[Gurashieruro]

   
I think it's more because it's a single driver, than whether it is sealed, or ported.  It gives your brain less work to do, stitching together the different flavors into a coherent sonic picture.I think the DD helps as well - the pressure wave part......  

I doubt it. Crossovers function in which audio frequencies of each BA driver converge and allow them to sound smooth across. So let's say we have two drivers: 1 that ranges from 20-200 and another that goes from 150-500. We set up the crossover for 150-200 so that the ranges are entirely smooth. In function, this should allow BA drivers to cover the same range of a Dynamic driver while posing theoretically higher detail because of obvious reasons. So in short, there is not more work for your brain to do since it's not stitching really anything. What does happen is psychoacoustics and the like which does play a large part in our listening experience.
What I think actually makes DD so different from BA is the actual displacement of air in the given space. Think back, we all know DD moves air and its what gives us the body thumping feeling. BA drivers lack the need to displace air and their function of creating sound and the air its provided is what I believe makes it sound different. DD creates a form of pressure because of how it works which is way different to BA.

 

[Land-O-The-Free]

  I doubt it. Crossovers function in which audio frequencies of each BA driver converge and allow them to sound smooth across. So let's say we have two drivers: 1 that ranges from 20-200 and another that goes from 150-500. We set up the crossover for 150-200 so that the ranges are entirely smooth. In function, this should allow BA drivers to cover the same range of a Dynamic driver while posing theoretically higher detail because of obvious reasons. So in short, there is not more work for your brain to do since it's not stitching really anything. What does happen is psychoacoustics and the like which does play a large part in our listening experience.
What I think actually makes DD so different from BA is the actual displacement of air in the given space. Think back, we all know DD moves air and its what gives us the body thumping feeling. BA drivers lack the need to displace air and their function of creating sound and the air its provided is what I believe makes it sound different. DD creates a form of pressure because of how it works which is way different to BA.

So does this mean that there is more pressure created in the canal and drum of the ear with DD? Or does the port relieve all that pressure?

 

[Wyville]

  That Jalo's a pretty smart guy!  
 
Since you listen to classical music, I'd ask you whether you attend live performances, and how often.  Classical recordings are most likely to be of acoustic performances, and miked by recording engineers that really attempt to 'document' the performance, rather than just use EQ and other "effects" to produce a specific sonic flavor.  This is important, since then you have a real benchmark for evaluating the audio performance of gear.  Then the question becomes whether you are trying to "recreate" the listening experience, or simply to create one of your liking-- warm, detailed, forward, etc....  None of this by way of trying to praise or criticise you, just to help you buy the right gear. If you give us more of an idea of your specific target, we can give you better directions.  At the end of the day, it comes down to which gear triggers the response you are looking for, and that is sometimes hard to predict, but really easy to identify, once you've experienced it.
 
Happy Hunting.

 
Thanks for trying to help out, very kind! I have however already spent my budget, or at least as much as my wife will allow for the moment.

I read up on the Vega and Andromeda (as well as many others) out of an interest to better explore music, signature and its therapeutic effects. I have also had some interesting conversations with Nic (@flinkenick) and Gisele Flower (an audiologist here in London). I keep piecing together little bits of information and I try to gain insights by experimenting with myself in order to eventually gain enough understanding that it will hopefully benefit others as well. So it is for more than buying the right gear. 
 
To show you what I mean, take a look at this:

This is the brain of the famous psychiatrist Oliver Sacks (from the movie Awakenings) while he is listening to music. The response on the left is much stronger because he grew up loving Bach. This is like the emotional response Jalo was talking about. I think that the difference between cheap earbuds and engaging high-end IEMs, like the Vega or Andromeda, might be similar and thus improves the therapeutic benefits of music (because the response is stronger). This is the sort of stuff I am trying to work out and why I got interested when I read Gurashieruro's post.
 
Your comments on attending live performances are interesting in this too. I have never attended a live performance, but I hope I get an opportunity to visit the Albert Hall at some point. It would be very interesting to get a sense of how I respond to that compared to listening to a recording.

 

[Gurashieruro]

 
So does this mean that there is more pressure created in the canal and drum of the ear with DD? Or does the port relieve all that pressure?

