[smeggy]

I went through all the wire stuff ages ago when the craze was still relatively new and every audio rag was raving. I never heard any difference, as much as I wanted to justify the costs and validate my 'audiophile' status. Standard heavy gage speaker wire was no different to 'speciality' wire of similar gage at 8' lengths. I tried interconnects of various materials, costs, weaves and all the other stuff. Again, I couldn't convince myself of any difference let alone improvement.

I wanted to hear it but it simply wasn't there. I went so far as to completely rewire my amps internals *and* bypassed the fuse completely. This stuff is nothing new, this was over 20 years ago (yes, they discussed this very subject back then) and tested with a very good turntable rig and much better hearing than I have now.

I also had varied cones, spikes, special mats, magic paper, hi-tech damping and all that stuff. It was just as crazy in the 80s as now regarding tweaks. Nothing has changed much, only the names and claims. I pretty much tried it all as far as was possible for me. I was a complete hi-fi nut and wanted it all

I was disappointed at the time, now I don't even worry about it. Any decent wire or interconnect is fine with me. I only want my K1000 rewired because I want a clean 8' length with bananas on the ends and don't trust myself to try it. How the wire is constructed and what materials is not important to me as long as it does the job as intended. I'd rather spend my limited cash on more tangible improvements that *I* actually can hear.

What you all do with your money is your business, same as it was mine at that time and I'm not intending to sway anyones opinions, only voicing my own experiences. You'll all have your own and hopefully enjoy them as much as I did, whether they worked for me or not, it was still loads of fun

 

[milkweg]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaZa /img/forum/go_quote.gif But then you can just add thicker cable, so the electrons can flow more freely without resistance, as that is what electricity is, flow of electrons.

That only matters on long runs. The difference between 22guage and 12 guage on an average run is only .1b. 16guage is good up to 30ft or more. That article I posted gives you more accurate figures. I just read an article yesterday where the engineers of their $6,000.00 interconnects claimed thinner wire has less high end frequency roll off. Go figure.

 

[milkweg]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tourmaline /img/forum/go_quote.gif You forgot to mention that some people don't!

I didn't forget to mention it because the only people who claim they can hear a difference are people who refuse to take an ABX test. No one has passed such an ABX test. If they have then show me the data. Someone said to me recently in another forum that they did an ABX test of three amps, one being a dirt cheap one. Guess which one most of the test subjects liked better? Yep. The cheap amp. Probably because they liked the colourization of the cheap amp. Exactly why I think some people like tube amps and LP's better too.

 

[milkweg]

I'm with smeggy.

 

[jirams]

Quote:

Originally Posted by milkweg /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'm with smeggy.

x 100%

 

[IPodPJ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by milkweg /img/forum/go_quote.gif Nice try but I am not buying it. If what you say is true then the article I pointed to wouldn't have hard evidence that people fail blind ABX cable tests every time.

ABX Tests with cables are done on systems that the listeners aren't familiar with. They aren't doing the test in their own home, on their own system. Of course they are going to fail those tests half the time.

Now you take that same lot of people and swap cables on their own system and I guarantee they will be able to hear the difference. I know I could on my own system. The differences aren't slight, especially with power cords.

I have done ABX with audio files, comparing PCM to ALAC. I was able to a hear a slight difference in my system even though it shouldn't have been there. I concluded it was a bug in Foobar or a memory issue with Windows. I had quite a lengthy thread on this a few months back.

I would also be more than happy to do an ABX cable test on my own equipment. Every cable change I've made I've been skeptical of (going into it thinking there would be zero difference), and everytime I proved myself wrong. My Digital interconnect made a difference (and this probably is the result of jitter, and the sample rate sync is transmitted as analog). My RCA interconnects made a huge improvement. My Power cord made a super huge improvement -- all vs. stock cables and cords.

 

[MaZa]

Quote:

Originally Posted by milkweg /img/forum/go_quote.gif That only matters on long runs. The difference between 22guage and 12 guage on an average run is only .1b. 16guage is good up to 30ft or more. That article I posted gives you more accurate figures. I just read an article yesterday where the engineers of their $6,000.00 interconnects claimed thinner wire has less high end frequency roll off. Go figure.

I know, but that wasnt my point. If cable is actually restricting something then thicker cable or cable with better conducting ability is needed. However, Im very aware that the voltage and current transferred by headphone cables or interconnects are rather small and over quite short distance, so even thinner cable should do the job just fine. "Ideal" thing would be no cable at all, but point to point direct contact. How would that sound if (sufficient) cables actually do something?

 

[Caribou679]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaZa /img/forum/go_quote.gif I know, but that wasnt my point. If cable is actually restricting something then thicker cable or cable with better conducting ability is needed. However, Im very aware that the voltage and current transferred by headphone cables or interconnects are rather small and over quite short distance, so even thinner cable should do the job just fine. "Ideal" thing would be no cable at all, but point to point direct contact. How would that sound if (sufficient) cables actually do something?

