whole project life cycle from initial concept through design, manufacture, support, update, and repair until the product is finally obsolete.

This requires a very large investment.

Roon's policy of allowing a manufacturer to call a device Roon Ready and market it and sell it before certification is clearly designed to allow manufacturers a less bumpy financial route to full certification.

The corollary of this is that many manufacturers would make their investment decision based on the existence of this eased path for their product and without which pathway they might well have considered the product too risky.

For such co-dependence to be possible the law requires that companies act in "good faith" - allowing investments to be made which is vital for a vibrant economy.

I would argue that for Roon to entice manufacturers to invest in becoming Roon Partners and then pull the rug out by unilaterally changing the rules relating to Roon Ready and Roon Certified would not be acting in good faith.

Making units become unsaleable which were designed and manufactured on the basis that they would be saleable would be such a serious breach of good faith that it would almost certainly be actionable.

 

[AndrewOld]

I still don't think you have it here... I refer you to the following link: https://darko.audio/2016/01/what-the-gosh-darn-heck-is-roon-ready/

The head honchos of Roon tell us in that video what Roon Ready and Roon Certified are.

Having watched that video it still seems to me that Roon Ready means essentially that the device has the appropriate support for the Roon architecture whether it be a Core, Endpoint, or Control Point.

They say that certification means that in their testing the device in question works seamlessly with the other devices in the audio network.

I do think my summary above is reasonable.

Moving on to the recent changes made by Roon I see legal issues.

For a manufacturer a product is not just the individual units sold but the whole project life cycle from initial concept through design, manufacture, support, update, and repair until the product is finally obsolete.

This requires a very large investment.

Roon's policy of allowing a manufacturer to call a device Roon Ready and market it and sell it before certification is clearly designed to allow manufacturers a less bumpy financial route to full certification.

The corollary of this is that many manufacturers would make their investment decision based on the existence of this eased path for their product and without which pathway they might well have considered the product too risky.

For such co-dependence to be possible the law requires that companies act in "good faith" - allowing investments to be made which is vital for a vibrant economy.

I would argue that for Roon to entice manufacturers to invest in becoming Roon Partners and then pull the rug out by unilaterally changing the rules relating to Roon Ready and Roon Certified would not be acting in good faith.

Making units become unsaleable which were designed and manufactured on the basis that they would be saleable would be such a serious breach of good faith that it would almost certainly be actionable.

It is the case that the 2Go is not Roon Ready. It is the case that Roon have stopped devices incorrectly claiming to be Roon Ready working. It is the case that making a false claim in an advert or website is illegal in the UK, and dishonest in the rest of the world. Roon have justified their new harder line and I have given you a link to their statement of their position. Whether this works out well for Roon, for Chord or their respective customers only time will tell. Whether Chord have a legal case against Roon us down to them and their lawyers. But right now the 2Go has not passed Roons certification for being Roon Ready, and as I understand Roons statement a newly purchased 2Go will not be seen by Roon.

 

[Daniel Johnston]

I still don't think you have it here... I refer you to the following link: https://darko.audio/2016/01/what-the-gosh-darn-heck-is-roon-ready/

The head honchos of Roon tell us in that video what Roon Ready and Roon Certified are.

Having watched that video it still seems to me that Roon Ready means essentially that the device has the appropriate support for the Roon architecture whether it be a Core, Endpoint, or Control Point.

They say that certification means that in their testing the device in question works seamlessly with the other devices in the audio network.

I do think my summary above is reasonable.

Moving on to the recent changes made by Roon I see legal issues.

For a manufacturer a product is not just the individual units sold but the whole project life cycle from initial concept through design, manufacture, support, update, and repair until the product is finally obsolete.

This requires a very large investment.

Roon's policy of allowing a manufacturer to call a device Roon Ready and market it and sell it before certification is clearly designed to allow manufacturers a less bumpy financial route to full certification.

The corollary of this is that many manufacturers would make their investment decision based on the existence of this eased path for their product and without which pathway they might well have considered the product too risky.

For such co-dependence to be possible the law requires that companies act in "good faith" - allowing investments to be made which is vital for a vibrant economy.

I would argue that for Roon to entice manufacturers to invest in becoming Roon Partners and then pull the rug out by unilaterally changing the rules relating to Roon Ready and Roon Certified would not be acting in good faith.

Making units become unsaleable which were designed and manufactured on the basis that they would be saleable would be such a serious breach of good faith that it would almost certainly be actionable.

According to Roon, "Roon Ready" is the certification that the device will do what it's supposed to do with Roon. If a manufacturer publicly advertises the device is Roon Ready but Roon hasn't certified the device, they are violating the T+C of the certification process. So yes, Chord is technically in violation of the T+C. I raised exactly the points you are making with the COO (Danny Dulai). The above was his response. According to Roon, only about 1% of the devices fall under this category.

A couple weeks ago this came to a head when Roon put their foot down. All devices that are Roon Ready but uncertified still work fine. They didn't cripple those devices on 9/21. Now anyone who buys a Roon ready uncertified device after 9/21 can't activate it anymore. And unless you are a developer, if you cannot re-enable a roon ready uncertified device if you have to disable it.

Here's a link if you want to revisit the Schitt show that was the announcement of enforcing the certification of Roon Ready devices that were claiming to be Roon Ready but not certified. I'd recommend a couple stiff drinks.

