[Zafsk]

Hey guys,
 
I'm thinking about taking on a project that seems a bit daunting but I think I can do it with a bit of help. I've been wanting to DIY a pair of bookshelf speakers for awhile now and actually get some decent quality out of them. I've been doing a lot of reading on circuit diagrams and electrical engineering, and honestly, understanding only a fraction. I found Parts Express, and that gave me a bit of a confidence boost, knowing that there was someplace I could get parts, but I'm still a bit overwhelmed on where to start. I'm willing to go all out and use kevlar and magnets to make drivers and such but I'm not sure how that would end.
 
So here are a couple starting questions for you guys:
 
1. How feasible is making a pair of DIY speakers that sound hi-fi (i.e. have a wide frequency response, dynamic enough to handle loud volumes, and has good clarity) on my own?
2. Can I do it without breaking the bank (I think that I'd probably cap around $400 for the pair)
3. What timeframe am I looking at here?
4. Tools needed?
 
If I could get a general idea, that'd be fantastic. I'm sure I'm looking pretty silly here, asking about DIY speakers when I don't know much about it, but I figured I'd jump in feet first.

 

[Uncle Erik]

You're actually thinking about building your own drivers? Wow - not easy. I built a pair of ribbons some years ago (not bookshelves, not even close) and that took more than a bit of fiddling. But for $400, you should look at the various singledriver projects. That will get you some excellent drivers. If you want to check out more information, visit the Melhuish singledriver site, the Madisound forums and the Pass Labs DIY forums. You'll learn a lot and probably find an overwhelming amount of projects. Read up, have fun. As for tools, you'll probably want a tablesaw, router, jigsaw, and a drill. You can get around a tablesaw by having a shop cut the boards. It's cheaper than you think and professionally cut boards are better than trying it yourself. They should be able to do the router work, too. A drill and a jigsaw are pretty inexpensive and belong in every garage. Also, if you go the singledriver route, you won't need crossovers. Just solder the drivers to the terminals and you're done.

 

[Zafsk]

Well, lucky me -- I've actually got all of those tools! I just wanted to make sure that I didn't need anything special. I think I'll hold off on making my own drivers though, seems a bit out of my knowledge range. I'll file that in 'things to do later'.
 
But yeah, I wont need to go to a shop as I have all those tools. I was thinking about making a typical woofer/tweeter combo (not sure what the term is for that) and from what I understand, I'd need the crossovers for those. I know this sounds daunting, but I was thinking about trying to get close to the quality of the Dynaudio Audience 42 speakers. Good quality front row speakers, and 53 Hz to 23 kHz frequency response. I'm sort of speaking in general terms because I'm not quite sure what that would entail. I'm almost entirely sure I could probably buy a pair for cheaper, I'd just like to take my time making my own pair -- knowing how to tweak it to the sound I want.
 
Though, I'm a little sketchy on how much math this will require. My math can get shoddy, sometimes.
 
Anyway, thanks for the info. Will put it to use.

 

[steven2992]

You can find a lot of designs on zaphaudio.com and on htguide.

 

[Uncle Erik]

Great! The other tools you'll need are a soldering iron and a meter, but those are inexpensive and easy to find.

Don't worry too much about the math. Contact the guys at Madisound - they can design crossovers and box sizes for you. I don't think it's terribly expensive, either, and they're good at it.

Also, you might want to pick up a copy of Vance Dickason's "Loudspeaker Design Cookbook," which will tell you a lot about designing speakers.

 

[Zafsk]

Like a voltage meter?

 

[9pintube]

  Zafsk, Did you say you want to build the DRIVERS?? or Do you want to build some cabinets and build the cross overs, terminals etc. etc. and buy some nice tweeters and Mid/Bass drivers for your speaker build.........Uncle Erik gives some good advice about Madisound!  But Building your own drivers may not be as fruitful and as cost effective as buying OEM drivers???

