Budget (< $50) Interconnect roundup

[JML]

They're pretty flexible for cables that thick, but here are three cautions about the Outlaws.

First, the connectors are quite large, and you should be sure they'll fit -- I think the long string about the cables has pictures of them on Creek amps, and that they fit, but check to be sure.

Second, because of the special copper used, you don't want any sharp bends in the cabling (a good practice anyway, but apparently more of an issue with this metal, which has few crystal boundaries).

Third, while the .5 M may seem to work, it's often an error to assume that two pieces of equipment close to each other can use a short cable run, because of the sharper the bends that result, particularly if the jacks on the units are very close. This is more of a problem if the units are stacked horizontally. If the cable doesn't make a smooth U-shape, then you'll get compound and reverse curves in the cable dressing and can have trouble. And check how much space you have behind the equipment! It's counter-intuitive, but the 1.2 M may actually fit better than the .5 M.

 

[Czilla9000]

I personally love the Radio Shack Gold Series myself...."everything you need, nothin' ya don''t"

Seriously, the Gold Series is some nice cable. It outperforms much of Monsters line according to reviews.

 

[AdamP88]

I received the Outlaws last week, and briefly did a comparison between them and the Radio Shack Gold (bear in mind that I don't have a source with two outputs/inputs, so I had to remove the Outlaws and replace them with the Radio Shacks and then listen again. Listened to only about 5 minutes on each cable).

I must say that the difference between the two cables is a lot smaller than I expected it to be. The Outlaw, as best as I can tell from the brief comparison, just slightly edges out the RS in terms of ultimate detail and treble refinement, and maybe as a result, the Outlaw seems just a little bit brighter than the RS (or the RS is warmer than the Outlaw, take your pick), but again, these are very slight differences.

Other than that I really couldn't pick out anything significantly different between the two cables. Based on my very short and less-than-ideal comparison, If I were able to do a DBT, I would probably have a very hard time picking out the "better sounding" cable.

I get the feeling that perhaps my source (Sony CDP-CE405 - mid-consumer range cd changer from about 5 years ago) is not the best and quite possibly could be the bottleneck in the system that is preventing me from really appreciating a cable change. Either way, in terms of price/performance in my current setup, the RadioShack is the clear winner, although if I were to add build quality into the equation, the Outlaw definitely stands out. I'll try and do a more in depth comparison in the next few days and see if I can find some more appreciable differences between the two.

 

[kwkarth]

Quote:

Originally posted by AdamP88 I received the Outlaws last week, and briefly did a comparison between them and the Radio Shack Gold (bear in mind that I don't have a source with two outputs/inputs, so I had to remove the Outlaws and replace them with the Radio Shacks and then listen again. Listened to only about 5 minutes on each cable). I must say that the difference between the two cables is a lot smaller than I expected it to be. The Outlaw, as best as I can tell from the brief comparison, just slightly edges out the RS in terms of ultimate detail and treble refinement, and maybe as a result, the Outlaw seems just a little bit brighter than the RS (or the RS is warmer than the Outlaw, take your pick), but again, these are very slight differences. Other than that I really couldn't pick out anything significantly different between the two cables. Based on my very short and less-than-ideal comparison, If I were able to do a DBT, I would probably have a very hard time picking out the "better sounding" cable. I get the feeling that perhaps my source (Sony CDP-CE405 - mid-consumer range cd changer from about 5 years ago) is not the best and quite possibly could be the bottleneck in the system that is preventing me from really appreciating a cable change. Either way, in terms of price/performance in my current setup, the RadioShack is the clear winner, although if I were to add build quality into the equation, the Outlaw definitely stands out. I'll try and do a more in depth comparison in the next few days and see if I can find some more appreciable differences between the two.

Adam,
Give the Outlaws a few weeks to break in. Their sonic signature will change as they break in. When you first get them, they sound very "blah" compared to how they sound once they're broken in. Let us know what you think after a few weeks.

Happy Listening!!

 

[jpelg]

ken,

forgive my obvious ignorance, but can you explain how a cable changes qualities over time with use? do the molecular qualities of the cable somehow change permanently? I can understand how components warm up with continued use, but I would think that most relatively inert materials revert to their basic room temperature state when not used for a period of time.

how do cables break-in?

-j

 

[kwkarth]

This has been discussed numerous times in previous threads. Do a search on cable break in. Go to the Cardas web site and read George's dissertation. Do a google search on cable break in.

I'm not sure which theory I subscribe to. All I know is there IS a tremendous sonic difference between a broken in Outlaw and one that is not broken in. I have demonstrated/tested this for myself several times. Most of the published theories make some sense to me in that they're at least plausible to a degree, but I'm a very skeptical person.

Regardless, I know what I hear, and I do not care for the Outlaws sound untill they've broken in, and then it's wonderful! With every pair I have that process has taken three full 24 hour days and you can hear the sound go through its changes over the course of those three days. The rate and progression of change has been constant.