There is actual pressure hitting the drum. The port allows air to flow back and forth to allow the driver to not only flex but move air. The only example is a singing voice. Air moves in to lungs, air passes through voice section and out through same hole. The port, by changing its size, can also be used to fine tune the DD by choking or letting it breathe.
So to be exact, DD creates true pressure by making positive and negative pressure because the driver itself moves forward and back. I would presume this is very close to how we actually hear because air does move through our ears and inflicts pressure and moves out as rebound. BA meanwhile takes existing air and vibrates that accordingly. Its why there is no port needed for such IEMs. Housing for BAs shouldn't change its sound either because they are a completely encased system and is directly pointed and directed to your ears. There might be slight sound changes if that wave hits something along its path, which creates resonances and dissonances. 

 

[Gurashieruro]

 

Thanks for the mention
I feel super awesome now lol

Emotional connection is quite important to music. I love Beethoven more than Bach. If you think the brain graphs look crazy during listening, check out those who play instruments. Even cases in which people who can't remember anything are still able to perfectly play music on their associated instruments as if they were without those ailments. Like I always say, I went from someone who wanted nothing but detail, imaging, and soundstage to someone who wanted to "feel" my music. In the end, I personally believe that is what we should be searching for because that is music at its finest. I'm not saying, I don't want those. As the price moves up, so does detail and imaging qualities. But I don't care to have a detail monster when that's all that makes it special.
After playing the violin, which is my favorite instrument I have played, I can hear tonal qualities I never thought I could tell apart. Up bows vs Down bows. Are they using Obligatos vs Eva Pirazzi? So when I go to listen to stuff, I look for those traits. Can I hear the little quirks and skill of the violinist? Can I believe their playing? What parts of the passages are they doing staccato? So what I am saying is that all this stuff goes hand in hand and is the exact reason why I am a hard advocate for high end audio gear. Psychoacoustics play a big part in how we experience stuff.

 

[Wyville]

  Thanks for the mention
I feel super awesome now lol

Emotional connection is quite important to music. I love Beethoven more than Bach. If you think the brain graphs look crazy during listening, check out those who play instruments. Even cases in which people who can't remember anything are still able to perfectly play music on their associated instruments as if they were without those ailments. Like I always say, I went from someone who wanted nothing but detail, imaging, and soundstage to someone who wanted to "feel" my music. In the end, I personally believe that is what we should be searching for because that is music at its finest. I'm not saying, I don't want those. As the price moves up, so does detail and imaging qualities. But I don't care to have a detail monster when that's all that makes it special.
After playing the violin, which is my favorite instrument I have played, I can hear tonal qualities I never thought I could tell apart. Up bows vs Down bows. Are they using Obligatos vs Eva Pirazzi? So when I go to listen to stuff, I look for those traits. Can I hear the little quirks and skill of the violinist? Can I believe their playing? What parts of the passages are they doing staccato? So what I am saying is that all this stuff goes hand in hand and is the exact reason why I am a hard advocate for high end audio gear. Psychoacoustics play a big part in how we experience stuff.

Credit where credit's due!

 
Very interesting thoughts and I fully agree. I am actually trying to learn how to hear more in the music, but my current gear is not up to the task and I hope my new Custom Art Ei.3 will be a step up.
 
There are really interesting stories about music. I used a few of them during my graduate course lectures on the evolution of the human brain, as music is something very primitive. There is the story of the music teacher who lost his recognition of everyday things. He could not recognise a pair of pants for what they were, but he would dress himself through music that would recover some of his memories. Really fascinating stuff!
 
I love the violin too, by the way. I always wanted to learn how to play it. What I do know is that the representation of your hands in your brain will involve more neurons because of your training playing the violin. I am sure the same will be true for hearing tonal qualities and details lost on untrained ears. The brain is incredibly plastic, like clay.

 

[fzman]

  I doubt it. Crossovers function in which audio frequencies of each BA driver converge and allow them to sound smooth across. So let's say we have two drivers: 1 that ranges from 20-200 and another that goes from 150-500. We set up the crossover for 150-200 so that the ranges are entirely smooth. In function, this should allow BA drivers to cover the same range of a Dynamic driver while posing theoretically higher detail because of obvious reasons. So in short, there is not more work for your brain to do since it's not stitching really anything. What does happen is psychoacoustics and the like which does play a large part in our listening experience.
What I think actually makes DD so different from BA is the actual displacement of air in the given space. Think back, we all know DD moves air and its what gives us the body thumping feeling. BA drivers lack the need to displace air and their function of creating sound and the air its provided is what I believe makes it sound different. DD creates a form of pressure because of how it works which is way different to BA.