 

[Zafsk]

I was considering it, in my 4 am super-ambitious sleep-deprived madness, but I think I'm going to stick to OEM drivers for now. Like I said, I'll likely attempt building my own drivers in the future sometime but I'll start out by building a decent pair of bookshelf speakers before I attempt something like that. Still trying to grasp the concept of a crossover, and how I'm going to put it together.

 

[9pintube]

Zafsk, (THIS IS LONG, BUT ENJOY)..... You could use an outboard cross-over.... That's what I use on my DIY "Watt" monitors........I'm using the same drivers 7'' mid/ woofer and focal titanium tweeters in  Sloped time aligned cabinets......... With outboard X-overs you must use a separate amp for each driver in each cabinet, so my mid/woofers use 300B mono blocks about 32 watts per side  and the tweeters use a pair of custom made 6384 tube amps that put out about 11 watts a side, plenty for a tweeter......The X-over I'm using is a custom rebuilt  Pioneer SF850 that you set your frequency responses with the knobs on the front of the unit.....The unit is a 3 way but I'm just using the highs inputs and the Mid inputs (2-way) to control the speakers.....I'm sure you could use two stereo amps and let the right and left channels power each monitor.... that would cut your amps and cables and Ics down that are needed for a system like I described for you... Google ( Marchand crossovers) and you can see some other cross-overs of this type...Now this is a totally different approach to x-overs for speakers but the the results are plentiful.....You need to read up on active and passive x-overs, then you'll know what you'll want for your DIY Monitors...Another thing Parts express carries small outboard 2 and 3 way x-overs (Dayton Brand) that you should look up and read about ....those would give you what you need and then one stereo amp would be all that you'll need....This is long winded but I really wanted to help you see the many options you have for your X-over...Remember Uncle Erik said Madisound will tell you what you would need if you just wanted to build a normal X-over for you stuff..........I think you'll enjoy the different X=over types out there.......

 

[peli_kan]

A question:  Would it be feasible to build your own electrostatic bookshelf speakers?  DIY stators have been made for headphones, I don't see why it wouldn't scale up well. 

 

[9pintube]

Quote:

A question:  Would it be feasible to build your own electrostatic bookshelf speakers?  DIY stators have been made for headphones, I don't see why it wouldn't scale up well. 

Peli_kan, The speaker surely wouldn't be even close to full range,or for that matter go as low as maybe using a 6.5" or 7" for your low freq. driver crossed over to your electrostatic "highs" panels..... I guess it's possible, find some old Janszen panels???? good luck!

 

[Omega]

I've always liked the ZaphAudio designs.  For example, the ZMV5 should come in significantly under your budget ($125 for drivers + electronics, and then add in enclosure and bindings).  He designs them around well-known and well-tested drivers, and it is easy to put those designs into pre-fab enclosures or build your own to suit.  Some of his other designs look nice too, but come in above $400 after you build a box (ie, the SR71).
 
My experience has shown me that enclosures easily take the most time in a DIY speaker project, and determine the lion's share of how most people will evaluate them.  If you are a talented woodworker or are particularly meticulous, go for it.  Otherwise, if you want them to look "professional," buy the pre-fabs.  Personally, I've enjoyed the process of building enclosures to make them look and feel my own, but I usually make enough little mistakes that it takes a while to converge on what I consider acceptable as a final product.
 
Crossovers are (in my opinion) the hardest part to design well, especially when you start understanding the subtler points like phasing and reactive impedance.  These can obviously be eliminated if you go the single-driver route--a bad crossover is worse than none at all!  Many crossovers eat dynamics, smear imaging, waste power, add coloration to the sound, etc.  But a well-designed multi-way system will usually outperform a single driver system, and I am skeptical that anyone can build a truly good pair of single-driver speakers for under $400 within your constraints of bookshelf speakers.  Using old/NOS drivers or something Chinese, or Dayton and tower configurations, maybe (but unlikely, after accounting for the cost of enclosure)...single driver systems rely heavily on the output of the one driver, and it just isn't worth cheaping out on it...so spending $150+ on each driver (Jordan JX92, etc) is not uncommon.
 