 

[Daniel Johnston]

It is the case that the 2Go is not Roon Ready. It is the case that Roon have stopped devices incorrectly claiming to be Roon Ready working. It is the case that making a false claim in an advert or website is illegal in the UK, and dishonest in the rest of the world. Roon have justified their new harder line and I have given you a link to their statement of their position. Whether this works out well for Roon, for Chord or their respective customers only time will tell. Whether Chord have a legal case against Roon us down to them and their lawyers. But right now the 2Go has not passed Roons certification for being Roon Ready, and as I understand Roons statement a newly purchased 2Go will not be seen by Roon.

We all could be right. It is very possible Roon initially was lax with the Roon Ready moniker and now they are tightening their grip. However, to be fair, if 99% of devices that are advertised as Roon Ready are certified, Chord is still is in the wrong.

 

[phillevy]

Fact is that it always showed up in the device section of Roon settings as Roon Ready (although uncertified) so this makes the distinction even more confusing. Chord may not be technically mis-advertising, however the bottom line is that newly purchased 2gos will no longer work with Roon from this point onwards until certification is achieved. Chord need to make this clear to prospective purchasers.

 

[muski]

I returned my 2Go - too many clicks and pops and generally got sick of waiting for a software update that would make a £1000 "wifi bridge" usable.

My solution - a Raspberry Pi 4 on wifi, running roon bridge for Roon and shairport for airplay. And the best part, entirely portable (no cable other than the USB cable between the Pi and Hugo2) as it's running of the PiJuice Battery Hat - good for about 2 hours of playing. Longer times with bigger batteries is possible as the HAT supports larger batteries

And sub £100 for everything.

Need to find a case, the PiJuice on seems to be out of stock everywhere, and a shorter USB cable.

Oh, and the RPi wifi is rock solid - and runs on 2.4 and 5Ghz AC, and doesn't care about mesh networks.

And I have easier access to the USB port when needed.

Downsides - no SD card playback, doesn't look as great...

Nice idea! I also returned my 2Go—too many pops, clicks and wifi dropouts.

Went back to my office and my M Scaler + DAVE. So delightfully addictive.

 

[ChordElectronics]

I know all of you would like a response form us regarding Roon Certification and we understand the frustration.
Our reluctance to comment is for no reason other than we have no further information to give out at this stage.
As reported previously 2Go is with Roon and progressing through the final stages, as soon as we have information relating to its completion, we will share it here.
Chord Electronics LTD

 

[phillevy]

I know all of you would like a response form us regarding Roon Certification and we understand the frustration.
Our reluctance to comment is for no reason other than we have no further information to give out at this stage.
As reported previously 2Go is with Roon and progressing through the final stages, as soon as we have information relating to its completion, we will share it here.
Chord Electronics LTD

So why are you still giving the misleading impression on your website to prospective purchasers that 2Go will currently work with Roon?

 

[gryffe]

I know all of you would like a response form us regarding Roon Certification and we understand the frustration.
Our reluctance to comment is for no reason other than we have no further information to give out at this stage.
As reported previously 2Go is with Roon and progressing through the final stages, as soon as we have information relating to its completion, we will share it here.
Chord Electronics LTD

Just over a week ago I was still undecided whether I should sell my 2go or not. That statement would have clinched it for me.

 

[SteveHulk]

Fortunately, the 2go is much more than just a Roon component.

The recent debacle where Roon revoked interworking with purchased and functioning though uncertified devices and within hours then performed a screeching rubber-peeling handbrake U-turn to appease justifiably enraged customers and users is evidence of serious management incompetence.

Any more such errors and Roon will be history. The whole business of Roon Ready and Roon Certified would go away but the 2go would still be an extremely capable device.

Another reason why I would never consider a Roon subscription, lifetime or otherwise.

 

[tret]

Just over a week ago I was still undecided whether I should sell my 2go or not. That statement would have clinched it for me.

Meaning you might have kept it?

 

[stancorrected]

Fortunately, the 2go is much more than just a Roon component.

The recent debacle where Roon revoked interworking with purchased and functioning though uncertified devices and within hours then performed a screeching rubber-peeling handbrake U-turn to appease justifiably enraged customers and users is evidence of serious management incompetence.

Any more such errors and Roon will be history. The whole business of Roon Ready and Roon Certified would go away but the 2go would still be an extremely capable device.

Another reason why I would never consider a Roon subscription, lifetime or otherwise.

I bought a lifetime Roon subscription before the price went up 40% and before the Roon Certification saga which you rightly call a debacle. I'm not sure I'd commit to a lifetime subscription with Roon now. My confidence in them has been shaken.
I think the higher end segment of the audio industry plays fast and loose sometimes with this sort of thing, and maybe it's just down to ignorance or inexperience of what's involved or what can go wrong with software implementation. Chord of course released the Poly advertising Chromecast support on the retail packaging. Another example: I bought a pair of Kef LSX's when they came out, and was personally assured by Kef that airplay 2 support was right around the corner. In the event, it took another another five months, by which time I'd lost patience and sold the speakers on.

 

[MatW]

I bought my kef lsx way before I even knew much about Roon... Happy to find out they can be used as a Roon endpoint!

 

[gryffe]

Meaning you might have kept it?

No, it means I would have decided there and then to sell it.