[NewEve]

What! is that!? Can't say sh!t on a forum anymore!?

​

Yeah… nooo… me no likey this policy…

​

 

[MarkF786]

I purchased the Ara this past weekend, but didn't open them until today (as a bday present to myself). Within a couple songs, I immediately thought "these are wired out-of-phase!" as the sound was very diffuse without a clear soundstage. Having been an audiophile for 35 years, I clearly know what out-of-phase sounds like.

I used some simple test tracks I've used in the past (https://www.audiocheck.net/audiotests_polaritycheck.php) and indeed the in-phase version sounded out-of-phase, and the out-of-phase tracks sounded normal. Next, I checked the cable with my multimeter and it's wired properly. I then swapped to different IEMs (same cable, same DAC) and they were fine. Switching back to the Ara, they are again obviously out-of-phase!

The last time this happened, with a cable from Null Audio, I found it was their 4.4mm cable that was wired wrong, and Null Audio and other customers in this forum verified it - though surprisingly, the other customers didn't realize it through hearing alone, only through checking the wiring of the cables.

I'm going to do a little further testing, and likely email CA and the vendor, but I'm 99% sure they're wired out-of-phase. Hopefully this is a one-off and all the review models people have been raving about don't share the same issue. It's very disappointing, considering all the wait and the time it will take to get them replaced.

Mark

 

[gnahra]

I purchased the Ara this past weekend, but didn't open them until today (as a bday present to myself). Within a couple songs, I immediately thought "these are wired out-of-phase!" as the sound was very diffuse without a clear soundstage. Having been an audiophile for 35 years, I clearly know what out-of-phase sounds like.

I used some simple test tracks I've used in the past (https://www.audiocheck.net/audiotests_polaritycheck.php) and indeed the in-phase version sounded out-of-phase, and the out-of-phase tracks sounded normal. Next, I checked the cable with my multimeter and it's wired properly. I then swapped to different IEMs (same cable, same DAC) and they were fine. Switching back to the Ara, that are again obviously out-of-phase!

The last time this happened, with a cable from Null Audio, I found it was their 4.4mm cable that was wired wrong, and Null Audio and other customers in this forum verified it - though surprisingly, the other customers didn't realize it through hearing alone, only through checking the wiring of the cables!

I'm going to do a little further testing, and likely email CA and the vendor, but I'm 99% sure they're wired out-of-phase. Hopefully this is a one-off and all the review models people have been raving about don't share the same issue. It's very disappointing, considering all the wait and the time it will take to get them replaced.

Mark

Disappointing to read about yet another (potential) quality issue from CA. There have been several issues surfaced regarding the Solaris 2020 as well.
I don’t have the proper experience to contextualize this, but seems disappointing.

 

[MarkF786]

I did further testing with other audio test CDs I have, and online tests. Also, I swapped cables and DACs as a sanity test. The difference is night-and-day obvious: when the track is in-phase, the Ara sound diffuse without a clear center image; when the track is out-of-phase, the Ara sound normal.

I've emailed CA. I understand accidents happen, and I've been happy with my other CA purchases (Andromeda OG, Solaris OG, Solaris 2020, and probably 10+ cables). Hopefully their customer service is good, and they don't drag this out to be a two week replacement process. I'd be happy if they needed to charge my credit card while cross shipping the new ones, then refund me after receiving the returns - but some vendors are unwilling to do anything but their slow-boat process.

Due to these being hand-assembled, I do suspect it was an individual accident, rather then a systemic issue.

Mark

 

[MarkF786]

Ah, sadly I received a response from CA and their customer service sucks. They said I need to pay for return shipping and insurance, and "Once we receive your shipment, we'll inspect the product and get to work."

Sadly, this is going to become a problem for their dealer, as I'm not playing this game.

 

[gnahra]

Ah, sadly I received a response from CA and their customer service sucks. They said I need to pay for return shipping and insurance, and "Once we receive your shipment, we'll inspect the product and get to work."

Sadly, this is going to become a problem for their dealer, as I'm not playing this game.

I’d assume the authorized retailer you bought it from will cover these costs and help facilitate with CA...if it’s a manufacturer’s defect, you shouldn’t be on the hook for it.

 

[MarkF786]

I’d assume the authorized retailer you bought it from will cover these costs and help facilitate with CA...if it’s a manufacturer’s defect, you shouldn’t be on the hook for it.

Yup. I hoped to avoid making this their problem, as they're a great dealer (and a great guy on this forum) - Bloom Audio. But luckily they have a policy of free returns.

 

[gnahra]

Yup. I hoped to avoid making this their problem, as they're a great dealer (and a great guy on this forum) - Bloom Audio. But luckily they have a policy of free returns.

Ah, yes. @Andrew DiMarcangelo and Bloom are the best! I am a loyal customer....he will take care of this without a doubt. Annoying for both of you, but at least you have a friend in Andrew to help you sort it.

 

[NewEve]

I purchased the Ara this past weekend, but didn't open them until today (as a bday present to myself). Within a couple songs, I immediately thought "these are wired out-of-phase!" as the sound was very diffuse without a clear soundstage. Having been an audiophile for 35 years, I clearly know what out-of-phase sounds like.

I used some simple test tracks I've used in the past (https://www.audiocheck.net/audiotests_polaritycheck.php) and indeed the in-phase version sounded out-of-phase, and the out-of-phase tracks sounded normal. Next, I checked the cable with my multimeter and it's wired properly. I then swapped to different IEMs (same cable, same DAC) and they were fine. Switching back to the Ara, they are again obviously out-of-phase!

