[azncookiecutter]

Quote:

Originally Posted by spaceman How does one go about dual-booting two OSs? I run XP Home on two networked PCs and would like to give linux a go as well. I also have a PC with Win98 (not networked), so would it be better to format the HD and do a clean install with Linux?

With the install for Ubuntu, near the end it installs a little pre-boot program which lets you choose which OS to use. I think its called GRUB, don't remember.

 

[JiiEf]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mustang Hey Zeus,

I just got an enormous Die Hard 3 flashback from this.

/JF

 

[MarcusH]

Well here are my 2 cents ....

I personally use - besides Windows XP for gaming, some university related stuff - Debian (www.debian.org) and LFS (http://www.linuxfromscratch.org), tweaked to be almost fully 64-bit (with some necessary 32-bit libs). Most of my time I'm using the Debian distro as the LFS one was just for testing/learning purposes.

So someone recommended Ubuntu to you, I would second this recommendation because it's an easy to use distribution, which, as far as I know, was designed to suite the beginners needs.
The reason I would prefer Ubuntu to RedHat is that it is pretty close to Debian - and I always felt like Debian does NOT too heavily interfere with your "freedom" of tweaking the distro to YOUR needs. Many distributions somehow do too much for you - like for example that's the way I felt with SuSE in the beginning (maybe they improved over the years).
It's possible to do things "manually" with every linux distro BUT if you choose to use their config programs again, they will probably simply overwrite your changes in certain files. Just be careful once you decided to go a step further.

One or two words regarding Gentoo, I truely wouldn't suggest it as a beginners distribution. As Zeyus said, he thought about the learning effect Gentoo would have - but in my opinion it will just help you understand how to install a Gentoo distribution (doh!) and how things work with configuration files, etc. (which is a good thing after all). It's too Gentoo specific in itself that it is not teaching you what linux as such but what gentoo is all about. If you really want to learn something about what a distribution actually is, what is necessary to run a minimal linux environment, etc. I can only suggest you use LFS. LFS is not actually a distribution, it's simply a book on how to create your distribution followed by BLFS, etc. Once you have enough experience with Linux, LFS will help you delve a bit deeper - they have a pretty good way to explain things but you need to have a better (basic) picture of how linux works before you can actually make sense out of their explanations, instead of just following their instructions. Same applies IMHO to Gentoo.
This wasn't meant to "diss" Gentoo, but from my point of view, LFS gives you a purer Linux impression than Gentoo ever will.

To sum it up - it probably boils down to your personal taste. For me it's Debian, for WellyWu it's Redhat - for you it may be SuSE, Ubuntu, RedHat, etc. Just as with music there is no best distribution (as there is no wrong or right musical genre) - so take every opinion with a grain of salt (especially mine *g*).
I would suggest - besides the arguments given in this thread - you try a few distributions before you decide which one to keep on your harddrive. It all depends on what you need and what you expect from Linux - but rest assured, there are so many different distributions that I'm sure one of them will come close to your needs.
If I would have to begin with Linux today, I would use Ubuntu and if I feel the need to go a bit further I'd install Debian and would immediatly feel at home because I would know how things worked in Ubuntu.

Marcus

 

[jbloudg20]

Quote:

Originally Posted by zeyus For straight up switching from windows you might be more intereted in something /like/ Ubuntu or Mandrake. But, the problem with those distros (and I must point out that they are great distros!!) is that they wont teach you anything about linux. I have a friend who is using SuSe, and he has only used the graphical environment, and has now loaded software to run windows based programs, which kind of defeats the purpose (that said, VMWare, Win4Lin & crossover-office do a good job). What I can say for gentoo, is if you start from a stage one install you /will/ learn heaps about your system and about linux in general. Gentoo has a great community if you have troubles, and the install guide is one of the best documentations I've used. If you want to make it easier, try starting from a stage 3. But with gentoo one of its major advantages is that when the system is set up installing a new program (if its in their package management) is as simple as (for example, if you want XMMS) emerge xmms and it compiles and is done.xmms is installed and any other programs that it needs. In the end though, you might want to start with Ubuntu, Kubuntu (my preference, I love KDE) or mandrake or something similar. But if you are feeling adventurous, try gentoo, it's my fave distro by far now.

