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Originally Posted by John_M /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I'm not "trolling." I was accused of the same thing on the thread querying the importance of amps, where I dared to suggest that they weren't in fact especially important at all. I know it's off topic on this thread but the other one got closed down before I got a chance to reply to some of the posts. FYI I did not agree with the way the other guy, vai77, went off on one in that thread and I certainly don't agree with his view that you can hear a difference between CD files and lossless audio files.
My point is that I find it surprising, to say the least, that so many people on here take it as given that amps have a large impact on sound quality, when both measurements and double-blind tests suggest that they have little if any impact. Maybe it's because I'm quite new to the forum and don't really have a sense of the prevailing "orthodoxies" on here. I was also extremely surprised to hear people suggest that subjective listening experience was a better guide to whether or not there is a difference between amps than either measuring instruments or DBTs. Given the prevalence of what I'd describe as "strange" claims, I can't help but feel that people in the audio industry may have been spreading views which they know full well to be false (not necessarily on this forum).
Of course, if everyone here is quite happy to go out and buy their uber-expensive amps, and feels that these amps really do make a difference, then fine. It's really none of my business. But this is a large forum and unsuspecting people coming on here will use it as a source of information - I think that brings a responsibility to show at least a semblance of balance in what's posted. EG not making spurious claims like "everyone in the know believes amps make a massive difference" - as I understand, the majority of people with relevant technical expertise most certainly do not believe this.
FYI even a cynic like me makes some concession to the placebo effect. I found a double-blind test which proved (listening on Sennheiser Orpheus) that even the most sophisticated listeners couldn't tell CD from 256kbps MP3. But I rip to lossless anyway - just in case!
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I think you are too quick to imply that audio is NOT a subjective experience. Personally, I find that statement to be false (from my experience). Enjoying audio has a lot to do both with the technical aspects, and the state of mind. What you might call placebo (and we'll never really know whether or not it's placebo, since there may be other factors involved), might be a minute difference, which to one person, will be all the difference that is required to upgrade.
I also believe in the theory that high-end audio is a bit like a tree. The closer you get to really high-end audio, the less deviation and varying opinions there will be from the state which we call "audiophile sound". Everyone may have their own tiny preferences, but everyone will at least be able to agree on what the audiophile sound is supposed to be. The implication of this, is that "audiophile sound" is a creation by the audiophile community -- people that care a lot about their sound. There is no absolute sound that dictates this -- rather, it's a congregation of what many people with experience think to be the true sound. What we tend to label as crappy sound and what is pushed by the mass market, is simply the sound that is agreed upon by the mass market to be good, where this mass market consists of people that don't care about their audio, show no devotion to the hobby, and will take whatever they can get. To them, it's good sound, but their opinions are (from my perspective) worthless in the audiophile community, since they do not share the same level of interest as we do. My outlook is an elitist outlook, however, I do not think that it is invalid, as in any field, those that are heavily involved know best.
Of course, this does not mean that we should accept things uncritically, however, I think personal anecdotal evidence is very important to the way people personally enjoy their audio. If this evidence consists of blind tests, then so be it. My evidence consists of switching components, and that's what I need to convince myself of a difference. If I have any doubts, I will keep on doing it until I either quell my doubts, or dismiss it as a fluke. If you were to ask me today which components I felt were worth the money, and which I felt were not, I could tell you exactly which ones were (and there are components on both sides). I'm not one to tell everyone that everything I have is the best in order to make myself feel better about it.