You can do away with the tablesaw if you are especially handy with a router (especially for bookshelf sizes).  But if you have access, great.  A couple good clamps are absolutely worth it because an air-tight enclosure is made like good furniture--fastened with some wood-on-wood method, glued, and clamped. 
 
I've built huge subwoofers in less than week, with access to a shop and the space to leave my supplies all over the place while drying/curing.  If you use pre-fab or pre-cut boxes, you can do it in a few hours in one day, really.  Passive speakers are pretty simple to assemble after the design is done, and settling in to the right stuffing/measurement/placement values will take some time and personal preference anyway.
 
I suggest you DO NOT make your own drivers as a first project, and probably ever.  There are good designs on the market for nearly anything you would want at this point...it would be a real challenge to best the performance of these for cheaper than the price to order online from, say, Madisound or Parts Express.  You can do DIY electrostats, and that might make sense, if you want something exotic.  But it will NOT be cheap to energize those huge films.  I don't know enough about ribbons to comment on them.
 
Easiest designs that sound excellent (ie, large margins of error) are typically sealed acoustic suspension designs.  As long as you can make the enclosure air-tight, you can make a winner.
 
I have been most impressed with open baffle designs.  But not a good place to start with a first project .  They only look simple.
 
Good luck!  I have found that DIY speakers tend to elicit a greater interest from friends/family/guests than DIY electronics because anyone can see it and understand why the design problem is interesting...great way to get friends involved in a rewarding pursuit!
 
Quote:

Hey guys,
 
I'm thinking about taking on a project that seems a bit daunting but I think I can do it with a bit of help. I've been wanting to DIY a pair of bookshelf speakers for awhile now and actually get some decent quality out of them. I've been doing a lot of reading on circuit diagrams and electrical engineering, and honestly, understanding only a fraction. I found Parts Express, and that gave me a bit of a confidence boost, knowing that there was someplace I could get parts, but I'm still a bit overwhelmed on where to start. I'm willing to go all out and use kevlar and magnets to make drivers and such but I'm not sure how that would end.
 
So here are a couple starting questions for you guys:
 
1. How feasible is making a pair of DIY speakers that sound hi-fi (i.e. have a wide frequency response, dynamic enough to handle loud volumes, and has good clarity) on my own?
2. Can I do it without breaking the bank (I think that I'd probably cap around $400 for the pair)
3. What timeframe am I looking at here?
4. Tools needed?
 
If I could get a general idea, that'd be fantastic. I'm sure I'm looking pretty silly here, asking about DIY speakers when I don't know much about it, but I figured I'd jump in feet first.

 

[nullstring]

not to thread jack, but is there a place to get cheap cabinets?
 
I'm not really up to making my own.. but I don't want to pay $150 for them either.
 
The ZMV5 looks nice

 

[Uncle Erik]

nullstring, you should talk to some local cabinet shops. Most of them have everything they need to make speaker cabinets and the materials are pretty cheap. All you need is some MDF which is cheap and the cutting shouldn't run too much. Now, where the real expense lies is in finishing. Finishing takes more time than the basic cuts and you can spend a lot on veneers and finishing those. You'd be best off carefully painting them. You'll want to spend some time sanding, filling the voids with Bondo, and so on yourself. It's not expensive and materials are reasonable, but there's a bit of labor involved.

 

[Zafsk]

Thanks for all the information. I went down to my hi-fi store and found a pair of AR-2x's from the early 1970s for $25, there's something severely wrong with the woofers but the cabinets were too gorgeous (both in wood and build quality) to let go. There's nothing wrong with the tweeters, but I'm curious if I should just replace everything inside it (all of the original parts are in there) and just use the cabinets or if I should try to restore the speakers? I'm not too familiar with Acoustic Research, so I don't know if these are quality speakers or not -- or if I'm better off just building my own thing inside of them.