Just for reference, Ubuntu (debian-based) has a really simple package manager as well.

sudo apt-get install xmms

done deal... no more package dependancy hell. And just for the sake of argument... I like KDE as well, and I still wanted the choice of Gnome, KDE or flux, so I installed the base Ubuntu. Then I:
sudo apt-get install kubuntu-desktop
sudo apt-get install fluxbox, (after enabling the universal respositories)

and viola! I know can choose between KDE, Gnome, or fluxbox for my window manager.

 

[hugz]

I'd recommend debian (what i use) or ubantu (never used it but i beleive it's based upon and improved debian).

Debian is great for someone new to linux because it's as powerful as you want it to be, without being tooo daunting. apt is my hero. It's a perfectly useable linux with a little bit of reading

it's better than redhat and such because it doesn't pretend to be windows. i started out with the various easy linuxs such as redhat and could nevert use them for over a week. they act all friendly but then underneath you still have to bat tle with the linux monster. debian gives you real experience with linux which can really help you deal with the "hard" bits in linux, while not being overwhelming.

go debian!

 

[Skipinder]

FreeBSD

Unix all the way!

As for a Linux distro, I say Gentoo. Haven't tried Ubuntu, but from the screenshots I've seen, it seems to easy, takes all the fun out of it

 

[Stephonovich]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarcusH One or two words regarding Gentoo, I truely wouldn't suggest it as a beginners distribution. As Zeyus said, he thought about the learning effect Gentoo would have - but in my opinion it will just help you understand how to install a Gentoo distribution (doh!) and how things work with configuration files, etc. (which is a good thing after all). It's too Gentoo specific in itself that it is not teaching you what linux as such but what gentoo is all about. If you really want to learn something about what a distribution actually is, what is necessary to run a minimal linux environment, etc. I can only suggest you use LFS. LFS is not actually a distribution, it's simply a book on how to create your distribution followed by BLFS, etc. Once you have enough experience with Linux, LFS will help you delve a bit deeper - they have a pretty good way to explain things but you need to have a better (basic) picture of how linux works before you can actually make sense out of their explanations, instead of just following their instructions. Same applies IMHO to Gentoo. This wasn't meant to "diss" Gentoo, but from my point of view, LFS gives you a purer Linux impression than Gentoo ever will.

I've looked into LFS before; indeed, I seriously considered it back when I first chose Gentoo. While I agree with your sentiments that Gentoo doesn't translate very well to other distros (rc-update, for instance - wonderful tool for changing daemons runlevels. Much easier than chkconfig. Another obvious example is Portage, but that *can* be used on other distros with some work), I think the hassle of a LFS system may prove too daunting for a newbie. As I mentioned, the only reason I've even recommending Gentoo is because of the graphical installer. I don't think most people are up to the traditional method.

LFS can be made just like any other distro, yes. But getting there can be quite a challenge. And quite honestly, some of it's downright stupid. For instance, how you have to download 100 odd packages manually. That teaches you nothing other than wget syntax. With Gentoo, there's meta packages that have all necessary tools rolled up into them. No sense wasting time on something trivial. And another thing, package management. I'm aware you can install your own (as mentioned above, Portage transfers nicely), but this isn't exactly something a newbie should or could undertake. And without it, you're stuck with ./configure && make.

Quote:

Originally Posted by azncookiecutter K, thanks for all the advice. I installed it just now, and begun fooling around with it. Two questions: how the hell do I install drivers? And how the hell do I enable sound for my Sound Blaster PCI, since I use that sound card, but only the onboard sound works. The drivers is for my USB wireless adapter that I am using. Without that driver, I can't use the internet on the Linux side of my now dual-boot system.