Tesla in the 19th century was transmitting electricity without any wires. why couldn't we do the same for music .

Or the wireless technology still in it's first "baby steps" cannot produce quality output.

regards,

 

[MaZa]

Quote:

Tesla in the 19th century was transmitting electricity without any wires. why couldn't we do the same for music .

From what I understand, that requires insane amounts of volts, so strong that even as resistive element as air can work as "a cable" and can conduct electricity. The spark jumps from hot-side to ground like lightning between clouds and earth.

Headphones like that would be... hmmm... hazardous.

Portable electric-chair, anyone?


*edit* Now where was that teslacoil mario theme video again...

 

[wquiles]

Quote:

Originally Posted by milkweg /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'm with smeggy.

Same here

 

[milkweg]

Well, those of you that think power affects 50% of sound quality should be using battery powered amps. Here's one that is supposed to be very good for speakers but it has no headphone output. Red Wine Audio

 

[amb]

Contrary to what you might believe, batteries are not noise-free. Some well-designed active power supplies can be as quiet or quieter than batteries. Not only that, depending on the type of battery, the load regulation is likely to be poorer than a good regulated supply.

 

[jirams]

Quote:

Originally Posted by IPodPJ /img/forum/go_quote.gif ABX Tests with cables are done on systems that the listeners aren't familiar with. They aren't doing the test in their own home, on their own system. Of course they are going to fail those tests half the time. Now you take that same lot of people and swap cables on their own system and I guarantee they will be able to hear the difference. I know I could on my own system. The differences aren't slight, especially with power cords. I have done ABX with audio files, comparing PCM to ALAC. I was able to a hear a slight difference in my system even though it shouldn't have been there. I concluded it was a bug in Foobar or a memory issue with Windows. I had quite a lengthy thread on this a few months back. I would also be more than happy to do an ABX cable test on my own equipment. Every cable change I've made I've been skeptical of (going into it thinking there would be zero difference), and everytime I proved myself wrong. My Digital interconnect made a difference (and this probably is the result of jitter, and the sample rate sync is transmitted as analog). My RCA interconnects made a huge improvement. My Power cord made a super huge improvement -- all vs. stock cables and cords.

Consider the reality here. Power stations generate electricity by burning coal, oil or nuclear fuel to provide HP steam for turbines.. The output of the generators are transformed up to very high voltages (440,000 volts ac in the UK). This is fed to a distribution network which covers x1000s of square miles. The EHT is transformed back down in stages (maybe 4 or 5) to finally enter homes at 230 or 120 v ac (UK / USA). Over the network and down street cables and into house wiring. How many miles of cable, subjected to all sorts of interferences etc etc.? - thousands of miles.

How then is a Super-Duper Power lead of 3 or 4 or 5 feet between the home socket and the amp going to have any effect, tagged onto all of this??

One of the biggest rip-offs ever carried out on gullible people -

 

[tourmaline]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jirams /img/forum/go_quote.gif Consider the reality here. Power stations generate electricity by burning coal, oil or nuclear fuel to provide HP steam for turbines.. The output of the generators are transformed up to very high voltages (440,000 volts ac in the UK). This is fed to a distribution network which covers x1000s of square miles. The EHT is transformed back down in stages (maybe 4 or 5) to finally enter homes at 230 or 120 v ac (UK / USA). Over the network and down street cables and into house wiring. How many miles of cable, subjected to all sorts of interferences etc etc.? - thousands of miles. How then is a Super-Duper Power lead of 3 or 4 or 5 feet between the home socket and the amp going to have any effect, tagged onto all of this?? One of the biggest rip-offs ever carried out on gullible people -

Instead of reading tons of papers about it, try such a cable and you'll know!

 

[tourmaline]

Quote:

Originally Posted by colonelkernel8 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I am a musician. I hear live music almost every day. I know what live music sounds like. Power cords do NOT make any difference to how music is reproduced, what really matters is the quality of the speaker/driver and the quality of the recording above all else. If a component's power supply is designed as it should be, then the Power Cord physically cannot make a difference. Therefore any interpreted difference is false, its placebo. Let the flaming begin. Additionally: Human ears are nowhere near as sensitive as equipment, like thousands of times less sensitive in fact. So how can you hear what the equipment cannot measure? You can't. Of course all this has been said before, and I apologize for it being off topic, but fuses are in the same boat.

Do i care for something that i cannot hear but a measuring instrument can pick up?! if i cannot hear it, then it is not of relevance for the frequencies i can hear is it.

People are too obsessed with numbers instead taking care of their ears and train themselves in listening really carefull to music or instruments.

problem is: most amps don't perform their best out of the box, not even very expensive ones! period.

I did extensive tests with powercords and found out that gauge, core material(silver,silverplated or copper) and especially shielding have infuence on the sound. remove your shielding of your powercable and see what happens.......