 
I agree that the pressure wave is an important part of it, Crossovers, on the other hand, do not work that perfectly.  Drivers overlap, have different sonic signatures, and crossovers have phase shift.  These are some of the reasons why crossovers are so hard to design- because they are far from perfect, or even from the way they are "supposed" to work

 

[Gurashieruro]

  Credit where credit's due!

 
Very interesting thoughts and I fully agree. I am actually trying to learn how to hear more in the music, but my current gear is not up to the task and I hope my new Custom Art Ei.3 will be a step up.
 
There are really interesting stories about music. I used a few of them during my graduate course lectures on the evolution of the human brain, as music is something very primitive. There is the story of the music teacher who lost his recognition of everyday things. He could not recognise a pair of pants for what they were, but he would dress himself through music that would recover some of his memories. Really fascinating stuff!
 
I love the violin too, by the way. I always wanted to learn how to play it. What I do know is that the representation of your hands in your brain will involve more neurons because of your training playing the violin. I am sure the same will be true for hearing tonal qualities and details lost on untrained ears. The brain is incredibly plastic, like clay.

How interesting. I love learning about how music works in our brains. Its crazy how much of that stuff really changes our lives, with some of those examples by the ones you typed. From what I understand the Ei.3 is pretty good. Personally, I like going universal fit but each to their own. So long as you enjoy it and love the sound, its always a win! Violin is one of the hardest instruments I have played. I am terrible at managing multiple voices and rhythm so it explains why I can't play drums and have hard trouble with piano. In my brain those are multiple sequences and my brain refuses to do both. But I got violin, trumpet, oboe, and guitar down no problem. What makes violin so hard is the lack of reference and location of bowing. There's so many techniques and ways of doing stuff that its a science lol.
 
 

 
I agree that the pressure wave is an important part of it, Crossovers, on the other hand, do not work that perfectly.  Drivers overlap, have different sonic signatures, and crossovers have phase shift.  These are some of the reasons why crossovers are so hard to design- because they are far from perfect, or even from the way they are "supposed" to work

Well, in the perfect world system. We know what crossovers are meant to do. But what I wanted to say is that those crossovers don't cause any more processing. Sonic signatures are nothing more than the frequency wave of varying intensity and all the physic stuffs. What really might effect all this, which I did completely forget about, is phase shift. Coherency and all the little problems with crossovers are the problem and not technically the different signatures.

 

[Wyville]

  How interesting. I love learning about how music works in our brains. Its crazy how much of that stuff really changes our lives, with some of those examples by the ones you typed. From what I understand the Ei.3 is pretty good. Personally, I like going universal fit but each to their own. So long as you enjoy it and love the sound, its always a win! Violin is one of the hardest instruments I have played. I am terrible at managing multiple voices and rhythm so it explains why I can't play drums and have hard trouble with piano. In my brain those are multiple sequences and my brain refuses to do both. But I got violin, trumpet, oboe, and guitar down no problem. What makes violin so hard is the lack of reference and location of bowing. There's so many techniques and ways of doing stuff that its a science lol.

Yes, fascinating stuff!
 
I went for the Ei.3 because the signature fit specific requirements (I will write a review on them where I explain that) and I needed customs for the extra isolation because I live in London. Plus, my budget was somewhat limited. If I have more to spend, then I would certainly like to have universals as well, if only to allow others to hear what I hear. Like I said earlier, I wish I could have auditioned the Campfire Audio line. I am really curious and think, based on what I have read, that like Custom Art, Campfire Audio has gone with their own unique signature that is more towards the musical rather than the analytical, and that's what I really like.