What distro did you install? You never mentioned it.

If it's Gentoo, Google your wireless adapter, with revision number, and see what chipset it's using. Then do an 'emerge -S $CHIPSET'. Notice the uppercase; that searches the description of packages, rather than the name. If that doesn't pull up anything, go to Gentoo Portage and repeat your search there. Failing that, search the forums.

 

[azncookiecutter]

Ubuntu is installed right now.

 

[Stephonovich]

Well, repeat that, except you'll be using apt-get rather than emerge. Same basic idea, just different syntax.

Alternatively, you can probably find a website with a tarball of the drivers.

 

[MarcusH]

@stepHonovich [edit: sry for typing your nick the wrong way *g*]

lol, no you don't have to download 100+ packages - that would be a true overkill. There's a big .tar.gz file (IIRC or maybe .tar.bz2, whatever) you can download and you'll have all the sources+patches. I thought the same thing at first and was turned down - but a few lines further into the book they relieve you of this hassle

And don't get me wrong, I didn't want to criticize Gentoo in any way - just that I don't think it's appropiate for him in the first place. Same applies to LFS - therefore I recommended, as some others, Ubuntu as a starter distro.

@Skipinder

IMHO it's a good thing that Ubuntu is an easy entry and I don't think it takes all the fun. On the contrary, a too "difficult" distro will kill all the initial enthusiasm - coming from windows most will probably need a gentle intro to linux before they even begin to think about this whole "./configure && make && make install"-thingie or even about compiling your own kernel. That's just natural - getting your drivers license doesn't imply that you can drive like an indy-car champion. With Ubuntu (or any other starter distro for that matter) you'll be gently introduced to Linux, and the wonderfull thing is, that you can advance your skills as fast or as slow as you want. You can either remain with something that is - nowadays - quite close to the Windows-feeling or you can dive into a whole new experience, step by step, including editing, tweaking, configuring, compiling, etc. just about everything to suit your own needs. Your choice, Neo ....
I agree that *bsd is a good choice - especially OpenBSD for homemade "routers" and the like, but I think Linux is better suited in his case.

 

[Stephonovich]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarcusH @stepHonovich [edit: sry for typing your nick the wrong way *g*] lol, no you don't have to download 100+ packages - that would be a true overkill. There's a big .tar.gz file (IIRC or maybe .tar.bz2, whatever) you can download and you'll have all the sources+patches. I thought the same thing at first and was turned down - but a few lines further into the book they relieve you of this hassle And don't get me wrong, I didn't want to criticize Gentoo in any way - just that I don't think it's appropiate for him in the first place. Same applies to LFS - therefore I recommended, as some others, Ubuntu as a starter distro.

Oh, really? I must have missed it. In that case, the only appreciable difference would be support (/me loves Gentoo Forums...) and a package manager. Although the support would be offset by the increased learning from building it yourself.

If he's going for a GUI-fied distro, I'd say Debian, if only because it allows for lots of control when you're ready. If I didn't have Gentoo, I'd use Debian. It's quite nice.

 

[HPuser9083]

I recommend Arch, but technically, all Linux distros but RHEL, of which free clones exist in the form of CentOS and SL, or SLES/SLED, are free, so all bets are off on what distro you can run, pretty much.

 

[HPuser9083]

Well, repeat that, except you'll be using apt-get rather than emerge. Same basic idea, just different syntax.

Actually, it's different, APT, like YUM, Entropy, Pacman, and ZYPper, is binary-based, and uses pre-compiled binaries, Portage/Emerge is source-based and compiles from source.

 

[Stephonovich]

Holy old post, Batman!  That was a decade ago!

To answer your reply, yeah, it is different.  That's why I said "same basic idea." 

 

[SomeWiseGuy]

Nobody mentioned Linux Mint?
http://www.linuxmint.com/
 
Linux Mint ranks number one on DistroWatch.
http://distrowatch.com/
 
Opps, just realized this is an old thread.