The last time this happened, with a cable from Null Audio, I found it was their 4.4mm cable that was wired wrong, and Null Audio and other customers in this forum verified it - though surprisingly, the other customers didn't realize it through hearing alone, only through checking the wiring of the cables.

I'm going to do a little further testing, and likely email CA and the vendor, but I'm 99% sure they're wired out-of-phase. Hopefully this is a one-off and all the review models people have been raving about don't share the same issue. It's very disappointing, considering all the wait and the time it will take to get them replaced.

Mark

Mark

I saw that Ken reached out to you directly which is good news.

Just a question, re: the issue you mentioned above. I understand it is linked to the cable, is that correct?

 

[MarkF786]

Just a question, re: the issue you mentioned above. I understand it is linked to the cable, is that correct?

No, the cable is fine. I suspect one of the connectors were accidentally wired the wrong way. Considering these are hand-assembled, that's the most likely explanation (rather than a problem in design). I didn't want to void the warranty to open them up to verify though.

We'll likely never know what happened as CA may not wish to share their findings.

If anyone was curious about their own, they could use the link I shared; the difference is pretty black & white: you should hear a centered image when in-phase, and a diffuse sound without a centered image when out-of-phase. If you hear the opposite, then one channel is out of phase. There are many other tests as well on YouTube.

https://www.audiocheck.net/audiotests_polaritycheck.php


Mark

 

[NewEve]

No, the cable is fine. I suspect one of the connectors were accidentally wired the wrong way. Considering these are hand-assembled, that's the most likely explanation (rather than a problem in design). I didn't want to void the warranty to open them up to verify though.

We'll likely never know what happened as CA may not wish to share their findings.

If anyone was curious about their own, they could use the link I shared; the difference is pretty black & white: you should hear a centered image when in-phase, and a diffuse sound without a centered image when out-of-phase. If you hear the opposite, then one channel is out of phase. There are many other tests as well on YouTube.

https://www.audiocheck.net/audiotests_polaritycheck.php


Mark

Noted, thanks!

 

[MarkF786]

BTW, there's also a plugin if anyone wants to experiment with testing what out-of-phase sounds like (and see for yourself how obvious the difference is). If you're using something like Audirvana or another player that accepts plugins, you can switch one channel out-of-phase:

https://www.vennaudio.com/utility/

 

[ExpatinJapan]

No, the cable is fine. I suspect one of the connectors were accidentally wired the wrong way. Considering these are hand-assembled, that's the most likely explanation (rather than a problem in design). I didn't want to void the warranty to open them up to verify though.

We'll likely never know what happened as CA may not wish to share their findings.

If anyone was curious about their own, they could use the link I shared; the difference is pretty black & white: you should hear a centered image when in-phase, and a diffuse sound without a centered image when out-of-phase. If you hear the opposite, then one channel is out of phase. There are many other tests as well on YouTube.

https://www.audiocheck.net/audiotests_polaritycheck.php


Mark

useful video thanks.

I was busy with work but have been itching to check the Ara i have here.

The ones i have are in phase.

this is a very useful video/tool.

Not only to check QC but also hard to see R/L marks on MMCX cables - but for me especially two pin cables which are sometimes hard to fathom which part goes where on occasion.

Thanks for sharing.

*side note. Happy i don’t have to go back and redo my impressions ‘wipes sweat off of brow’.


*I think i will also check all my favorite regular rotation earphones also. ‘Gets notepad out’...

 

[MarkF786]

LOL. Yeah, I'm hoping it was a one-off. I've got a new pair arriving from the dealer and will test.

The plugin is a great way to test for one channel being out-of-phase using any music (though it's pretty darn obvious using the posted tests as well).

I was curious if most people can clearly hear the difference in relative phase, or if it's more of an oddity. With speakers, the waves cancel each other and change the frequency response, but with headphones or IEM, it's entirely down to the brain's perception of the phase relationship - and maybe it's not so obvious. Some people might even prefer the out-of-phase sound.

I came across a study where the researchers were using the ability to hear the difference in relative phase to determine if someone was listening via speakers or headphones; if the listener noticed a difference in volume, they were listening via speakers, but if they didn't, they were listening via headphones. But they didn't study if people could generally still perceive the difference in relative phase with headphones.

Another pondering was if headphone test rigs commonly test for this; I saw some units included a "polarity" test, but others didn't.

useful video thanks.

I was busy with work but have been itching to check the Ara i have here.

The ones i have are in phase.

this is a very useful video/tool.

Not only to check QC but also hard to see R/L marks on MMCX cables - but for me especially two pin cables which are sometimes hard to fathom which part goes where on occasion.

Thanks for sharing.

*side note. Happy i don’t have to go back and redo my impressions ‘wipes sweat off of brow’.


*I think i will also check all my favorite regular rotation earphones also. ‘Gets notepad out’...

 

[OhmsClaw]

With periapt cable on my 660’s I initially plugged them up out of phase (+/+ the same direction on both sides) and immediately noticed the sound was off. I pulled the two pin and looked closer and sure enough, they were supposed to be installed opposite each other and one was actually fatter than the other for the polar relationship even though the typical R/L facing of Sennheiser’s stock cable indicators wasnt in play with these aftermarket hookups (although informative).

I quickly tested my suspicion with the RME ADI-2’s polarity function (off/both/L/R) and yup. Whoops.

Hopefully Mark’s connector’s were a one off. Plan on ordering these titanium beauties in July.