 

[fzman]

  How interesting. I love learning about how music works in our brains. Its crazy how much of that stuff really changes our lives, with some of those examples by the ones you typed. From what I understand the Ei.3 is pretty good. Personally, I like going universal fit but each to their own. So long as you enjoy it and love the sound, its always a win! Violin is one of the hardest instruments I have played. I am terrible at managing multiple voices and rhythm so it explains why I can't play drums and have hard trouble with piano. In my brain those are multiple sequences and my brain refuses to do both. But I got violin, trumpet, oboe, and guitar down no problem. What makes violin so hard is the lack of reference and location of bowing. There's so many techniques and ways of doing stuff that its a science lol.
 
 
Well, in the perfect world system. We know what crossovers are meant to do. But what I wanted to say is that those crossovers don't cause any more processing. Sonic signatures are nothing more than the frequency wave of varying intensity and all the physic stuffs. What really might effect all this, which I did completely forget about, is phase shift. Coherency and all the little problems with crossovers are the problem and not technically the different signatures.

It's really more about the authentic timbre of (acoustic) instruments.  A tenor sax and a flute can both play A=440Hz.  They have different overtone structures, and specific instruments will have slightly different sounds, when played by different musicians.  Overtone structures involve multiple frequency ranges, so in a multi-driver system, more than one driveer is contributing to the "sound" of that instrument, playing that note.  This is where all those little differences add up to a big deal.  Our ear-brain systems are pretty sensitive, and can detect these differences, i.e. when the speaker, headphone, or iem is changing that delicate overtone structure.  This is what people refer to when they use the term 'coherence'.  (Or, at least, iin my opinion, what they should mean/be referring to).  
 
Single-driver B.A.s, or most headphones, have an advantage in this coherence race, so long as their drivers are not sufficiently non-linear to mess it up.  Lots of so-called full-range drivers either sacrifice bass or treble extension, in order to maintain that univocal coherence across a broad mid range of frequencies- typically these are the ones with the most natural and organic timbral performance - the instruments really sound like themselves....  (This is my personal Holy Grail, as if that isn;t obvious by now).  What is also interesting is that, pyschoacoustically, if the phase response is good - i.e., the overtones line up properly, the brain will fill in the missing fundamental, or upper harmonics... In other words, it's almost as if you can hear bass that's not there, and it makes the 'speaker' sound fuller.  
 
I have also noticed that musicians often "listen" to gear differently than audiophiles.  Musicians listen for technique and hear through the filter of knoowing the mechanics of playing (that) instrument, what it takes to make those sounds.  Authenticity of tone is less important, since the sound is just a jumping-off point to hearing technique/chops.  (This is neither bad nor good-it just is.)   At the end of the day, the gear is there to create pleasurable cognitive states in the listener, and whatever brings you bliss is wonderful.

 

[jimjones44]

Has anyone tried the CA Lyra ii with an Oppo HA-2se?  I just purchased the Lyra on Massdrop and would like to know if these pair well.

 

[MidFiMoney]

  I doubt it. Crossovers function in which audio frequencies of each BA driver converge and allow them to sound smooth across. So let's say we have two drivers: 1 that ranges from 20-200 and another that goes from 150-500. We set up the crossover for 150-200 so that the ranges are entirely smooth. In function, this should allow BA drivers to cover the same range of a Dynamic driver while posing theoretically higher detail because of obvious reasons. So in short, there is not more work for your brain to do since it's not stitching really anything. What does happen is psychoacoustics and the like which does play a large part in our listening experience.
What I think actually makes DD so different from BA is the actual displacement of air in the given space. Think back, we all know DD moves air and its what gives us the body thumping feeling. BA drivers lack the need to displace air and their function of creating sound and the air its provided is what I believe makes it sound different. DD creates a form of pressure because of how it works which is way different to BA.

I don't have anything intelligent to add this but I think it aligns with what I think I'm hearing haha 

 

[MidFiMoney]

  Has anyone tried the CA Lyra ii with an Oppo HA-2se?  I just purchased the Lyra on Massdrop and would like to know if these pair well.

Not sure if this helps you at all but I owned the original HA-2 for a while and I thought it paired pretty well with the Vega. That's as close as I can get. Sorry 

 

[jimjones44]

 
Not sure if this helps you at all but I owned the original HA-2 for a while and I thought it paired pretty well with the Vega. That's as close as I can get. Sorry 

Thank you MidFi.  I've read the Lyra's have a dark sound signature and would do well with a bright DAP/DAC. 

 

[GambL]

What's an excellent portable dac/amp to go with the lyra 2, you think?