I have not observed the break in phenominon with every interconnect I have and with the Outlaw's it is most pronounced.

Cheers!

 

[markl]

This comment may be neither here nor there, but I'm going to post anyway.

In my experience, the sub-$50 cables (I've tried Acoustic Research, Monster and MIT in this range) are not worth the investment. Again in my experience with these cables, you have to jump up to the $80 plus cables to even begin to get some benefit.

If all you've tried were the "cheapie" Monster ICs and you concluded that cables make no difference, I'd understand why/how you came to that conclusion.

IMO, cable-rolling should only begin after you've got some better-quality components to hook up. For the sake of argument, I'll say "better quality" "typically" begins at the $400 mark or so. If you only have $50 to spend on cables, I would advise an upgrade to your source/amp/phones long before you plow it into less than stellar cables, given the amount of difference cables can make, which in the overall sceme of things isn't that significant compared to moving up to the next model in a manufactuerers line.

This is a case of "garbage in, garbage out". If your component has cheapie cost conscious parts inside generating the sound, cheapie cost-conscious cables will be of no help.

This may have been said already, but no cable can "improve" the sound. At most, the best quality cable is that which *degrades sound the least*. Cables are a great tweak-- if you've already invested quite a bit in your other components, but not until. Before you have a good system, better cables are a waste of your resources.

Was that constructive, or useless?

markl

 

[kwkarth]

markl,
If you have not tried the Outlaw cables then your message was perhaps less than constructive since there is overwhelming evidence (albeit anecdotal) that the OutLaws, some of which are under the $50 mark (which is the topic of this thread) are remarkable cables. Do yourself a favor and try them out.

Cheers,

 

[markl]

Kwkarth,
I'm sure the Outlaw cables are OK for the money. When you're ready for some REAL cables, gives Rick at Virtual Dynamics a call

. I know from "good" cables. No, they aren't as cheap as the Outlaw cables, but they're by far the best I've heard with my above-average (will you give me that at least?) gear.


markl

 

[eric343]

Watch it, Markl- them Outlaw cables, while not being exactly VD material, definitely fall into the category of "real" cables, considering the reviews they've gotten.

Also, and we might want to start a new thread for this, your old adage of "SACD players are better at Redbook because they have better DACs" is rather suspect- just ask anyone to compare, say, the Arcam CD72 (redbook only, $800) to the Philips SACD-1000 (SACD, $2000) in terms of Redbook playback. Even the Great and Mighty Accuphase 100/101 (SACD, ~$30000) apparently isn't quite as good as the Linn CD12 (Redbook, $20000).

 

[markl]

I have no doubt that the Outlaw cable are good *for what they are*. Are they better than Monster Cables at that price range? No doubt, but that ain't sayin' much is it?

As for the other comment, my key phrase is "in general". Sure there are exceptions. "In general" a comparably priced SACD player will out-perform a Redbook only CD player. As more manufactuers come on-line with SACDPs the more this will ring true. Wait and see...

markl

 

[HD-5000]

sorry to crap on this thread, but I get the feeling that you guys think that the Outlaw cables are the interconnects that will end all interconnects. My uncle will hopefully send me a free pair of Kimber PBJ's. Has anyone done any comparisons between these two?

 

[eric343]

Oh, I doubt that the Outlaws are "the interconnects that end all interconnects." AFAIK, however, they're just quite high on the price/performance curve, and around here that counts for a [size=small]lot.[/size]

 

[BenG]

HD-5000,

PBJ is a good wire imo, but it's reputation for brightness in the upper-midrange is a correct one in my experience. The Outlaw is the best consumer cable under $100 that sounds the closest to nothing that I've heard, and that includes the well respected Homegrown Audio Super Silver I -- which sounds intentionally colored in comparison.

Still, If you're looking for a warm sound, the PBJ or Outlaw may not suite your needs.

 

[Dusty Chalk]

Quote:

Originally posted by HD-5000 sorry to crap on this thread, but I get the feeling that you guys think that the Outlaw cables are the interconnects that will end all interconnects. My uncle will hopefully send me a free pair of Kimber PBJ's. Has anyone did any comparisons between these two?

I have both. They are very close. (I don't think it is stressed enough that when we are talking about cable replacement, we are talking very little difference, but to me, this "last little bit" is crucial.) I haven't broken in my Outlaw yet, and "FOB" (fresh outta box), initial impressions are that it is better (the Outlaw, that is).

(Unfortunately, I left them at work, otherwise I would do an A/B comparison of them right now.)

Kimber PBJ's were one of the best "entry-level" interconnect replacements, but they're beginning to show their age. They are still one of the best, however. There is a definite appeal to the K.I.S.S. philosophy.

I don't know what BenG is talking about, in terms of an upper midrange brightness, but I will listen for it.