Chips for Noob

[danadam]

The HD600 is supposed to be 5dB less sensitive according to what's published by Sennheiser but I honestly never heard such a massive difference between them especially when listening to music instead of just checking with the 1kHz tone they used in the spec.

HD 650 has 103 dB (1V) published by Sennheiser, so 97 dB for HD 600 is probably a mistake. Or it could efficiency (dBSPL/1mW) instead of sensitivity.

 

[bigshot]

A dozen posts on silliness. All you need is an audibly transparent chip. Just one. Those cost a few bucks and just about any modern DAC is all you need. No need to overthink things your ears will never hear.

 

[P4sta]

I wonder if the people making these insane statements ever check how much voltage comes out of their amp when they are listening to music. 1Vrms will make these headphones reach 102dB SPL. That is literally ear damaging levels loud with a lot of music and still very loud with genres like classical or jazz. The apple dongle can easily reach 1.4V peaks into 300ohms. With these headphones, just 100-200 millivolts is already annoyingly loud to me. 1.4V peak is literally painful to my ears. Do audiophiles listen exclusively to pre master mongolian throat singing and John Cage's hit piece 4'33'' or what's up with that?

hey dont disrespect unmastered mongolian throat singing, that is absolute heat

 

[lewenborg23]

Thank You All very much for the input etc… I’m still a little bit confused, I think

 

[Davesrose]

Thank You All very much for the input etc… I’m still a little bit confused, I think

If you want the short answer, the reason why marketing is now insisting about multiple DAC chips is that they now just cost pennies to manufacture. More is always better right? And it's always easy to spend just a few cents more to add some more chips (which really doesn't do much with modern systems being more about firmware/software)....and ask quite a few dollars more.

 

[bigshot]

^that

 

[castleofargh]

Thank You All very much for the input etc… I’m still a little bit confused, I think

You win some, you lose some. It's probably pretty gimmicky.
For sure, if you use 2 to increase the signal by 3dB, you end up changing/needing to change a bunch of things to ensure good matching, impedance, timing, and just to handle the now higher output. All to do what? Hopefully gain 3dB in signal-to-noise ratio for some noises. The risk of adding issues is not small, so IDK when it's worth it or if out of all the changes, what actually has the bigger impact(measurable).
In general, proper design makes good signal out of a DAC, not throwing more chips in a box.

For other purposes, if they exist, IDK.
I also have a question(not for you, perhaps ) instead of an answer: Given that many chips have more than 2 channels(8 is pretty common), is there is a need to use more than one for whatever it is they do when using several?

About details and soundstage, you can look at every audiophile discussion ever on anything, and you'll find someone bring up how it impacts details and soundstage. It doesn't even have to be something that changes the sound at all. Quantum stickers, magic crystal, weird triangles you put in a room for no reason, someone will tell you how it affected the details and soundstage, I guaranty it. Don't put too much stock into those descriptions, as you usually won't be able to know if or when they're relevant instead of made up.

Another question, do pro audio products tend to pile up the DAC chips into their DACs? Or is it more of an audiophile market doing it?

 

[gregorio]

Now add transients and dynamic swings of 110+ dB peaks in classical music and that dongle will just clip mercilessly

Apart from the clipping that has already been refuted, what “transients and dynamic range swings of 110+ dB peaks in classical music” are you talking about?

Haha, great analogy. More DAC chips can lower noise and improve detail, like more chefs in a kitchen. Helps if done right, but not always better.

No, it does not “lower noise and improve detail” and, wouldn’t “more chefs in a kitchen” raise the noise rather than lower it?

So multible chips doesn’t make the music sound better? More details? Wider soundstage?

No. Multiple chips can in theory lower the noise floor of a DAC. However, it is not a DAC that defines the noise floor, details or soundstage of a music recording, it’s the noise floor of the recording itself. The noise floor of a music recording will not generally be lower than -60dB, in a very few, exceptional cases it may be as low as -70dB, due to the noise floor of the recording venue, mic/mic pre-amp noise, processing such as compression, etc. With popular genres the noise floor will typically not be lower than about -50dB. So adding another chip to a DAC and reducing it’s noise floor from say -120dB to -123dB is not going to affect the music/details/soundstage because the recording doesn’t contain any music/details/soundstage anywhere near those levels to start with.

G

 

[colonelkernel8]

Thank You All very much for the input etc… I’m still a little bit confused, I think

You should sit down with ChatGPT or Google Gemini and ask it to explain this to you "like you're a 5 year old". I'm not being mean, I do this all the time and it breaks down complicated topics into universally understood concepts.